[Chapter-delegates] Revised Chapter Agreement

Thu Aug 3 10:09:26 PDT 2017

Dear Joyce,
For french speaking chapters, it will not be easy to get comments from our
lawyer using English version.
I think it will be useful to have french version even if the
english version will be used as referential.

Best Regards

2017-08-03 16:50 GMT+00:00 Joyce Dogniez <dogniez at isoc.org>:

> HI Jorma, Hi all,
>
> Thank you all for the comments and thank you Jorma for the suggestion.
>
> While this clause is not a new one or revised one, we will be glad to work
> on improving its current wording to provide more clarity and less room for
> interpretation.
>
> Thanks again
>
> Kind regards
>
> Joyce
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Chapter-delegates <chapter-delegates-bounces at elists.isoc.org> on
> behalf of Jorma Mellin <jome at ficix.fi>
> Date: Thursday, 3 August 2017 at 09:21
> To: "chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org" <chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org
> >
> Subject: Re: [Chapter-delegates] Revised Chapter Agreement
>
> Hi all,
>
> The agreement will never reach a status where it is globally acceptable in
> all variances in chapters operations.
> At the end of the day, it is up to local authorities to decide how the
> wording should be understood.
>
> Major issues seems to be the "promoting in behalf of ISOC” and
> requirements for board members / office holders.
> Maybe we should re-phrase the wording to “promoting Internet development
> and governance according to principles
> set and jointly agreed by ISOC community, with local adaption of tools and
> methods”.
> This could give room to adjust the work to respect local laws / practises
> and take away the direct link between Chapter and ISOC office.
> Chapters work for the good of the Internet, not for the good of ISOC
> office.
>
> For board members / office holders and terms / elections we need maybe
> more room in practise. However, I would keep
> the requirement for having a transparent process for selecting trustees
> with a requirement that all accepted community
> "members” are legitimate to stand up as candidate (for any trustee
> position).
>
> Jorma Mellin
> ------------------------------------------
> Jorma Mellin <jome at ficix.fi>
> Ambassador, FICIX
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 03 Aug 2017, at 06:02, John More <morej1 at mac.com> wrote:
> >
> > Sivasubramanian
> >
> > There is nothing in the Agreement that requires or even suggests that
> “lobbying” is required.  ISOC itself cannot do political lobbying in the
> United States — that is supporting one candidate over another.  It can
> address comments on legislation or ask its members to send messages to
> politicians about issues ISOC deems important for the future of the
> Internet, such as making it available to as many people as possible.
> However, the Agreement as I read it does not require any Chapter to violate
> local laws.  Every Chapter has the right to raise its local issues and I
> would hope have specific reservations attached to the standard Agreement.
> >
> > Further “Promoting” means supporting ISOC principles of the open and
> available Internet.  If a Chapter is unable or uninterested in doing so,
> one must question why it should hold itself out as an ISOC Chapter.
> >
> > Perhaps the Agreement needs to be worded better.  Perhaps it needs
> clearer language about compliance with local law.
> >
> > John More
> >
> >> On Aug 2, 2017, at 1:33 PM, Sivasubramanian M <isolatedn at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> Raul,
> >>
> >>
> >> Please give me some time to articulate this clearly.
> >>
> >>
> >> Sivasubramanian M
> >>
> >> On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 10:54 PM, Raul Echeberria <echeberria at isoc.org>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Hi Sivasubramanian
> >>>
> >>> When we speak about Internet society positions, we refer to our
> positions. We have now procedures in place for facilitating the
> participation of Chapters and members in the process of developing policy
> positions.
> >>>
> >>> But beyond this clarification, the sentence you are referring to, is
> already in the current Chapter Agreement and it has not been controversial
> so far.
> >>> Please elaborate more in where is exactly the problem.  Joyce already
> clarified that is not the intention of that sentence to ask Chapters to
> engage in lobbying activities, but if needed we are glad in working on
> trying to remove your concerns.
