[ih] Nit-picking an origin story
Joly MacFie
joly at punkcast.com
Sun Aug 17 11:50:44 PDT 2025
Well, BP powers the nascent Solar System Internet, which is, I think, a
thing
Joly
On Sun, Aug 17, 2025 at 2:34 PM Lori Emerson <lori.emerson at gmail.com> wrote:
> I believe so! But I defer to others on this thread.
>
> (I neglected to mention that my other constraint for this iteration of
> Other Networks was that it couldn’t include protocols…in my fantasy world,
> Other Networks 2 is largely organized by protocol, including ethernet.)
>
> --
>
>
>
> *“I use technology in order to hate it properly.” — Nam June Paik “**[Intellectuals]
> don’t travel, they move about in order to go talk…They go from one place
> where they talk in order to go to another place where they are going to
> talk even during meals, they talk with the local intellectuals. They never
> stop talking, and I can’t stand talking, talking, talking, I can’t stand
> it.” **—Gilles Deleuze*
>
>
>
> Lori Emerson | KF0LCB | she/her/they/them
> Full Professor | Associate Chair Graduate Studies | Director, Media
> Archaeology Lab
> Media Studies Department | University Colorado Boulder
> Traditional territories of the Arapaho, Cheyenne, and Ute Nations
> *Other Networks: A Radical Technology Sourcebook
> <https://shop.mexicansummer.com/merch/495898-lori-emerson-other-networks-a-radical-technology-sourcebook>*
> *Mastodon <https://post.lurk.org/@loriemerson>* | *Bluesky
> <https://bsky.app/profile/loriemerson.net>* | *loriemerson.net
> <http://loriemerson.net/>* | *mediaarchaeologylab.com
> <http://mediaarchaeologylab.com/>*
> *From: *Joly MacFie <joly at punkcast.com>
> *Date: *Sunday, August 17, 2025 at 12:21 PM
> *To: *Lori Emerson <lori.emerson at gmail.com>
> *Cc: *Vint Cerf <vint at google.com>, Brian E Carpenter <
> brian.e.carpenter at gmail.com>, internet-history at elists.isoc.org <
> internet-history at elists.isoc.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [ih] Nit-picking an origin story
>
> I am limited technically but my understanding is the Bundle Protocol falls
> into the "not TCP/IP" category. Correct?
>
> Joly
>
>
>
> On Sun, Aug 17, 2025 at 1:42 PM Lori Emerson <lori.emerson at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> Thank you for looping me in to one of my favorite topics and thanks too,
> Joly, for sharing the TOC for my book! All those nets Vint mentioned are
> great “other networks,” as I call them. Sadly I had to come up with
> somewhat arbitrary constraints for my book, otherwise the publisher would
> have lost their mind with the size of the manuscript; I’m still hoping I’ll
> have a chance to write at least a second volume. I could also talk for a
> long time about the arbitrariness of all taxonomies but I won’t bore you.
> Anyways, a couple of the constraints was that the networks had to ideally
> exist outside of the internet and/or not run on TCP/IP (which I realize is
> a convenient fiction because it’s possible to run a net off the internet
> using TCP/IP…I know) and they had to be used for human communication (not
> tracking, for example). My goal was just to help us all remember the wild
> heterogeneity of all these networks that existed in the past, some of which
> were incredibly simple, fast, and efficient.
>
> I’m not sure what the original context of this thread was but hopefully
> this helps explain a bit what’s present and what’s missing in the list.
>
> yours, Lori
>
> --
>
>
>
> *“I use technology in order to hate it properly.” — Nam June Paik “**[Intellectuals]
> don’t travel, they move about in order to go talk…They go from one place
> where they talk in order to go to another place where they are going to
> talk even during meals, they talk with the local intellectuals. They never
> stop talking, and I can’t stand talking, talking, talking, I can’t stand
> it.” **—Gilles Deleuze*
>
>
>
> Lori Emerson | KF0LCB | she/her/they/them
> Full Professor | Associate Chair Graduate Studies | Director, Media
> Archaeology Lab
> Media Studies Department | University Colorado Boulder
> Traditional territories of the Arapaho, Cheyenne, and Ute Nations
> *Other Networks: A Radical Technology Sourcebook
> <https://shop.mexicansummer.com/merch/495898-lori-emerson-other-networks-a-radical-technology-sourcebook>*
> *Mastodon <https://post.lurk.org/@loriemerson>* | *Bluesky
> <https://bsky.app/profile/loriemerson.net>* | *loriemerson.net
> <http://loriemerson.net/>* | *mediaarchaeologylab.com
> <http://mediaarchaeologylab.com/>*
> *From: *Joly MacFie <joly at punkcast.com>
> *Date: *Sunday, August 17, 2025 at 5:27 AM
> *To: *Vint Cerf <vint at google.com>, Lori Emerson <lori.emerson at gmail.com>
> *Cc: *Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter at gmail.com>,
> internet-history at elists.isoc.org <internet-history at elists.isoc.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [ih] Nit-picking an origin story
>
> Looping in Lori Emerson, that she might reply directly.
>
> On Sun, Aug 17, 2025 at 6:30 AM Vint Cerf <vint at google.com> wrote:
>
> add Packet Satellite Network
> what about Ethernet?
> and the Deep Space Network?
