From j at shoch.com Tue Feb 3 12:23:32 2026 From: j at shoch.com (John Shoch) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2026 12:23:32 -0800 Subject: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service Message-ID: Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first Arpanet link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note (11/3/25) from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network tests of the TCP Internet at SRI: // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and ARPANET. As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation and testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early work at Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and elsewhere. Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path to what became the Internet as we know it today. In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state of the Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It took me a while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original documents to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of interesting things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History Museum have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was suggested "you should share it before we lose this history." So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in 1976 (as seen from a slightly different perspective): --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken place at the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing meetings at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the Cabana hotel in Palo Alto. That same summer there were early discussions at PARC about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply called LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from Aug. 1973 reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL and ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to interconnect different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A drawing includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the alternative LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would be a need to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across geographies. Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it was also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed something immediately. --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC Universal Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is to promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell that our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable debate and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the ball rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would include, in arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) Arpanets, (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a backbone packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial lines.] . --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. Progress was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by Boggs and Taft: PUP Revisited PUP Converging Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP A Nova Gateway Implementation of PUP in Tenex PUP Again PUP Connection State Diagram PUP Servers on Maxc etc., etc., etc. --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? The best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 months earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. He reports: "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent Ethernets (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs (Multiprocessor Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating at 1.6 mb/s). Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a store-and-forward packet switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use of other transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth local communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at modest bandwidths, and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, Fragmentation, etc. I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of the complete final version. https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in the Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current text file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, well-known sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used to initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The Tenex header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 MCAs, and the Arpanet. Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing updates), FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names (e.g., MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if connected to more than one network). I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 machines acting as Gateways: --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the Arpanet, --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, both MCAs, and the Arpanet. --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font design and two for laser printer units). The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were not necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured as servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser printer, the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of these were for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated Data Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal traffic). [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos in our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if no one could find them via the name server, they could operate as client machines on the PUP Internet.] This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines on 5 networks of 3 types. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in March 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP Internet. John PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but the vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft and Boggs. 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general progress with others. --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been encouraged to "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's networking seminar. --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of us from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught by Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us undertook implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: evolving from the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in the listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) to show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP working group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal (who had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working Group meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later registered as IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different networks with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the East Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts connected." --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting at ISI -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became users of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was reported in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable byte stream interface. The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. to a print server. --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, echo, etc.) Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually allowed that kind of flexibility. 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and the PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in the early days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did not work well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and b) this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal developed the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd generation DIX Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network Systems (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and endured for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 From vgcerf at gmail.com Tue Feb 3 16:12:37 2026 From: vgcerf at gmail.com (vinton cerf) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2026 19:12:37 -0500 Subject: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: wonderful to have this in written form, John - thank you!!! v On Tue, Feb 3, 2026 at 3:23?PM John Shoch via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first Arpanet > link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note (11/3/25) > from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network tests of > the TCP Internet at SRI: > // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. > // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and > ARPANET. > > As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation and > testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early work at > Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and elsewhere. > Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple > networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path to what > became the Internet as we know it today. > > In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state of the > Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It took me a > while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original documents > to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of interesting > things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History Museum > have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was suggested > "you should share it before we lose this history." > > So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in 1976 > (as seen from a slightly different perspective): > > --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken place at > the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. > --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing meetings > at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the Cabana > hotel in Palo Alto. That same summer there were early discussions at PARC > about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply called > LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from Aug. 1973 > reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL and > ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for > introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the > discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to interconnect > different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A drawing > includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. > --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the alternative > LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific > protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would be a need > to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across geographies. > Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it was > also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed something > immediately. > --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC Universal > Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: > "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is to > promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell that > our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable debate > and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the ball > rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would include, in > arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) Arpanets, > (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? > [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a backbone > packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial lines.] > . > --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and > refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. Progress > was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by Boggs > and Taft: > PUP