> >>>
> >>> Raúl
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> El 2 ago. 2017, a las 11:49, Sivasubramanian M <isolatedn at gmail.com>
> escribió:
> >>>>
> >>>> Dear Joyce,
> >>>>
> >>>> Comment inline:
> >>>>
> >>>> On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 9:35 PM, Joyce Dogniez <dogniez at isoc.org>
> wrote:
> >>>>> Hi Brandt, hi everyone,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks again for all the comments.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Let me clarify a number of points that have been touched upon.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> With regards to the comment about the clause: “Promote one or more
> of the
> >>>>> Internet Society’s official strategic positions or initiatives with
> local
> >>>>> community leaders, media representatives, legislators, and/or
> regulatory
> >>>>> decision makers every 12 month period, and share the results of such
> >>>>> promotion with the ISOC staff within 30 days of completion”
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The clause does not provide for lobbying but rather promotion of
> positions,
> >>>>> which could be conducted even in simplest forms of activities, such
> as
> >>>>> posting a position on the chapter website, or indeed as was
> mentioned in
> >>>>> whichever way makes sense at local level.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> However well dressed this clause is, during the last 3 years or more,
> >>>> Staff thinking appears to favour a position that Chapters are expected
> >>>> to engage in "promoting Internet Society" positions with local
> >>>> Governments". I mentioned earlier in the thread about ISOC Chennai
> >>>> being unwilling to engage in any form of lobbying. However, speaking
> >>>> for the Chapter, we would always fiercely defend the Internet, its
> >>>> core values, the multi-stakeholder model of Internet Governance and
> >>>> other broad principles and positions that reflect the overall thinking
> >>>> of all Chapters and the Internet Community, almost as rough consensus
> >>>> positions. This we do on our own, and would continue do on our own.
> >>>> What became our own positions, even if not in tune with that of our
> >>>> Government, we have expressed in the past without hesitation. We would
> >>>> continue to do so.
> >>>>
> >>>> The difficulty arises Chapters were to be expected to promote  a
> >>>> top-down position with the Government. That would be a different
> >>>> situation than defending our own positions or the positions that
> >>>> emerge by Global Chapter consensus, that we as a constituent of the
> >>>> Global Chapters contribute to / adopt. That would look more like a
> >>>> "Global" position than as a "foreign" position. This is a difficult
> >>>> point, the differences are somewhat hard to explain.  A case in point
> >>>> pertains to the discord I felt when I attended a ISOC at ICANN meeting
> in
> >>>> London, three or four years ago, which was with a hired Consultant who
> >>>> steered a session on Working with Governments, which almost felt like
> >>>> Lobbying 101. Such thinking must go.
> >>>>
> >>>> ISOC Chapters work more by inspiration than by directives. Most of us
> >>>> all inspired by Internet values, by how the Internet evolved and
> >>>> continues to, and how it is governed. With the prevailing degree of
> >>>> independence, with support - not directives - to Chapters, I trust
> >>>> that Chapters do and would continue do far more work with or without
> >>>> budgetary allocations and achieve more than by programs with millions
> >>>> of dollars in spending
> >>>>
> >>>> Sivasubramanian
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Actually ISOC is established as an non-profit 501c3 under US laws,
> it is
> >>>>> legally not allowed to engage in lobby activities.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Also this clause is part of the current agreement, which each
> Chapter had to
> >>>>> sign to become or renew as a Chapter.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> About the distribution of the message, only a part of our Chapters
> have
> >>>>> chosen to have a representative to the Chapters Advisory Council and
> since
> >>>>> this document affects all chapters and SIGs, it was important to
> find a
> >>>>> channel that would reach all chapters.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I hope this clarifies those points.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks a lot
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Joyce
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> From: Chapter-delegates <chapter-delegates-bounces at elists.isoc.org>
> on
> >>>>> behalf of Brandt Dainow <brandt.dainow at gmail.com>
> >>>>> Reply-To: "brandt.dainow at gmail.com" <brandt.dainow at gmail.com>
> >>>>> Date: Wednesday, 2 August 2017 at 16:26
> >>>>> To: 'Eduardo Diaz' <eduardodiazrivera at gmail.com>, 'Seun Ojedeji'
> >>>>> <seun.ojedeji at gmail.com>, Victor Ndonnang <ndonnang at isoc.org>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Cc: "chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org" <chapter-delegates at elists.
