[Chapter-delegates] Recent Correspondence from the Cambodian Chapter

Sun Sep 29 14:59:57 PDT 2013

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Dear All, Veni,
I suggest to be more realistic and once more try to understand ISOC
basic definitions:

1. Clear formal description of ISOC (ISOC Global, ISOC HQ, Staff,
Board, etc.)
2. Clear formal description of the Chapter - is it an independent
organization or it is a branch or subsidiary of ISOC (ISOC Global,
ISOC HQ, Staff, Board, etc.)

Grigori Saghyan
ISOC.AM

On 29.09.2013 12:59, Veni Markovski wrote:
> Elver, and all, Replace Estonia with Bulgaria , and I can sign it.
>  Isoc-Bulgaria had several projects running at the same time, and
> we were having paid staff (many here know Julia and Dessi
> /Dragoslava/), as well as GOOD stuff to achieve, among which: -
> Creative Commons inBulgarian - changes in the Bulgarian telecom
> laws to become internet-friendly - contributions to the ITU -
> participation and reporting from ITU big events - get rid of
> licenses and regulations of Internet services in the country -
> using free and open source software for e-government - etc
> 
> Isoc has contributed a tiny little fraction of our budget, and two
> years ago, when we most needed support for fighting with the bad
> stuff at the ITU, 3 chapters - Bulgaria, Poland and Armenia - asked
> for 7500 $. The request was turned down because "it has been too
> international" I rest my case.
> 
> 
> On Sunday, September 29, 2013, Elver Loho wrote:
> 
> On 27 September 2013 16:05, Victor Ndonnang 
> <ndonnang at nvconsulting.biz <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', 
> 'ndonnang at nvconsulting.biz');>> wrote:
> 
> +1 Ted,____
> 
> __ __
> 
> I?m following with great attention this discussion initiated by the
> Cambodian Chapter intention to leave the Internet society Great
> family which lead to the old debate about ISOC?s direct financial
> support to Chapters. Before I continue, I would like to clearly
> express my opposition to that. For me, It is important and better
> for ISOC HQ to empower Chapters rather than giving them money.
> Chapters are not ?national bureau? of the Internet Society. ISOC
> Chapters and ISOC Global are partners who share the same vision and
> the mission. The direct financial support to Chapters for their
> administrative and running costs will make the Chapters useless,
> dependent and non-sustainable. If we put in place the systematic
> direct financial support from ISOC HQ to Chapters, we will see many
> useless Chapters flourish around the world only to benefit to that
> direct financial support. ____
> 
> __ __
> 
> The belonging to the ISOC great family comes with advantages but 
> also responsibilities. The Internet Society is already supporting
> and empowering Chapters in many ways:____
> 
> __-       __The community Grants programme gives priority to 
> Chapters projects____
> 
> __-       __The Event funding programme which helps to keep the 
> Chapter active each year____
> 
> __-       __The Web presence support____
> 
> __-       __The travel support ____
> 
> __-       __Capacities Building and Leadership Program____
> 
> __-       __International Handbook for Chapters____
> 
> __-       __Management Tools ____
> 
> __-       __Etc . You can
> 
> The problem with all of these measures you have enumerated above
> is that they require someone to actually sit down, type out 
> applications, organize the people, create a structure for them to 
> work in, and so forth. The problem with most NGOs and, I suspect, 
> with most Chapters is NOT that there aren't any sources of funding 
> available. The problem with most NGOs and, I suspect, with most 
> Chapters is that there isn't money to keep even a single person on 
> the payroll whose job it is to get that funding for all the 
> projects. To actually run things and organize.
> 
> We can have all the meetings we want and we can decide whatever,
> but at some point someone actually needs to sit down and get things
> done.
> 
> This might sound like hyperbole, but steady funding from ISOC HQ
> to keep one person on the payroll to run things would very likely
> be *more* valuable than having access to five times more money as 
> community grants or travel support or event funding or whatever. 
> There's a huge amount of money available in all sorts of grants 
> programs all over the world. The problem isn't lack of
> project-based money. The problem is lack of money for
> administrative and organizational tasks. You're all talking about
> lack of funding, but you seem to be missing the most important
> aspect: the kind of funding that's actually needed.
> 
> Here in Estonia there's a ton of project-based money available,
> but almost zero administrative funding. As a result there are NGOs
> where people apply for funding everywhere and do all sorts of crazy
> and ineffective and useless projects, which look good on paper, but
> are a waste of time. Why? Because from each project they can
> extract the 20% administrative overhead funding. And from that
> maybe a quarter is used for things that actually need to get done.
> For things, which are truly important. Which no funding committee
> really knows about or understands. Essentially of project-based
> funds 5% is used to do important things while 95% is wasted on
> ineffective and useless [insert your favorite cussword].
> 
> Here in Estonia we could get money for doing conferences on 
