[Chapter-delegates] Internet Society Accountability: a response to a message on the thread of making ISOC multi-stakeholder, with the subject line renamed.

Tue Apr 3 18:27:25 PDT 2018

On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 6:12 AM Susannah Gray <susannah.gray at gmail.com> wrote:

> On 03/04/2018 00:45, Sivasubramanian M wrote:
>
> Something happens every week that says "ISOC NY". Either it is an ISOC NY
> event or Joly's webcast of a useful event happening in NY or elsewhere.
> Someone mentioned about it by his own choice of  words -  "drives"-
> instead
> of saying  iISOC NY 'inspires', or 'draws attention to topics'.
>
> I have known ISOC NY for over 8 years, have met Joly once in person. There
> has never been even a hint of a suggestion from him or anyone from ISOC NY
> on what other Chapters should do;   Joly or anyone I knew from NY never
> assumed a posture of any form of leadership over any other Chapter. Despite
> its visibility ISOC NY has been a quiet Chapter.
>
> Why is there a discussion on ISOC NY now? Because someone used the word
> "drives" in referring to something about NY which is actually positive ?
>
> - Using the word 'drives' implies all sorts of things. I felt it important
> that what was meant by the use of this word be clarified, at the very least
> to ensure that Andrea's words were not misinterpreted. The NY chapter does
> fantastic work and there was never any debate around that from me.
>