> isoc.org>
> >>>>> Subject: Re: [Chapter-delegates] Revised Chapter Agreement
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> So – to ensure we all understand this.  My interpretation of your
> email is
> >>>>> the following, please let me know if this is correct?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 1)      The document was written by staff.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 2)      The charter should have gone to the Advisory Council for
> review, but
> >>>>> did not.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 3)      Instead it was sent to chapter officers (us).
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 4)      Review means “reading” only – there is no possibility of
> changing
> >>>>> the document.  So even if it had gone to the Advisory Council, they
> would
> >>>>> not have been able to change it.  Neither can we.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> If this document has not been sent through proper procedures for
> approval by
> >>>>> the Advisory Council, I am not sure it has any validity.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Regards,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Brandt Dainow
> >>>>>
> >>>>> brandt.dainow at gmail.com
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Brandt_Dainow
> >>>>>
> >>>>> http://www.imediaconnection.com/profiles/brandt.dainow
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> From: Chapter-delegates [mailto:chapter-delegates-
> bounces at elists.isoc.org]
> >>>>> On Behalf Of Eduardo Diaz
> >>>>> Sent: 02 August 2017 15:12
> >>>>> To: Seun Ojedeji; Victor Ndonnang
> >>>>> Cc: chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org
> >>>>> Subject: Re: [Chapter-delegates] Revised Chapter Agreement
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Seun:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> You are correct.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The Charter was sent by staff to all Chapters Officers (i.e.
> >>>>> chapter-delegates) for their review (not for approval) until August
> 31.
> >>>>> However, it should have been sent to the members of the Advisory
> Council
> >>>>> only first for formal review.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I understand all comments are valid and as many Chapters have
> indicated
> >>>>> local laws will not allow the Charter to be signed as currently
> stated.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -ed
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 9:57 AM Seun Ojedeji <seun.ojedeji at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Hello Victor,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks for your mail. However after following this thread, there
> seem to be
> >>>>> an impression that this document is still in draft status hence may
> change
> >>>>> in near future. Is that a valid interpretation?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I think your response on the above is very important, especially for
> those
> >>>>> of us currently in a chapter Bylaw drafting state.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Regards
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Sent from my mobile
> >>>>> Kindly excuse brevity and typos
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Aug 1, 2017 4:51 PM, "Victor Ndonnang" <ndonnang at isoc.org> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Hi Seun,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thank you for your feedback. I would recommend to share it with your
> >>>>> chapter’s members since some new dispositions/changes will require
> special
> >>>>> Chapter’s members meeting for validation.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Since you are reviewing the Nigeria Chapter bylaws now, I would
> recommend to
> >>>>> incorporate the new changes/requirements before submitting the new
> bylaws to
> >>>>> members for approval.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thank you.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Best regards,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Victor.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Victor Ndonnang
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Chapter Development Manager, Africa & Middle East.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Internet Society
> >>>>>
> >>>>> http://www.internetsociety.org/
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> From: Chapter-delegates <chapter-delegates-bounces at elists.isoc.org>
> on
> >>>>> behalf of Seun Ojedeji <seun.ojedeji at gmail.com>
> >>>>> Date: Tuesday, August 1, 2017 at 11:26
> >>>>> To: Joyce Dogniez <dogniez at isoc.org>
> >>>>> Cc: "chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org" <chapter-delegates at elists.
> isoc.org>
> >>>>> Subject: Re: [Chapter-delegates] Revised Chapter Agreement
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> <Wearing my ISOC Nigeria Bylaw Review Committee Chair hat>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Hello,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks for sharing this, we are currently reviewing our Bylaw for the
> >>>>> Nigeria chapter and this document may come handy to members of our
> chapter.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Can I know if this is a final/public document hence can be shared
> with our
> >>>>> chapter members?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Regards
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Sent from my mobile
> >>>>> Kindly excuse brevity and typos
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Jul 31, 2017 11:07 AM, "Joyce Dogniez" <dogniez at isoc.org> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Dear Chapter Leaders,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Internet Society Chapters are a very important part of our
> organization.
