[ih] IETF relevance (was Memories of Flag Day?)

[Michael Thomas]

On 8/28/23 7:26 PM, Dave Crocker via Internet-history wrote:
> On 8/28/2023 6:59 PM, John Levine wrote:
>> One could argue that DKIM originated in the IETF. It had two
>> predecessors, DomainKeys and IIM. The development process more or less
>> involved adding the bad ideas from IIM into DomainKeys, then taking
>> them back out.
>
> Nope. Not even close.
>
> On two counts. First, DKIM really is a small evolution of DomainKeys, 
> which itself had two versions fielded by Yahoo.  The IIM influence 
> was, really, pretty minor. (I'm being kinder than you, but that 
> doesn't mean I disagree about its influence.)

IIM had the first draft submitted and was deployed before we submitted 
it. I checked with Mark and it's still not clear who deployed first. 
This is revisionist history. DK and IIM were developed independently. It 
was Harald that found out that we were both working on essentially the 
same thing at the same time. It was a merger with us concerned about 
enterprise considerations and Yahoo concerned about service provider 
considerations. Your belittling of our contribution shows your agenda 
and is insulting. There were minor influences, but it wasn't us. I take 
solace with Where Wizards Stay Up Late.


>
> Second, and even more importantly, the ad hoc, private cabal we were 
> part of, that did the evolution from DomainKeys to DKIM ,was 
> explicitly outside of the IETF.  And that was at the IETF's request.
You were not part of the "private cabal". I was the one who decided that 
DNSSec wasn't worth fighting about. I was wrong as it turns out. DNSSec 
deployment has been a disaster. DK got that completely wrong. I hosted 
the meeting where the two drafts were merged at my house in San 
Francisco. You weren't there.

Mike