[ih] Internet-history Digest, Vol 2, Issue 16

Barbara Denny via Internet-history internet-history at elists.isoc.org
Thu Nov 7 11:51:23 PST 2019 

 There is also a chance this was documented in the Packet Radio progress reports.  The Defense Technical Information Center website did seem to have some Packet Radio reports when I tried to find more information on the August test date.  The listing wasn't well organized so I couldn't quickly check for the existence of a specific report. I also am not sure how much is visible to me.  Some academic institutions seem to have full access.
barbara

    On Thursday, November 7, 2019, 10:48:14 AM PST, Vint Cerf via Internet-history <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:  
 
 Geoff, thanks - this is excellent background - and I agree testing would
have preceded the Rosatti event.

v


On Thu, Nov 7, 2019 at 12:11 AM the keyboard of geoff goodfellow <
geoff at iconia.com> wrote:

> vint, the path for yours truly's Packet radio connection would be the
> Datamedia CRT terminal connected to an LSI-11 (host Fernwood) connected to
> the Collins Packet Radio in your truly's office in the SRI Building K2079
> machine room to the SRI-C3P0 (or SRI-R2D2) PDP-11 gateway resident in the
> building 'cross the parking lot which was plugged (via 1822) into one of
> the SRI IMPs to which the SRI-KA PDP-10 Tenex was plugged into, viz.:
>
> excerpted from https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/rfc752/?include_text=1:
>
> HOST SRI-C3PO,          3/51,USER,ELF,PDP11,[PKT40,C3PO] ; What about
> Darth Vader?
> HOST SRI-KA,            0/51,SERVER,TENEX,PDP10,[SRI-TENEX,KA]
> HOST SRI-KL,
>  1/2,SERVER,TOPS-20,PDP10,[SRI,NIC,KL,AIC,SRI-AI,SRI-TWENEX]
> HOST SRI-NSC11,        3/2,USER,ELF,PDP11,[NSC11]
> HOST SRI-R2D2,          1/51,USER,ELF,PDP11,[PKT34,R2D2] ; or the princess?
> HOST SRI-TSC,          0/2,USER,ELF,PDP11,[ARC,ARC-RD]
> HOST SRI-UNIX,          2/51,SERVER,UNIX,PDP11,[THX-1145]
> HOST SRI-VIS11,        2/2,USER,ELF,PDP11,[VIS11,SRI-CBC11,CBC11]
>
>
> to get the dates for when these tests were done, generally it was done
> when *Mary Hartman, Mary Hartman <https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0074021/>*
> was airing in its 1976-177 run (sorry, can't remember The Exact Episodes --
> as mentioned Bill Plummer and yours truly stopped the debugging sessions to
> watch each night :D)
>
> perhaps you could rope Jim Mathis (author of the LSI-11 terminal client sw
> in) or Ron Kunzelman or Keith Klemba in here (since The AWESOME Don Cone is
> no longer with us on this plane)?
>
> yours truly believes these tests were first done with the BCPL TCP/IP
> server logged in sw with the Tenex ICP and PTY's code that Bill Plummer
> wrote (and brought up for us) prior to the Macro-10 (PDP-10 Assembly
> Language) TCP/IP in the Tenex monitor (kernal) that was then fully
> distributed to all.
>
> believe the BCPL TCP/UP server logged in sw was first written/installed by
> Bill Plummer on BBNB (BBN-TenexB) and then brought up on SRI (which is why
> yours truly had one of those Collins Packet Radio's and an LSI-11 in yours
> truly's office at SRI :D).
>
> wouldn't it be logical to assume this Internet testing from PRNET to
> ARPANET would have been tried/accomplished before the Rosotti's foray?
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 5, 2019 at 11:43 PM Vint Cerf <vint at google.com> wrote:
>
>> geoff,
>> thanks -by the way it's Plummer not Plumber.
>>
>> The first two network test that I knew about was the famous PRNET to
>> ARPANET transfer from Rosotti's in 1976 - when were your tests done and
>> what exactly was the path. There would have to have been a TCP (or
>> IP)-aware gateway from PRNET into ARPANET to qualify as an Internet test.
>>
>> v
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2019 at 6:47 PM the keyboard of geoff goodfellow <
>> geoff at iconia.com> wrote:
>>
>>> vint, as best yours truly can recall, prior to TCP being integrated into
>>> the Tenex monitor, there were several BCPL user level programs written by
