[Chapter-delegates] ITU, ICANN and Internet Governance

Mon Oct 11 12:44:22 PDT 2010

Dear Alejandro,

On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 12:41 AM, Alejandro Pisanty <apisan at servidor.unam.mx
> wrote:

> Siva,
>
> I think Grigori points further out to a flaw in your original argument,
> which many of us have chosen not to comment yet.
>
> The political agendas of many governments who want the ITU to have an upper
> hand in Internet Governance, and the IGF to be a forum to legitimize
> government intervention and control ever further, are not determined by the
> telcos. They are purely politically motivated.
>

Thanks for your comments again.

So it is convenient for Governments to use the ITU forum where they
willingly work together with Telecoms, understandably with an unseen upper
hand over the business members, to achieve political control over all
communications ?  What I wrote was on the aspects of the Telecoms taking
commercial advantage of the union. It is more true that many Governments
take political advantage of the union.

In the brief paragraph on the ITU game plan on Security I said that the ITU
Security agenda suits both the Governments and business members. I should
have said this in the broader context - the union is mutual.

Even if brings mutual benefits, the call for separation is valid. What you
call the flaw is that the article does not indicate that the Governments are
quite comfortable in the ITU setting ?

This union is not required. It is not right. Sooner or later financial power
will prevail over political power (it already prevails to a large extent)
and Government policies will be more to the comfort of the Telecom
businesses.

I agree that it is a complex relationship, not just a relationship of
business taking undue advantage of inner proximity to Government.

Sivasubramanian M

>
> You do mention that telcos, carriers, and ISPs and equipment providers are
> providing capacities which governments and other powers want (DPI comes to
> mind, as does traceback.)
>
> Your fellow countryman Pavan Duggal famously said in the 2008 IGF in
> Hyderabad, "governments like to listen; electronic interception is the norm
> of the day."
>
> The full quote is "Another historical aspect that we need to consider is
> the fact that in these parts of the world, governments like to listen.  If
> governments want to listen, electronic interception is the norm of the day."
> Find it in
> http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/hyderabad_prog/Open%20Dialogue.html
>
> Lots going on in the world (including the US) revolves around these
> intentions. There is a lot of forum shopping in search of legitimation. The
> ITU environment does have some traditions with which it may resonate.
>
> Yours,
>
>
> Alejandro Pisanty
>
> .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  . .  .  .  .  .  .
>     Dr. Alejandro Pisanty
> UNAM, Av. Universidad 3000, 04510 Mexico DF Mexico
>
> Tels. +52-(1)-55-5105-6044, +52-(1)-55-5418-3732
>
> * Mi blog/My blog: http://pisanty.blogspot.com
> * LinkedIn profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/pisanty
> * Twitter: http://twitter.com/apisanty
> * Unete al grupo UNAM en LinkedIn,
> http://www.linkedin.com/e/gis/22285/4A106C0C8614
>
> * Ven a ISOC Mexico, http://www.isoc.org.mx, ISOC http://www.isoc.org
> *Participa en ICANN, http://www.icann.org
> .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
>  .
>
>
> On Tue, 12 Oct 2010, Sivasubramanian M wrote:
>
>  Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2010 00:30:17 +0530
>>
>> From: Sivasubramanian M <isolatedn at gmail.com>
>> To: Grigori Saghyan <gregor at arminco.com>
>> Cc: chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org
>> Subject: Re: [Chapter-delegates] ITU, ICANN and Internet Governance
>>
>>
>> Dear Grigori Saghyan
>>
>> Thank you for your comments.
>>
>> Your observation about the main focus of some countries is a very valid
>> observation.  Telecoms have, wittingly or unwittingly, signed into
>> Government policies, and in some countries they work closely with
>> Governments.  It is difficult for them to protest or resist Government
>> directives, for e.g a public or secret directive to enable easy wire
>> tapping
>> or decryption. Some submit to content regulation policies willingly and
>> easily, while most others find it hard to challenge them.
>>
>>
>> Sivasubramanian M
>> http://turiya.co.in
>>
>> http://www.isocmadras.com
>> facebook: http://is.gd/x8Sh
>> LinkedIn: http://is.gd/x8U6
>> Twitter: http://is.gd/x8Vz
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 11, 2010 at 10:53 PM, Grigori Saghyan <gregor at arminco.com
>> >wrote:
>>
>>   Dear Mr. Sivasubramanianm
>>> very interesting article, but I think the main focus of Russia, China,
>>> Iran, Syria is not the business case. Content regulation is  the keyword.
>>> Telecoms in general   are
>>> content  indifferent, but I agree, that in order to keep their position
>>> on
>>> the market they are ready to support any government initiative.
>>> Grigori Saghyan
>>> ISOC.AM
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 09.10.2010 22:11, Sivasubramanian M wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello
>>>
>>>  At Guadalajara, Mexico this week, in the policy debate kicked off by the
>>> ITU, Russian Federation's Minister of Communications proposed that the
>>> ITU
>>> should give itself veto power over ICANN decisions. This proposal by the
>>> Regional Commonwealth in the field of Communications (RCC) calls for the
>>> ICANN Governmental Advisory Committee (GAC) to be scrapped and replaced
>>> by
>>> an ITU group.
>>>
>>>  I wrote an article about it, on CircleID
>>>
>>> http://www.circleid.com/posts/on_the_need_to_separate_the_telecom_business_agenda_from_government_policy/
>>>
>>>  May I request your comments on this?
>>>
>>> Sivasubramanian M
>>> http://turiya.co.in
>>>
>>> http://www.isocmadras.com
>>> facebook: http://is.gd/x8Sh
>>> LinkedIn: http://is.gd/x8U6
>>> Twitter: http://is.gd/x8Vz
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
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>>
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