[ih] Anyone have a copy of IEN-33?

[Jack Haverty]

Joe,

There were apparently lots of materials kept in computer files, such as 
the <internet-notebook> directory Jon's notes mention.  Did ISI keep 
backups on magtape?   If so, those old directories may still be 
recoverable and may contain historical records.

MIT kept backup tapes back from the 1970s and recently (last ten years 
or so) made them available to researchers and/or their original owners.  
Lars and the ITS-Hackers group have made good use of the MIT tapes to 
resurrect ancient PDP-10 code and actually get it running again.

If ISI and/or SRI similarly kept backup tapes from half-a-century ago, 
they might be a useful resource for historians.   ISIA was where many 
ARPA people had their mailboxes; SRI had all of the NIC materials.

But we still have the problem of where to put such stuff for "perpetual" 
archival storage.....

Jack

On 1/29/25 20:16, touch at strayalpha.com wrote:
> Hi, all,
>
> I had them scanned for the USC/ISI Postel Center (when such a thing 
> existed; its website has bit-rot).
>
> #33 has been missing as long as I have been looking (roughly early 
> 1990s) in every compilation I have checked. If anyone has it, please 
> let me know.
>
> For #9, 125, and 126, I have text but the paper could not be scanned 
> at the time (I don’t recall why - might have had severe contrast 
> issues). If anyone has a scan of those, please let me know.
>
> I will be re-posting my archive of these at my website 
> (strayalpha.com) shortly.
>
> Joe
>
> —
> Dr. Joe Touch, temporal epistemologist
> www.strayalpha.com
>
>> On Jan 29, 2025, at 5:02 PM, Vint Cerf via Internet-history 
>> <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>>
>> thanks Jack - little was kept at ARPA except for ARPA Orders.
>> I don't have the IENs - stupid me for not collecting them all 
>> religiously.
>>
>> v
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 29, 2025 at 7:57 PM Jack Haverty via Internet-history <
>> internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>>
>>> My book of IENs, collected as they were issued, is also missing IEN 33.
>>> Have you seen any evidence that IEN 33 was ever actually released as an
>>> IEN?   I know there were some RFCs and/or IENs that were assigned
>>> numbers but never actually produced.   I authored one RFC in the 700s
>>> myself but never actually wrote it.
>>>
>>> I DO have a copy of "TCP Meeting Notes" sent by Jon Postel to the email
>>> address [ISIE]<Postel>TCP-INTERNET.List   It documents the meeting of
>>> 15-16 June 1978 held at MIT.  There's no indication that it was also
>>> released as an IEN.   The email does say that the file is (was)
>>> available online at <internet-notebook>TCP-MEETING-NOTES.TXT at ISIE.
>>>
>>> It looks like the typical meeting report of the time, containing a
>>> record of Vint's goals for the meeting, followed by status reports from
>>> each contractor.
>>>
>>> Among Vint's goals: "The format of the TCP and INTERNET headers is to be
>>> firmly decided at this meeting", "The schedule for implementation of
>>> version 4 is to be established.", "The schedule for Telnet and FTP
>>> running on TCP is to be established.", and "the whole ARPANET community
>>> should expect to move to using TCP".
>>>
>>> So the planning for the eventual 1/1/1983 Flag Day started sometime
>>> before June 1978.
>>>
>>> Vint's introduction was followed by discussions of various topics, and
>>> even some votes:
>>>
>>> "Shall the Port be part of the Internet Header?"
>>> Result: NO.
>>> "Shall the Port be part of the TCP Header?"
>>> Result: NO.
>>>
>>> The process of evolving from TCP 2 to TCP 4 resembled sausage
>>> making....achieving consensus wasn't easy.
>>>
>>> I also have the notes I took at the meeting.  Big meetings happened
>>> quarterly, so it seems unlikely that there was a meeting in mid-June
>>> following one only 6 weeks earlier.  Perhaps the May 1-2 meeting was
>>> cancelled and rescheduled into mid June?
>>>
>>> Jack
>>>
>>> PS - I don't recall anything being kept "at ARPA"; most stuff was kept
>>> at contractors' sites, often SRI or ISI.
>>>
>>> On 1/29/25 14:25, Noel Chiappa via Internet-history wrote:
>>>> The IEN repository at the RFC Editor is missing this one; I ask because
>>> the
>>>> IEN's for the minutes of the meetings are all there, except this one.
>>>> (Bennett, "Internet Meeting Notes - 1&2 May 1978). Not super-important
>>>> (compared to say, the email archive of the TCP/IP email list at the 
>>>> time,
>>>> which I think was at DARPA - but maybe at a contractor), but it 
>>>> would be
>>> nice
>>>> to have.
>>>>
>>>> Oh, I've found some evidence that I wasn't the only one who called that
>>> group
>>>> the 'Internet Working Group' (r.e. my original query); I don't remember
>>> all
>>>> the instances I've seen, but IEN-60 is entitled "Boston Area Meeting of
>>> the
>>>> Internet Working Group to Discuss Interactions With Gateways".
>>>>
>>>>      Noel
>>>>
>>>> PS: Craig's email reminds me of another password story. Proteon put a
>>> field
>>>> service password in the Proteon routers. So Milo gets the load, and
>>> thinks
>>>> 'Gee, I should try running 'strings' on this'; he does so, and see 
>>>> an odd
>>>> string (near the 'Password:' prompt, IIRC). He tries it, and it 
>>>> lets him
>>> in.
>>>> He complains. So in the _next_ release, he runs 'strings' over it, and
>>> sees
>>>> the string 'Sorry Milo, it's not so easy this time!'
>>>
>>> --
>>> Internet-history mailing list
>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
>>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to:
>> Vint Cerf
>> Google, LLC
>> 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor
>> Reston, VA 20190
>> +1 (571) 213 1346
>>
>>
>> until further notice
>> -- 
>> Internet-history mailing list
>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
>

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