>>> Bill Plumber at BBN that used a (new at the time) ICP mechanism to
>>> communicate between them.
>>>
>>> there were four programs (TCP, Sink, ECHO O, and a telnet server that
>>> used PTY's -- rather than NVT's) to support remote user logins.  There was
>>> also a TCP User Telnet program that allows outward TCP telneting ICP'ng to
>>> the user TCP program.
>>>
>>> each of these programs (TCP, Sink, ECHO O, and a telnet server that used
>>> PTY's) were auto started at system boot time by using SYSJOB's "CRJOB"
>>> mechanism to log each of them in "DETACHED" under WHEEL'd user TCP.
>>>
>>> Bill Plumber then later came out to SRI to install either this user TCP
>>> stuff (and the ICP and PTY monitor code) or later when TCP was integrated
>>> into the monitor (in PDP-10 Macro Assembly Language) on what was originally
>>> SRI-AI, then SRI-KA, then DARCOM-KA (where the NSW [National Software
>>> Works] also ran).
>>>
>>> as part of this installation and debugging process we would summarily
>>> stop this work each night to watch the latest episode of *Mary Hartman,
>>> Mary Hartman* on a portable TV yours truly brought in...
>>>
>>> as you may recall, yours truly had one of the Collins Packet Radio's
>>> with the LSI-11 (hostname Fernwood) attached to it in yours truly's office
>>> at the time which would look out at the PRNet antenna mast across the SRI
>>> parking lot to the building where the SRI-C3P0 and SRI-R2D2 Gateway PDP-11
>>> resided.
>>>
>>> yours truly believes that the SRI Bay Area PRNet LSI-11 to Tenex Host
>>> communications first occurred using Bill Plumbers Tenex User level BCPL TCP
>>> stuff before any USC-ISI (Tenex Monitor integrated TCP) was done.
>>>
>>> unfortunately, neither Bill Plumber or Ray Tomlinson are around
>>> to corroborate/chime in on this, so maybe Dan Lynch, Jim Mathis (or even
>>> Ron Kunzelman, Keith Klemba, Don Cone could), but don't know if they are on
>>> the Internet-History list or not (but clearly should be)...
>>>
>>> ah, those were The Fun Days... :-)
>>>
>>> From: the tty of Geoffrey S. Goodfellow
>>> GEOFF at SRI-AI
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2019 at 12:54 PM Vint Cerf <vint at google.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> July (or at least summer?) 1976 between the Packet Radio network mobile
>>>> host (LSI-11) and probably a host at USC-ISI on the ARPANET. Nov 22, 1977
>>>> was the first 3 net test, adding the Packet Satellite Network
>>>>
>>>> vint
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2019 at 5:38 PM Joly MacFie <joly at punkcast.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Party pooper!
>>>>>
>>>>> When was the first actual inter-network message sent using packet
>>>>> technology?
>>>>>
>>>>> Joly MacFie
>>>>> 218 565 9365 <(218)%20565-9365>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2019, 5:13 PM Jay Hauben <hauben at columbia.edu> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 50 years ago the first data was sent between two ARPANET IMPS. The
>>>>>> ARPANET was a forerunner of the Internet but was not itself an internet. It
>>>>>> was a single network not an internetwork.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Take care.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jay
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2019 at 3:00 PM <
>>>>>> internet-history-request at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Send Internet-history mailing list submissions to
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>>>>>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Today's Topics:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>    1. WEBCAST TODAY: 50 Years Later, Looking Back at the Internet?s
>>>>>>>      Birth / Celebrando el aniversario 50 de Internet (Joly MacFie)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Message: 1
>>>>>>> Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2019 06:08:33 -0500
>>>>>>> From: Joly MacFie <joly at punkcast.com>
>>>>>>> To: internet-history at elists.isoc.org
>>>>>>> Subject: [ih] WEBCAST TODAY: 50 Years Later, Looking Back at the
