[Chapter-delegates] make simple things complex again!

[Winthrop Yu]

+1 Klaus, Christian and Johann ...

... money, reputation ... and privacy -- information on each and every member, 
the officers of each and every chapter, all emails/messages we may send, 
anything and everything on the new Fonteva platform is now in Salesforces' 
hands. Not exactly reassuring, is it?

WYn

On 16 Jan 2024 7:56 PM, Johan Helsingius via Chapter-delegates wrote:
> On 16/01/2024 11:38, Christian de Larrinaga via Chapter-delegates wrote:
>
>> But "Salesforce!" How much is this costing us?
>
> Both in money and reputation...
>
>     Julf
>
>> On 16 Jan 2024 6:38 PM, Christian de Larrinaga via Chapter-delegates wrote:
>>> I do admire Klaus for persevering and for his hope that maybe just maybe
>>> ISOC might one day enjoy a collaborative engagement process with its community.
>>>
>>> Something like "Open Source" and "Open Standards"? Or is that too much
>>> like asking this community to be eating its own "dog food"?
>>>
>>> But "Salesforce!" How much is this costing us?
>>>
>>> C
>>>
>>>
>>> Klaus Birkenbihl via Chapter-delegates<chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org>  writes:
>>>> Dear Akinbo,
>>>>
>>>> sorry if I hit you. It was not my intention to hurt somebody personally. But ...
>>>>
>>>> Adebunmi Akinbo wrote on 15.01.24 14:23:
>>>>
>>>>   Dear Klaus,
>>>>   Apologies. It's hoped that we will get it right or turn it round.
>>>>   Whatever arises, we are in the ship together.
>>>>
>>>>   I assumed it was me...and noticed we can always scale some fences. Thus, let's keep raising the issues and
>>>>   discus more to get it right.
>>>>
>>>>   We need you and everyone to share the challenges for a way forward.
>>>>
>>>> I may have a strange sense of humor. I may be old and peculiar. But I'm not crazy enough to get trapped by this.
>>>> Since 2011 many and I submitted requirements, change requests, design ideas for AMS. Of course I didn't expect
>>>> every proposal to be accepted. But what I expect if I spend effort and time is:
>>>>
>>>> 1 feedback: what happened to (not only mine) suggestions (accepted, future consideration, conflicting with
>>>>   architecture/plans ..., rejected because ...)
>>>> 2 transparency: how and why are decisions made
>>>> 3 a structured process for the management of change
>>>> 4 a tracking mechanism for issues
>>>> 5 auditability of results
>>>>
>>>> Usually what you get back is always the same song: "thanks for your input. There will be a new version within a few
>>>> weeks. Everything will be great!". And either nothing happens or with the new version things get even worse.
>>>> Just an example: many of us provided input to the big AMS questionnaire a few years ago. This questionnaire
>>>> should be an input to redesign of AMS. Did anybody ever see an evaluation? Even if the outcome (or the
>>>> questionnaire) was not too useful - a feedback to those who contributed is due. Btw.: Fontera somehow seems to
>>>> reflect what Salesforce thinks is an adequate solution rather than implementing Chapter/Members
>>>> requirements.
>>>>
>>>> So folks at ISOC staff: before asking for more co-operation, suggestions, input, and effort: please go back, read
>>>> what you got, do your homework.
>>>>
>>>> Thank you
>>>>
>>>> Klaus
>>>>
>>>>   Thanks for sharing.
>>>>
>>>>   - Akinbo.
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