>
> On Sun, Aug 17, 2025 at 12:49 AM Joly MacFie via Internet-history <
> internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>
> I feel compelled here to copy the Chapter list from Lori Emerson's '
> *Other
> Networks:A Radical Technology Sourcebook'
> <
> https://shop.mexicansummer.com/merch/495898-lori-emerson-other-networks-a-radical-technology-sourcebook
> >*
>
> *Sound Networks*
> [1] Drums
> [2] Whistling
>
> *Air Networks*
> [3] Fire or Smoke Signals
> [4] Pneumatic Tubes
> [5] Skywriting
>
> *Water Networks*
> [6] Hydraulic Semaphore
>
> *Optical Networks*
> [7] Flag Signaling
> [8] Optical Telegraph
> [9] Infrared Communication
> [10] Signal Lamp
> [11] Heliograph
> [12] Photophone
> [13] Ultraviolet Communication
> [14] Laser Communication
> [15] Visible Light Communication
>
> *Radio Networks*
> [16] Amateur Radio
> [16.1] Radiotelegraphy
> [16.2] Radioteletype
> [16.3] Amateur Television
> [16.4] Hellschreiber
> [16.5] Earth-Moon-Earth Communication
> [16.6] Amateur Radio Satellite
> [16.7] Amateur Packet Radio
> [17] Radio Broadcast
> [18] Pirate Radio
> [19] Radiofax
> [20] Two-Way Radio
> [21] Pager
> [22] Meteor Burst Communication
> [23] Slow Scan Television
> [24] Project West Ford
> [25] Pirate Television
> [26] Packet Radio Network
> [27] Microbroadcast
> [28] Software Defined Radio
> [29] Wi-Fi
> [30] Bluetooth
>
> *Microwave Networks*
> [31] Microwave Radio-Relay
> [32] Communications Satellite
>
> *Wired Networks:*
> *Electrical Wire Networks*
> [33] Electrical telegraph
> [33.1] Electrical Printing Telegraph
> [33.2] Image Telegraph
> [33.3] Fire Alarm Telegraph
> [33.4] Pantelegraph
> [33.5] Telephonic Telegraph
> [34] Telephone
> [35] Wired Radio
> [36] Telautograph
> [37] Telefacsimile
> [38] Videophone
> [39] Telex
>
> *Barbed Wire Networks*
> [40] Barbed Wire Telegraph
> [41] Fence Phones
>
> *Hybrid Networks:*
> [42] Library
> [43] Book
> [44] Postal System
> [44.1] Pigeon Post
> [44.2] Projectile Post
> [44.3] Balloon Mail
> [44.4] Pony Express
> [44.5] Airgraph and V-Mail
> [44.6] Email Letter
> [45] Sneakernet
> [46] Radio Broadcast Network
> [47] Broadcast Television
> [48] Cable Television
> [48.1] NABU
> [49] Cellular Network
> [50] Time-Sharing Network
> [51] Teletext
> [52] Videotex
>
> *Imaginary Networks:*
> [53] Necromancy
> [54] Pasilalinic-Sympathetic Compass
> [55] Telephonoscope
> [56] Telepathy
> [57] Ley Lines
> [58] Mundaneum
> [59] World Brain
> [60] Memex
> [61] Faster-Than-Light Communication Networks
> [62] Project Xanadu
> [63] Metaverse
> [64] The Clacks
> [65] Pandoran Neural Network
> [66] Cosmic Internet
>
>
>
> On Sat, Aug 16, 2025 at 11:01 PM Brian E Carpenter via Internet-history <
> internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>
> > Excellent list, Joe. To the pre-electric era, I'd add smoke signals and
> > alpenhorns, and I'm sure there were others in various cultures around the
> > world.
> >
> > I'd also insert Baudot and Murray after Morse. They brought in 5-bit
> > binary encoding instead of on/off encoding, and Murray invented both
> > multiplexing and CR/LF.
> >
> > Regards/Ngā mihi
> > Brian Carpenter
> >
> > On 17-Aug-25 12:40, touch--- via Internet-history wrote:
> > >
> > >> On Aug 16, 2025, at 5:15 PM, Dave Crocker via Internet-history <
> > internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> the scope of my original query was meant to be about much closer --
> and
> > possibly competitive or complementary -- milestones: automated, shared
> > (wide-area) digital communications.
> > >>
> > >> So, for example, telegraph signal/smoke fires, heliography and the
> like
> > play into the larger... picture.
> > >
> > > I included a history when I taught intro to networking.
> > >
> > > Couriers Spoken/written language (30,000 BC)
> > > Pigeons 2900 BC, Egypt
> > > Beacons 1200 BC, Troy
> > > Calling posts 400 BC, Persia
> > > Heliographs 400 BC, Greece
> > > Flags 400 BC, Greece
> > > Hooke semaphore 1680s (shutters and symbols)
> > > Chappe’s telegraph 1790s (arms) with time sync, collision
> management,
> > priority flow control, and error recovery
> > > Edelcrantz 1790s (just shutters, inspired by Chappe)
> > > Cooke/Wheatstone 1830s magnetic needles
> > > Morse 1830s electromagnetic relays
> > > Morse 1850s teleprinter (like a stock ticker)
> > > Bell 1870s phone
> > > Marconi 1890s RF
> > > Tube amps 1900s
> > > Transistor 1950s
> > > Laser 1950s
> > > Satellite 1960s
> > >
> > > As you note, the adjectives are the key, as with most superlatives.
> > >
> > > For "computer networking", I would say Sage is the first in the 1950s,
> > with SABRE (reportedly inspired by SAGE) and telephone switches (arguably
> > remote machine-machine) not far behind in the early 1960s, all AFAICT
> > predating ARPAnet.
> > >
> > > Joe
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > --
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> > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
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> >
>
>
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>
> --
> Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to:
> Vint Cerf
> Google, LLC
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>
> until further notice
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> --------------------------------------
> Joly MacFie +12185659365
> --------------------------------------
> -
>
>
>
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> Joly MacFie +12185659365
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