[Chapter-delegates] Recent Correspondence from the Cambodian Chapter
Ted Mooney
mooney at isoc.org
Fri Sep 27 08:55:54 PDT 2013
I would like to eliminate the term ISOC Global all together, but am not
sure how wise yet this may be. From my cursory knowledge of the last two
years, it is an informal term, not appearing in any official documents. If
others know or understand differently please let me know. I am happy to
refrain from using it. It has been used in the past to differentiate ISOC
Chapters and Members from ISOC Staff; Therefore I understand the term
ISOC Global to refer mostly to ISOC Staff and at times ISOC Trustees and
Staff.
The governance structure of the Internet Society is well known and public.
Strategy is proposed by the Executive Staff with the oversight, input and
ultimate approval of the Board of Trustees, in which three ISOC supporting
communities - IETF, Chapters and Organization Members - all have equal
participation. Strategy proposals are developed with input from ALL
communities and partners of the Internet Society and guided by our core
values and principles. Strategy is then implemented by Staff with
collaboration, input and assistance of members, chapters, partners and
others. Unless there are historical and persuasive arguments to continue
the use of the term 'ISOC Global' in this context, I will refrain from
using it and will be specific whenever I refer to Staff, Staff and
Trustees, Chapters, Org Members and Individual members. I use the term
The Internet Society to include ALL of these parties. If you agree and we
all do likewise, there will be no confusion.
I appreciate the chapter leaders perspective on this so consider the issue
still open, awaiting your additional input.
Respectfully,
Ted
Ted Mooney
Senior Director, Membership & Services
The Internet Society
1775 Wiehle Avenue
Reston, VA 20190 USA
Office: +1 703-439-2774
Cell: +1 301-980-6446
eMail: mooney at isoc.org
On 9/27/13 3:53 AM, "Eduard Tric" <eduard.tric at isoc.ro> wrote:
>+1
>Very good question, Grigori.
>At least from a financial angle , it's clearly the structure managing
>the cash.
>Regards,
>Ed
>
>----- Mesaj original -----
>De la: "Grigori Saghyan" <gregor at arminco.com>
>Către: chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org
>Trimis: vineri, 27 septembrie, 2013 0:02:26
>Subiect: Re: [Chapter-delegates] Recent Correspondence from the Cambodian
>Chapter
>
>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>Hash: SHA1
>
>Ted,
>you mention "ISOC Global" term. I think, today it is very important
>for all ISOC Cahpters to understand what it is - "ISOC Global".
>Options: It is the management of US based NGO.
>It is a the Board of Directors of an International organization.
>It is a the Board of Directors of US based NGO
>It is something new, which was not exists, with new rules.
>Other understandable descriptions.
>
>Regards
>Grigori Saghyan
>ISOC.AM
>
>On 26.09.2013 20:09, Ted Mooney wrote:
>> From my perspective these are all very good thoughts that have not
>> only made me reconsider the way I speak to the community at large,
>> but also how to move forward with a more productive dialog
>> regarding administrative support for Chapters. There are quite
>> rightfully, many different ideas how to proceed and as we all know,
>> no single framework will be effective in all cases.
>>
>> The first full meeting of the Chapter Administrative Support
>> Working Group (there have been conversations and emails pulling the
>> group together and agreeing an agenda) will take place next week
>> and there will be a report out to the chapter delegates regarding
>> the outcome and next steps.
>>
>> Grigori asked that someone address why direct financial support was
>> not immediately forthcoming. The reason is that at this point,
>> there isn't a sufficient amount of money to assure fairness or even
>> success, no fully developed plan to assure buy-in or understand the
>> impact, no measurement or funds-accounting mechanisms. However, I
>> fully expect progress on all these fronts by the end of the year
>> and beyond.
>>
>> Let me also point out that a number of chapters have resolved
>> these issues on their own from which many lessons can be learned.
>> The autonomy of ISOC Chapters is a critical part of your overall
>> effectiveness and ability to drive our mission locally. It comes
>> with a high degree of self-determination and a degree of
>> self-sufficiency which many of you have not only embraced, but
>> insisted upon. I ask you to please put aside past resentments
>> regarding the perception of ISOC as a "rich" organization when
>> support of our global mission on so many fronts requires investment
>> many times our capability. Senior leadership of the Internet
>> Society supports constant vigilance and adjustment of our funding
>> priorities to assure our communities are armed as best they can be
>> to support the ISOC Global mission. These processes are neither
>> quick nor simple. But your voices are heard and are having an
>> impact, however glacial the speed of their implementation. In this
>> light, I call upon the Cambodian Chapter once again, to reconsider
>> it's decision to leave the Internet Society and work on a plan for
>> the short and long term viability of our mission there.