> >>>>> They act as a local presence globally to advance and represent ISOCs
> >>>>> mission, vision and principles. They are a crucial vehicle for ISOC
> to drive
> >>>>> the local advocacy efforts as well as implement activities and
> actions at
> >>>>> local level.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> To be able to do this it is important that Chapters are well
> structured,
> >>>>> well governed, functional and that there is a clear definition of
> the role
> >>>>> of Chapters.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Since 2013 we have continued to strengthen our relationship with our
> >>>>> Chapters and are working with them to improve on a number of areas
> through:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The introduction of standardized Charter agreements to clarify the
> role of
> >>>>> and the support of Chapters
> >>>>> The introduction of minimum standards and a Chapter Performance
> Evaluation
> >>>>> to identify and support areas of improvement
> >>>>> The increase of financial and other support for Chapters
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> With the increased financial support to our Chapters we also have an
> >>>>> increased responsibility and accountability towards our community.
> It is the
> >>>>> responsibility of Internet Society’s leadership to manage its funds
> in a
> >>>>> responsible and transparent manner.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> This implies that the legal relationship between Internet Society
> and its
> >>>>> Chapters needs to be well defined.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> As you all have seen Internet Society launched a new brand identity
> over the
> >>>>> last months, with a new logo, new font, new colours, a different
> tone of
> >>>>> voice, etc. Some of you have already been implementing this.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> As the local voices of the Internet Society, it is important that our
> >>>>> Chapters carry that same image and message.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> For all these reasons, we are introducing a revised Chapter Charter
> that:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Clarifies the relationship between Internet Society and its Chapters,
> >>>>> including external communications guidelines
> >>>>> Clarifies the expectations (minimum criteria, governance structure
> and
> >>>>> support) for both parties
> >>>>> Clarifies the expectations in terms of Internet related positions
> taken by
> >>>>> Chapters
> >>>>> Clarifies the use of the Internet Society Brand and use of
> Intellectual
> >>>>> Property
> >>>>> Clarifies the terms and accountability for funding provided by
> Internet
> >>>>> Society
> >>>>> Clarifies the terms of termination of a Chapter
> >>>>> Reduces the liability in case of abuse or misuse of funding and
> branding
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The attached agreement has been reviewed by the Chapters Advisory
> Council
> >>>>> Steering Committee who have given extensive feedback and input
> (thanks
> >>>>> again!!).
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> We understand that some of the changes in the agreement will imply
> some
> >>>>> changes at Chapter level and we will of course work with all of you
> to
> >>>>> ensure you can go through the necessary processes at local level in
> due
> >>>>> time.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> We will expect Chapters to sign the revised agreement before 1st of
> January
> >>>>> 2018 to still be eligible for Chapter funding.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Therefore, I’d like to ask you all to review the attached Chapter
> Charter in
> >>>>> the next 30 days, until 31st August and please contact
> >>>>> chapter-support at isoc.org with any questions or specific issues you
> may have.
> >>>>> A French and Spanish version will be available later this week.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I look forward to working together to continue to strengthen our
> Chapters
> >>>>> and to support the important work you do on the ground advancing our
> >>>>> mission.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Kind regards,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Joyce
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> —
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Joyce Dogniez, CMM
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Senior Director Global Engagement
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Internet Society
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> dogniez at isoc.org
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Mob/Whatsapp: +352 621 266 189
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Skype: joycedogniez
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically
> subscribed
> >>>>> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet
> Society
> >>>>> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
> >>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically
> subscribed
> >>>>> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet
> Society
> >>>>> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically
> subscribed
> >>>>> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet
> Society
> >>>>> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Sivasubramanian M
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically
> subscribed
> >>>> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet
> Society
> >>>> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Sivasubramanian M
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed
> >> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
> >> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed
> > to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
> > Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed
> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed
> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
>

-- 
---------------------
Mme Ndéye Maimouna DIOP
Spécialiste ICT4D
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