[Chapter-delegates] Membership System

Mon Jan 30 22:01:13 PST 2006

Hi,

maybe - unfortunately - it is telling that all complaints about character 
set are coming from non-native-English chapters... pity our poor members, 
so enamoured of their names as they know them, with those weird accent and 
Umlaut marks, who have not yet seen the truth of simplification that ASCII 
endows us with. While at it, can we also remove the "ough" ambiguities of 
English, which cause these barbarians so much trouble in learning the True 
Revealed Language of the Truth? 

All other simplifications analyzed will also be welcome. Further, to have 
news of people who have already indicated me they have joined my chapter, 
but haven't been yet reported by the system, has created in me a renewed 
loyalty to good old Majordomo which still is serving us well. And a 
spreadsheeet, yes.

Alejandro Pisanty

.  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
     Dr. Alejandro Pisanty 
Director General de Servicios de Computo Academico
UNAM, Universidad Nacional Autonoma de Mexico
Av. Universidad 3000, 04510 Mexico DF Mexico
Tel. (+52-55) 5622-8541, 5622-8542 Fax 5622-8540
http://www.dgsca.unam.mx
*
---->> Unete a ISOC Mexico, www.isoc.org
 Participa en ICANN, www.icann.org
.  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .

On Tue, 31 Jan 2006, Erkki I. Kolehmainen wrote:

> Date: Tue, 31 Jan 2006 07:21:38 +0200
> From: Erkki I. Kolehmainen <eik at iki.fi>
> To: 'David McAuley' <mcauley at isoc.org>, 'Franck Martin' <franck at sopac.org>,
>      'Rosa Delgado' <rosa at delgado.aero>
> Cc: chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org
> Subject: Re: [Chapter-delegates] Membership System
> 
> Re attached:
> 
> Your defense of the ascii-only implementation in this day and age is out of
> this world.
> 
> Nobody in his er her clear mind is asking for support of multiple character
> sets, which would be equally outdated. The simple solution would be to
> support UCS/Unicode as the one universal character set. That would not cause
> problems to any reputable system of this century. Other i18n considerations
> are also very important, but not necessarily essential. 
> 
> We should be looking for direction through the windshield and not at the
> rear view mirror.
> 
> Sincerely, 
> 
> Erkki I. Kolehmainen
> Tilkankatu 12 A 3, FI-00300 Helsinki, Finland
> Puh. (09) 4368 2643, 0400 825 943; Tel. +358 9 4368 2643, +358 400 825 943  
> 
> -----Alkuperäinen viesti-----
> Lähettäjä: chapter-delegates-bounces at elists.isoc.org
> [mailto:chapter-delegates-bounces at elists.isoc.org] Puolesta David McAuley
> Lähetetty: 31. tammikuuta 2006 0:04
> Vastaanottaja: 'Franck Martin'; 'Rosa Delgado'
> Kopio: chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org
> Aihe: Re: [Chapter-delegates] Membership System
> 
> 
> Dear Chapter Delegates:
> 
> Having seen the traffic now on the membership system not working, I would
> like to remind our group that prior to embarking on the purchase of a
> membership system ISOC conducted a number of surveys and outreach among
> members and chapter delegates. Out of that process came an RFP that took the
> comments into consideration and that was passed among the chapters and
> members for comment. It was reviewed by chapters. 
> 
> Also importantly, the original goal was a phased implementation of a
> membership system that could create a common tool to the benefit of all
> members. The initial release was to be the common foundation for a system
> and it would, in future, be built upon as the community developed a
> consensus as to what was best to come next. That is not unusual when
> choosing and offering a system such as this that will be experienced by so
> many people from around the world. 
> 
> That process appears to be working albeit these latest complaints have
> re-surfaced. With the exception of a recent issue in handing off from
> Nelson, an issue that is now fixed, most of the complaints are ones that
> have been made before. That does not make them invalid. But neither does it
> make the system unworkable. The system does work and it is delivering value
> to many chapters. It is imperfect - the goal is to improve it in the series
> of phased implementation. 
> 
> This subject and phase two planning might be a good item for MMM meetings.
> 
> Here briefly are some of the recent comments and some thoughts on them:
> 
> The system is too complicated! To some the system seems pretty
> straightforward but we will look at what screens, if any, can be eliminated.
> This is a usability issue and those should be heeded and considered. We will
> do a second phase this year; that process will kick off with a request to
> chapters to help prioritize items to consider for upgrading. 
> 
> Too many clicks to join chapter! I believe we can eliminate a screen or two
> here and we will 
> endeavor to do so in this next phase. But many of these screens are quite
> informative to a member 
> who is new to ISOC. Nevertheless I think we can pare this back.
> 
> Non-ascii character set! We did of course ask for multi-lingualism when we
> went to seek solutions and at the time there were none available. The GO
> system, however, while only presenting in English is at least capable of
> being adapted to other languages. Much of the system is driven by templates
> that at least in theory can be extended for multiple language support.
> Neither GO nor any other system has a deployed multi-lingual system but GO
> does claim support for it. We could demand it in phase two. If we provided
> that in the first release it would have delayed that release even further.
> This is not perfect but it is a basis upon which we can do more. 
> 
> Chapters'membership data import/database synch ('we need a distributed
> database instead of universal forms')! We never intended to release a
> distributed database but rather have a centralized database. We wanted a
> system like that which would, however, allow chapters to program against the
> database as they now can – can set membership levels, levels of payment.
> There are security and database consistency issues that need to be fully
> explored before expanding the functionality available to Chapters.  
> 
> Possibility to integrate membership forms into chapters webpages! I believe
> this relates to the last comment. But it is worth noting that at least in
> theory we expect the GO system to be able to support Chapters having
> membership forms on their web sites. Frankly, it is unclear how this will
> work in practice, which is why it was not included in the initial release. 
> 
> Cumbersome shopping procedure with $0 value for chapter membership! I can
> see how this is seen as cumbersome. The system we chose was chosen as it
> best fit the RFP – certainly not a perfect fit but a better fit than others.
> It is based on a shopping experience and the way it presents free chapter
> membership with a 0 balance is not great. We will explore to see if that
> might be changeable in the second phase. 
> 
> Membership renewal should be customizable for chapters! Now the chapters can
> change money amounts, membership level and can run reports. Please make a
> note that as we plan phase two, or conduct MMMs in that respect, we ask for
> a more specific statement about this. 
> 
> Currency issue - dollars and Euros. This too was specifically in the RFP but
> we found that this was not on offer in membership systems when we were
> looking. It sounds easy but presents payment issues relating to fees on
> sending and on receiving – fees that might diminish the overall payment to
> the chapter. Again, time has moved on and this should be looked at again and
> we will do that in the next phase.
> 
> This is, as Franck said, very important. As we start to plan for Phase two I
> think we should explore ways to ascertain the list of items and the priority
> they have – maybe an MMM, maybe a series of them or some other way. 
> 
> Best regards,
> David
> 
> David McAuley
> Membership Director
> Internet Society
> 703-326-9880, ext 104
> 703-963-5887 (mobile)
> mcauley at isoc.org
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: chapter-delegates-bounces at elists.isoc.org
> [mailto:chapter-delegates-bounces at elists.isoc.org] On Behalf Of Franck
> Martin
> Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 6:51 PM
> To: Rosa Delgado
> Cc: chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org
> Subject: Re: [Chapter-delegates] Membership System
> 
> 
> Especially, ISOC has two offices, one in Washington and one in Geneva, 
> so they must have one bank account at each location.
> 
> Thanks Rosa for taking care to raise the issues of the membership system
> 
> at the board.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Rosa Delgado wrote:
> 
> >What about the membership fees to be paid in US dollars/euros/..
> >
> >As far, as I remember this was requested by some chapters in INET 2004
> >- Barcelona. I suppose it is difficult to do it in every currency due 
> >to the conversion charges but at least one should expect to pay 
> >membership in dollar/euro (?).
> >
> >Regards/Rosa
> >
> >  
> >
> >
> 
> -- 
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> Franck Martin
> franck at sopac.org
> "Toute connaissance est une réponse à une question"
> G. Bachelard
> 
> 
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