>>
>> With great regards,
>>
>> Ted Ted Mooney Senior Director, Membership & Services The Internet
>> Society 1775 Wiehle Avenue Reston, VA 20190 USA Office: +1
>> 703-439-2774 Cell: +1 301-980-6446 eMail: mooney at isoc.org
>>
>> From: Shreedeep Rayamajhi <weaker41 at gmail.com
>> <mailto:weaker41 at gmail.com>> Date: Thursday, September 26, 2013
>> 11:26 AM To: Eduardo Diaz <eduardodiazrivera at gmail.com
>> <mailto:eduardodiazrivera at gmail.com>> Cc: ISOC Chapter Delegates
>> <chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org
>> <mailto:chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org>> Subject: Re:
>> [Chapter-delegates] Recent Correspondence from the Cambodian
>> Chapter
>>
>> I meant to say the communication can differ from people and channel
>> so it has be standardized and centralized accordingly, the
>> confusion in between the can create problems
>>
>> Cheers to Life Shreedeep Rayamajhi 00977-9841374547(Nepal)
>> 00977-9851049683(Nepal) 00977-9813900099
>>
>> +1(301)485-9395(US) <http://www.rayznews.com/>
>>
>> *DISCLAIMER:* This message is intended only for the recipient. If
>> you are not the intended recipient you are notified that
>> disclosing, copying, distributing or taking any action in reliance
>> on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 8:12 PM, Eduardo Diaz
>> <eduardodiazrivera at gmail.com <mailto:eduardodiazrivera at gmail.com>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Shreedeep:
>>
>> Can you be so kind in explaining the meaning of the last sentence
>> in your message? I can interpret it in many different ways.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> -ed President ISOC-Puerto Rico
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 1:01 AM, Shreedeep Rayamajhi
>> <weaker41 at gmail.com <mailto:weaker41 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Dear all
>>
>> We all are proud to be part of the Internet society and to some
>> extent it is our pride and prestige to say we are located through
>> out the world. As said big powers come with bigger Responsibilities
>> just like that we need to address the issue of Cambodian chapter by
>> every possible means.It counts for every member that stand for
>> change and with such situation ISOC can certainly help the chapter.
>> Its not just about the rules and principle but on practical ground
>> if there is a possibility from the ISOC headquarters then they
>> should help because it makes a difference.
>>
>> ISOC and its role model of economic independence can be understood
>> and the pros and cons of funding a chapter is the part of the ISOC
>> board or whom it may be concern but in reality if there is a
>> possibility for the Cambodian chapter to help then ISOC should by
>> all means.
>>
>> I think the communication in between the chapters +chapter
>> leaders+ISOC broad needs to be neutralized in every possible way.
>>
>> Cheers to Life Shreedeep Rayamajhi 00977-9841374547(Nepal)
>> 00977-9851049683(Nepal) 00977-9813900099
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shreedeep_Rayamajhi_(activist)
>> +1(301)485-9395 <tel:%2B1%28301%29485-9395>(US)
>> <http://www.rayznews.com/>
>>
>> *DISCLAIMER:* This message is intended only for the recipient. If
>> you are not the intended recipient you are notified that
>> disclosing, copying, distributing or taking any action in reliance
>> on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 26, 2013 at 9:28 AM, Eduard Tric <eduard.tric at isoc.ro
>> <mailto:eduard.tric at isoc.ro>> wrote:
>>
>> A few years ago , i had the opportunity to participate in a task
>> force called "Isoc chapter of the future". One of the conclusions
>> was that there has to be a balance between what HQ offer to the
>> capters (direct financial support was barley mentioned , among
>> other forms of support ) and what chapters should provide to HQ
>> (some form of activity , or growth). If direct financial support is
>> not an option, the "why" part should be explained in detail. In
>> that case , indirect support should be enhanced (raise community
>> grants budget and leadership training for chapter key persons )
>> Regards, Ed
>>
>> ----- Mesaj original ----- De la: "Grigori Saghyan"
>> <gregor at arminco.com <mailto:gregor at arminco.com>> Către:
>> chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org
>> <mailto:chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org> Trimis: joi, 26
>> septembrie, 2013 3:07:04 Subiect: Re: [Chapter-delegates] Recent
>> Correspondence from the Cambodian Chapter
>>
>> Dear All, from the formal point "chapter" is a part of one large
>> structure. I think it is to have clearly defined relations
>> between "Chapters" (or local ISOC structures) and whom? I use "ISOC
>> Global" term, but may be "Management" or "HQ or "Board" is better?