>>>>>>>        Internet?s Birth / Celebrando el aniversario 50 de Internet
>>>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>>>>        <CAM9VJk1mZZxMaKJV0y0yRphpHt+o-k8B=
>>>>>>> xdhoWcYf2GojKY6kA at mail.gmail.com>
>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A brief follow up to last week's major do
>>>>>>> <https://livestream.com/internetsociety/internet50> in LA, with a
>>>>>>> latin
>>>>>>> flavor.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ISOC Live posted: "On Tuesday 5 November at 17:00 UTC (12:00 EST)
>>>>>>> LACNIC
>>>>>>> will commemorate the 50th anniversary of the first packet sent over
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> Internet with a webinar: 50 Years Later, Looking Back at the
>>>>>>> Internet's
>>>>>>> Birth. LACNIC's special guests will be three of the engin"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On *Tuesday 5 November* at *17:00 UTC* (12:00 EST) LACNIC will
>>>>>>> commemorate
>>>>>>> the 50th anniversary of the first packet sent over the Internet with
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>> webinar: *50 Years Later, Looking Back at the Internet's Birth*.
>>>>>>> LACNIC's
>>>>>>> special guests will be three of the engineers behind that
>>>>>>> achievement: *Leonard
>>>>>>> Kleinrock*, *Charles Kline*, and *Steve Crocker*. The webinar will be
>>>>>>> simulcast, in both English and Spanish, on the *Internet Society
>>>>>>> Livestream
>>>>>>> Channels <https://isoc.live/>*.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *VIEW ON LIVESTREAM:
>>>>>>> http://livestream.com/internetsociety/internet50lacnic
>>>>>>> <http://livestream.com/internetsociety/internet50lacnic> (ENGLISH)
>>>>>>> VIEW ON
>>>>>>> USTREAM: https://video.ibm.com/channel/DKWsjfRLtPe
>>>>>>> <https://video.ibm.com/channel/DKWsjfRLtPe> (ENGLISH)*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> El *martes 5 de noviembre* a las *17:00 UTC* (12:00 EST), LACNIC
>>>>>>> conmemorar? el 50 aniversario del primer paquete enviado por
>>>>>>> Internet con
>>>>>>> un webinar: *Celebrando el aniversario 50 de Internet*. Los invitados
>>>>>>> especiales de LACNIC ser?n tres de los ingenieros detr?s de ese
>>>>>>> logro: *Leonard
>>>>>>> Kleinrock*, *Charles Kline* y *Steve Crocker*. El webinar se
>>>>>>> transmitir?
>>>>>>> simult?neamente, en ingl?s y espa?ol, en los canales de* Internet
>>>>>>> Society
>>>>>>> Livestream <https://isoc.live/>*.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *VIEW ON LIVESTREAM:
>>>>>>> http://livestream.com/internetsociety2/internet50lacnic
>>>>>>> <http://livestream.com/internetsociety2/internet50lacnic> (ESPA?OL)*
>>>>>>> *VIEW ON USTREAM: https://video.ibm.com/channel/wJD3jzyMV7X
>>>>>>> <https://video.ibm.com/channel/wJD3jzyMV7X> (ESPA?OL)*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *INFO: http://bit.ly/webinarInternet50 <
>>>>>>> http://bit.ly/webinarInternet50>*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *TWITTER: @LACNIC #Internet50 <http://bit.ly/34A3ijl>*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Permalink*
>>>>>>> https://isoc.live/11483/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>> Joly MacFie  218 565 9365 <(218)%20565-9365> Skype:punkcast
>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>> -
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Subject: Digest Footer
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> End of Internet-history Digest, Vol 2, Issue 16
>>>>>>> ***********************************************
>>>>>>>
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>>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Geoff.Goodfellow at iconia.com
>>> living as The Truth is True
>>> http://geoff.livejournal.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> New postal address:
>> Google
>> 1875 Explorer Street, 10th Floor
>> Reston, VA 20190
>>
>
>
> --
> Geoff.Goodfellow at iconia.com
> living as The Truth is True
> http://geoff.livejournal.com
>
>
>

-- 
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