+1 to what you said and +1 to ISOC Any

Sivasubramanian M

>
> Regards,
>
> Susannah
>
> --
> Susannah Gray
> President
> San Francisco Bay Area Internet Society Chapter
> www.sfbayisoc.org
>
>
>
> Sivasubramanian M
>
> On Tue, Apr 3, 2018, 7:06 AM JOHN MORE <morej1 at mac.com> wrote:
>
>> Collaboration is a core principal. Each Chapter has its own strengths
>> (and weaknesses). We are stronger together.
>>
>> John More
>>
>> On Apr 2, 2018, at 6:20 PM, Susannah Gray <susannah.gray at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Shuli,
>>
>> On 31/03/2018 11:29, Shuli Hallak wrote:
>>
>> Hm, that’s an interesting assessment of our chapter’s activity over the
>> past year, which I do not agree with, but this response is not about what
>> NY does.
>>
>> NY certainly does not drive the other chapters. i know we’ve looked to
>> other chapters for guidance. It’s been absolutely wonderful to meet with
>> and collaborate with other chapter leaders, Susannah included, in order to
>> strengthen the roles of the chapters and ISOC’s mission as a whole. In
>> fact, I truly believe that we can and should be working more closely
>> together with our colleagues here and around the world to share best
>> practices and increase our effectiveness and reach.
>>
>>  - Exactly: I do not believe that any one chapter is - or should be -
>> leading or driving the others nor should chapters be in competition with
>> each other.
>>
>> Our mission is important, and I look forward to working with all chapter
>> leaders to do our work the best we can.
>>
>> (please excuse any typos / errors, I’m typing one handed due to a broken
>> arm).
>>
>> - Yikes: get better soon!
>>
>> Susannah
>>
>> —
>> Susannah Gray
>> President
>> San Francisco Bay Area Internet Society Chapter
>> www.sfbayisoc.org
>>
>>
>>
>> Shuli
>>
>>
>> *— *
>> Shuli Hallak
>> *Executive Director*
>> Internet Society - New York Chapter
>> http://isoc-ny.org
>>
>> +1.917.891.1520 | shuli at isoc-ny.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mar 31, 2018, at 1:15 PM, Dave Burstein <daveb at dslprime.com> wrote:
>>
>> Folks
>>
>> Susannah was right to correct this. Andrea made a good faith mistake
>> saying ISOC-NY "drives the other chapters." She's new to the chapter this
>> year, and presumably assumed the *hopes talked abou*t in the New York
>> chapter in 2018 reflected actual accomplishments. I've been a board member
>> for several years; it just isn't so.
>>
>> Actually, until a few months ago, the New York chapter hadn't even had a
>> meeting in over a year. Under our previous chapter president, the chapter
>> was all but defunct. We hadn't had a major event in years and were down to
>> fewer than 20 active members. I don't remember more than one board meeting
>> per year. In 2017, we had only one or two board meetings (the minutes are
>> unclear) and no membership meetings.
>>
>> About the only visible things that were being done were Joly doing videos
>> and me writing to this list and speaking up at ISOC events. Avri was active
>> in the Chapters committee but didn't report to the local chapter and a few
>> people went to events with ISOC funding.
>>
>> I laughed when I heard the staff had given the NY Chapter an excellent
>> rating even though we weren't having meetings, elections, or doing very
>> much. Being friendly with a few staff people paid off.
>>
>> Joly couldn't have done the videos without regular pay from ISOC and
>> they received little support from the chapter if I remember correctly. I've
>> spoken up on ISOC issues because I tilt at many windmills, and received no
>> support from the chapter to do so. (In fact, I was told to be more positive
>> about ISOC, although my facts were almost never questioned.)
>>
>> In the last year, the funding for video went up; they are great ISOC pr.
>> That may have given the impression "New York" was doing a great deal but
>> actually that was ISOC central funding a dedicated video person, not a
>> chapter activity.
>>
>> People not active in the chapter put together an interesting project, NY
>> MESH. ISOC provided $20K and the chapter is now providing "fiscal agency"
>> for a fee. That's good.
>>
>>
>> ------------------
>>
>> Things started to improve when the previous president resigned and Joly
>> took over. A proposal to support Net Neutrality was pulled back in the name
>> of consensus when the acting President opposed the idea.
>>
>> The results so far are minimal but I hope that will change. In 2018,
>> we've had three board meetings that put forth many ideas. Google paid $20K
>> which funded two events.
>>
>> So I hope we'll actually lead in the future, but we haven't so far.
>>
>> Editor, http://Fastnet.news <http://fastnet.news/>
>> http://wirelessone.news http://massivemimo.rocks gfastnews.com
>> Author with Jennie Bourne  DSL (Wiley) and Web Video: Making It Great,
>> Getting It Noticed (Peachpit)
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 1:39 PM, Susannah Gray <susannah.gray at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Andrea,
>>>
>>> On 30/03/2018 07:59, Andrea Romaoli Garcia wrote:
>>>
>>> I don't feel the work hampered by the participation of others but a
>>> little bit control will be positive.
>>> The way ISOC is set up today allows a work oriented to local needs.
>>> I add that Chaptor NY has a greater responsibility and visibility
>>> because it drives the other chapters and brings new subjects to discuss for
>>> other instituitionscaround the world.
>>>
>>> - What do you mean by ISOC NY 'drives the other chapters'?
>>>
>>> Susannah
>>>
>>> -
>>> President
>>> San Francisco Bay Area Internet Society Chapter
>>> www.sfbayisoc.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> A little bit of control is needed but volunteers  input can identify new
>>> solutions  that the meetings routine extinguishes.
>>> I don't live in the United States but I've been serving shelters in
>>> Washington for volunteering...  Well... stakeholders and member must work
>>> together
>>> There are volunteers  and stakeholder with technical ability that is
>>> helpful. But I think we should control a hight level  to maintain the
>>> quality of the discussions and close the doors to those demagogues who do
>>> nothing but just wish put their name in the highlightner
>>>
>>> ANDRÉA ROMAOLI GARCIA
>>> OABSP 332.542
>>> Director ISOC-NY
>>> ICANN Latin American and Caribbean
>>> United Nations NY
>>> +55 14 99162-3774 <+55%2014%2099162-3774>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 30 Mar 2018, at 10:37, Sivasubramanian M <6.Internet at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> While ISOC has been successful, we do not know if the current structure
>>>> has contributed to that success, or if ISOC could have been more successful
>>>> if member-driven.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Agreed. We can not possibly deny that ICANN would be more successful
>>> nor assert that it would be less successful in a member-driven scenario.
>>> What I said was that it worked.
>>> 
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> While I agree with Dave completely, the reality is giving members
>>>> control is contrary to the founding documents and formal structure of
>>>> ISOC.  ISOC is not, and never has been, a community of members, or
>>>> democratic.  It is a Trust, organised around managing a perpetual flow of
>>>> income.  Members do not contribute to that income, and are therefore
>>>> powerless.  Article V.1 states “Individual members shall not have any
>>>> voting rights with respect to the Society.”
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The founding documents probably did not anticipate ISOC to take shape
>>> as a Community with several hundred 'volunteers' of good Technical and
>>> Policy expertise. ISOC unwittingly imparts the impression of a Community
>>> driven organization, and it is this perception that renders credibility to
>>> ISOC's policy advice.
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
>> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed
>> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
>> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed
>> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
>> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://p <https://portal.isoc.org>
>
>
>
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