>> For each of proposed terms there is some uncertainty.
>>
>> After Cambodian declaration it looks, that there only one real way
>> to draw attention to Chapter problems.
>>
>> Btw, why it is such strong negative reaction for direct
>> financial support? And as we see, there is an expression " The
>> issue of the lack of direct financial transfers is currently not
>> among the solutions the Internet Society can offer".
>>
>> Here we see the author: it is the "Internet Society". Not the
>> Board, not the staff, not the management, not ISOC Global, but the
>> "Internet Society" Logically, I can understand, that as a
>> Chapter, our Chapter was involved in some kind of discussion on
>> that point, there was a voting procedure, and such decision was
>> approved by majority? But we do not participated in such
>> procedure. On the the other hand, if the Chapter is real "chapter"
>> - a part of a large structure the "Internet Society" - it is not
>> necessary to ask Chapter's opinion.
>>
>> Clear definition of terms is one of the strongest requirements
>> everywhere, I think it is one of the most important points today
>> for ISOC community (also undefined term).
>>
>>
>>
>> Grigori Saghyan ISOC.AM <http://ISOC.AM>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 26.09.2013 0:19, Elver Loho wrote:
>>> Hi all,
>>
>>> I haven't kept up with this email list, but from what I can
>>> gather the Cambodian Chapter wants to disassociate from ISOC due
>>> to lack of direct financial support for the basic running and
>>> operation of the Chapter.
>>
>>> I do not speak for my Chapter here, but personally I
>>> wholeheartedly support this gesture. If this happens, then
>>> maybe, just maybe, ISOC senior staff will start taking the issue
>>> of providing support for Chapters around the world seriously.
>>
>>> Right now Chapters seem to exist more as a way for ISOC HQ to
>>> show that they have support and members around the world. We're
>>> all providing a sort of legitimacy for the people at the HQ. Do
>>> we get something back for this? Sort of. I mean, maybe. To some
>>> degree. Though here in Estonia very few people have heard of the
>>> Internet Society while our own local language brand carries a lot
>>> of weight. Your situation may be different.
>>
>>> Meanwhile we're battling with basic organizational issues,
>>> because we can't even afford to keep up basic maintenance. At
>>> times we're even unable to reply to government's requests for
>>> comments on pending legislation, because we all have regular jobs
>>> or businesses to run. This has to end. If what it takes is for
>>> one or more Chapters to secede from the union, then so be it. If
>>> the Cambodian Chapter goes through with this, I'm willing to put
>>> the question of secession up for debate in our own Chapter.
>>
>>> I urge other Chapter leaders to consider the same.
>>
>>> Best, Elver .ee
>>
>>> elver.loho at gmail.com <mailto:elver.loho at gmail.com> +372 5661
>> 6933 <tel:%2B372%205661%206933> skype: elver.loho
>>
>>
>>> On 25 September 2013 22:56, Dave Burstein <daveb at dslprime.com
>>> <mailto:daveb at dslprime.com>> wrote:
>>>> Cambodian colleagues
>>>>
>>>> I'm a board member in New York and respect your decision but
>>>> urge you to keep working to resolve this. The board of ISOC is
>>>> strongly committed to working with chapters and directed staff
>>>> to improve things. If that's broken down here, as it seems,
>>>> several board members are surely willing to help. They are
>>>> dedicated, committed people who make a point fo responding to
>>>> ISOC chapter members. I or a dozen others on this list can
>>>> connect you if that makes things easier.
>>>>
>>>> They are all strong and independent thinkers, most with a no
>>>> b______ attitude.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Ted
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for addressing this; leaving it without response would
>>>> have been painful. This is a crisis for the goverance model of
>>>> ISOC that needs to be resolved at the highest level. As you
>>>> saw from this list, a dozen other chapters think this crucial
>>>> to solve.
>>>>
>>>> But "The issue of the lack of direct financial transfers is
>>>> currently not among the solutions the Internet Society can
>>>> offer" doesn't seem to the point. Is there anything in the ISOC
>>>> charter that makes this impossible? If so, please point to it
>>>> and people can bring it to the board.