> internet-related topics. We could get money for publishing. We
> could get money to do media projects and online education. We might
> even get money for doing some cool and innovative web service,
> which nobody will use. Lots of funding available for all of that.
> And it's all fairly ineffective and the results are hard to measure
> beyond "we did X". So what is it that really needs to get done? In
> one word: lobbying. Analysing pending legislation, going to
> meetings, talking to politicians and civil servants. That's where
> the problems are, that's where you get actual measurable results.
> Is there money for this? Nope. Zero. No money whatsoever.
> 
> So in essence the problems are the following:
> 
> 1. You are funding the wrong things. If you want the world to
> change for the better, then ISOC Chapters around the world need to
> be effective at lobbying their governments to adopt all the fine 
> principles for which we joined ISOC in the first place. If we
> aren't even capable of that, then why are we even here?
> 
> 2. You are funding things in the wrong way. There is no shortage 
> whatsoever of project-based funding in the world. The way you get 
> such funding is by keeping someone on the payroll who can get it. 
> That payroll requirement creates a barrier of entry, which most 
> Chapters are unable to get over. So they languish. And nothing
> gets done. And people get angry and threaten to dissolve their
> Chapters.
> 
> We've had this discussion before. The problem is that as Chapter 
> leaders we are working on a voluntary basis (most of us, anyway), 
> and we need to get things done locally and in our workplace and so 
> forth. We are busy and we don't get paid to argue on this mailing 
> list. So if we say that we have a funding problem, then we get a 
> nicely worded reply from the ISOC HQ. And then we complain a bit 
> more, and we get another nicely worded reply from the ISOC HQ.
> Maybe a meeting happens at the HQ and maybe someone proposes that
> someone look into it and maybe even a committee is formed, or a
> working group, where ideas go to silently die. And since we all, as
> Chapter leaders, have more important things to do, we give up. We
> understand that it's an uphill battle trying to argue with people
> who get paid to argue. I've seen it way too many times trying to
> convince a politician to do the right thing -- he or she gets paid
> and can run you around in circles all day long while you gotta
> worry about where your next paycheck comes from.
> 
> The Cambodian Chapter figured out how to turn the tables. By 
> threatening dissolution of their Chapter, they don't have to fight 
> anymore. Now it's the ISOC HQ that needs to find a solution and 
> needs to do it quickly. Maybe we all need to join the Cambodians
> out of solidarity. After all, administrative funding is an issue
> for most of us, if not all.
> 
> 
> Best, Elver .ee
> 
> 
> 
> ____
> 
> __ __
> 
> Let come back to issue which brings this discussion live: Making 
> ISOC Cambodia Chapter a legal entity in Cambodia. ____
> 
> I know how It is difficult to establish a non-profit organization
> in many countries, especially in developing countries. When I
> started the ?re-formation? process of ISOC Cameroon Chapter, I made
> that goal my N°1 priority and which the help (time and money) of
> others founding members, we achieved it. We had the choice at that
> time to legalize the Cameroon Chapter as a NGO or Association. The
> process to become an NGO was too complicated, so we choice to be
> registered as an Association (a sort of small NGO). This is very
> important because Chapters can only be respected locally and
> interact freely with government, private sector and other groups
> when they are registered as a legal entity by the local 
> administrative authorities. ____
> 
> Based on that experience, I suggest to our Cambodia Chapter 
> colleagues to explore all alternatives of legal recognition in 
> their country. Be registered as a NGO is not the only way to become
> a legal non-profit organization or entity, I hope this is true in
> Cambodia too. ____
> 
> __ __
> 
> When the Chapter is registered as a legal entity (NGO, 
> Association?) in its respective country, it can easily search or 
> apply to local funding opportunities (government grants, big 
> national corporates grants?). The formation an ISOC Chapter is a 
> process and Chapter founding members are aware during the process
> that ISOC HQ will not be the only source of funding for the Chapter
> (that?s why there is a mention about ?Chapter supporters? in the
> application form and means of funding the draft By-Laws). Let?s
> search for others sources of funding and thanks the ISOC HQ for all
> It is already offering us rather than fighting for something which
> will make us useless. ____
> 
> __ __
> 
> Sorry for the long email. ____
> 
> Best regards,____
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- Best, Veni http://veni.com https://facebook.com/venimarkovski 
> https://twitter.com/veni
> 
> *** The opinions expressed above are those of the author, not of
> any organizations, associated with or related to him in any given
> way. ***
> 
> 
> == Sent from my phone, so any spelling mistakes are caused by the 
> touchscreen keyboard.
> 
> 
> 
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> 

- -- 
Grigori Saghyan
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