>>>>
>>>> "Can" is the word you used. I'm guessing this actually is an
>>>> administrative decision made by the senior staff, who can, if
>>>> they choose, simply reverse the decision. Staff are constantly
>>>> making financial decisions an order of magnitude greater. If
>>>> staff feel they can't do this without board approval, that's
>>>> easy to obtain if it's important to ISOC. As many of us know,
>>>> most of the board members are very accessible and dedicated to
>>>> solving ISOC problems if necessary.
>>>>
>>>> "Should" ISOC provide the seed funding here, necessary to get
>>>> the chapter started on the path to independence is the real
>>>> question. I'm sure there's a lot more here than the presumably
>>>> modest sum to share some office space. Likely, a shared or
>>>> cheap office space that fits the legal requirements can be
>>>> obtained for less than the cost of sending one more talking
>>>> head to IGF Bali. Nothing wrong with IGF, but a slightly
>>>> smaller ISOC delegation isn't a fatal wound.
>>>>
>>>> I don't know enough to decide whether ISOC should do more here
>>>> and I'm sure there are major issues that haven't been
>>>> discussed.
>>>>
>>>> So let's draw in Lynn, Walda or whomever else actually has the
>>>> power to make things happen and prevent a deep organizational
>>>> problem.
>>>>
>>>> db
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 1:25 PM, Ted Mooney <mooney at isoc.org
>>>> <mailto:mooney at isoc.org>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> To all Chapter Delegates
>>>>>
>>>>> ISOC Staff and, in particular, Membership and Services, are
>>>>> saddened by the recent decision and communication from the
>>>>> Cambodian Chapter regarding their desire to dissociate from
>>>>> the Internet Society for administrative and other support
>>>>> concerns. I believe, however, there has been an unfortunate
>>>>> miscommunication. The Chapter Development and APAC staff
>>>>> have reached out to the Cambodian Chapter on numerous
>>>>> occasions. As many of you know, our Chapter Development team
>>>>> has worked with other chapters to help address issues nearly
>>>>> identical to what the Cambodian Chapter is experiencing. Our
>>>>> offer of collaboration remains.
>>>>>
>>>>> The issue of the lack of direct financial transfers is
>>>>> currently not among the solutions the Internet Society can
>>>>> offer. There are, nevertheless many other avenues to
>>>>> address the administrative support of the Chapter, which are
>>>>> both local and long term. Indeed Staff are working with
>>>>> Chapter volunteers and have convened a new Chapter
>>>>> Administrative Support Working Group to address this issue
>>>>> broadly. We hope the Cambodian Chapter will reassess their
>>>>> position and re-engage with ISOC staff as soon as possible.
>>>>> Our Chapter Development staff will reach out once again to
>>>>> the Cambodian Chapter officers.
>>>>>
>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Ted Ted Mooney Senior Director, Membership & Services The
>>>>> Internet Society 1775 Wiehle Avenue Reston, VA 20190 USA
>>>>> Office: +1 703-439-2774 <tel:%2B1%20703-439-2774> Cell: +1
>> 301-980-6446 <tel:%2B1%20301-980-6446> eMail:
>>>>> mooney at isoc.org <mailto:mooney at isoc.org>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________ As an
>>>>> Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically
>>>>> subscribed to this list, which is regularly synchronized with
>>>>> the Internet Society Chapter Portal (AMS):
>>>>> https://portal.isoc.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- Editor, Fast Net News, Net Policy News and A Wireless Cloud
>>>> Author with Jennie Bourne DSL (Wiley, 2002) and Web Video:
>>>> Making It Great, Getting It Noticed (Peachpit, 2008)
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________ As an Internet
>>>> Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed to
>>>> this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet
>>>> Society Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
>>> _______________________________________________ As an Internet
>>> Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed to this
>>> list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
>>> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________ As an Internet
>> Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed to this
>> list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
>> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
>>
>> --
>>
>> --
>>
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>> Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed to this
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>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________ As an Internet
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>>
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>
>- --
>Grigori Saghyan
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>--
>
>--
>
>Eduard Tric ,CEO, Axetel
>I encrypt therefore I am.
>http://www.axetel.com
>eduard at axetel.com
>tel: +40740300740
>
>
>
> DD;;
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> ;;;DDD all the codes,
> ,;DG including yours.
>
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