Revisited > PUP Converging > Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP > A Nova Gateway > Implementation of PUP in Tenex > PUP Again > PUP Connection State Diagram > PUP Servers on Maxc > etc., etc., etc. > > --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? The > best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 months > earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. He > reports: > "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent > Ethernets > (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs > (Multiprocessor > Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating at > 1.6 mb/s). > Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a store-and-forward > packet > switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use of > other > transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth local > communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at modest > bandwidths, > and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." > The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of > Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, Fragmentation, > etc. > I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of the > complete final version. > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing > > --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in the > Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current text > file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, well-known > sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used to > initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The Tenex > header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- > PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. > It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 MCAs, > and the Arpanet. > Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing updates), > FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. > The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names (e.g., > MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if connected to > more than one network). > I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 machines > acting as Gateways: > --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the Arpanet, > --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, both > MCAs, and the Arpanet. > --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. > There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font > design and two for laser printer units). > The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were not > necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured as > servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser printer, > the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. > There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of these were > for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated Data > Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal > traffic). > [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos in > our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if no one > could find them via the name server, they could operate as client machines > on the PUP Internet.] > This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines on 5 > networks of 3 types. > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing > > > That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in March > 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP Internet. > > John > > PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. > 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very > productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but the > vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft and > Boggs. > 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general progress with > others. > --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been encouraged to > "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's networking > seminar. > --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of us > from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught by > Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us undertook > implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: evolving from > the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new > internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in the > listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) to > show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! > --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP working > group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal (who > had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working Group > meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later registered as > IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different networks > with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the East > Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts > connected." > --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting at ISI > -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, > naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] > --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became users > of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying > encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was reported > in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf > 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable byte > stream interface. > The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: > --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. > --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. to a > print server. > --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, echo, > etc.) > Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually > allowed that kind of flexibility. > 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and the > PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in the early > days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did not work > well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and b) > this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the > Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal developed > the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd generation DIX > Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network Systems > (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and endured > for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. > https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > From vint at google.com Tue Feb 3 18:03:55 2026 From: vint at google.com (Vint Cerf) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2026 21:03:55 -0500 Subject: [ih] Fwd: Arpanet Reconstruction Project - an update In-Reply-To: References: <5930CE1C-4676-4175-BE0B-243ECE330384@cs.ucla.edu> <019a01dbf4d0$3f6d3c60$be47b520$@ceds.dev> <7d2042b5-bc2e-4e4e-9eec-20b8297f347f@cnri.reston.va.us> Message-ID: sharing with permission v ---------- Forwarded message --------- From: Oscar Vermeulen Date: Tue, Feb 3, 2026 at 2:35?PM Subject: Arpanet Reconstruction Project - an update To: Robert Kahn , Steve Crocker Cc: o.oosterwijk at ceds.dev , Leonard Kleinrock < lk at cs.ucla.edu>, Vinton G. Cerf , Lars Brinkhoff < lars.brinkhoff at gmail.com>, Charley Kline Dear Sirs, We bothered you with a few emails last summer, about our "Arpanet Reconstruction Project" - and we promised to keep you informed. I hope you do not mind us contacting you again for such an update. But we have made quite some progress, enough to send you a link to a working Arpanet recreation: https://obsolescence.dev/arpanet_home This replicates a fully functional Arpanet with the topology from May 1973, with 35 IMP emulators connected, running their 1973 firmware. Accessible currently are the three MIT PDP-10s running ITS, and the Stanford SAIL PDP-10 running WAITS. The web page contains 8 web terminals, labelled as 'seats at the 1972 ICCC conference' where visitors can connect through the Arpanet IMPs to one of these four systems and attempt a few of the "Arpanet Scenarios" from the event's booklet. - And this begs the question, as computer history hobbyists, did our tone of voice (aimed at a general audience) capture the reality of the event? We decided to shape this web page (the prototype for a museum exhibit) around the idea that the 1972 ICCC conference was a breakthrough event, and it is interesting to experience 'what it was that made people see'. But we base ourselves on reading up decades after the event. It will be very welcome to hear if perhaps we overly romanticised the event - and should amend the "storyline". The web site with arpanet terminals acts as the prototype for: 1. An interactive museum exhibit - we dream of having some nodes located at their historical locations 2. An open source 'arpanet in a box' package that people can run on their own machines and explore/enjoy 3. A hobby Arpanet that our group can connect to with their replica PDP-10s and -11s. This is only work in progress - the text of the page, the exact commands to relive the Scenarios - all of that will need a small group of volunteers to perfect before we would consider this a public site. But the setup is properly working, and the ITS and WAITS systems are rich enough in context that indeed, you will see students' messages on the Stanford machine from the early 70s; and ITS user directories with some well-known MIT users and their software projects. In other words, we believe this can truly be a realistic experience of the Arpanet circa 1972-3. Work is underway to reconstruct the TENEX system, and files from BBN and the University of Utah have been found to make these nodes more than sterile 'bare OS' systems. But the OS code is not trivial to get to a working stage, it will take some time. Also, work is underway to present the UCLA SDS Sigma 7 online with an operating system that is maybe not the period-correct one, but at least a modified CP-V that will present itself in a similar fashion. Also, we have the BBN Network Control Center on the to-do list. Of course, the IMP network already sends data to BBN's IMP node 5, and we are processing the data that this particular IMP sends to its host 0. But the end goal would be to have a replica PDP-1 handle the data flow. We also have high hopes to get the two original Multics machines online, a group of people has worked on them and the challenge will be to complete the missing NCP code for Multics. But that is now feasible - it will be done. Lastly, a period-correct PDP-11 Unix v6 with NCP connection sounds like it will be on the cards later this year. We'll also have a hardware replica of the H516 IMP ready as open-source hardware in the coming months. It is needed for museum exhibits, and hobbyists will enjoy it as well. We should not over-represent its importance: behind its replica front panel will hide a Raspberry Pi with a Honeywell 316 simulator running. But it will be fully functional, connect over serial lines or internet UDP connections to 'the reconstructed Arpanet' and be a nice functional museum exhibit, as we hope. (You might have forgotten, our series of replicas is at https://obsolescence.dev). I hope you do not mind our longish update above - too much information, I'm sure. But feedback of both the positive and negative kind is very welcome. It will help us get the historical context right. Please keep in mind though, that the web pages' text are only drafts. We focused on getting the actual Arpanet simulation working reliably first. Kind regards, Oscar Vermeulen Cc Lars Brinkhoff Cc Otto Oosterwijk -- Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: Vint Cerf Google, LLC 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor Reston, VA 20190 +1 (571) 213 1346 until further notice From jack at 3kitty.org Tue Feb 3 18:38:52 2026 From: jack at 3kitty.org (Jack Haverty) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2026 18:38:52 -0800 Subject: [ih] Fwd: Arpanet Reconstruction Project - an update In-Reply-To: References: <5930CE1C-4676-4175-BE0B-243ECE330384@cs.ucla.edu> <019a01dbf4d0$3f6d3c60$be47b520$@ceds.dev> <7d2042b5-bc2e-4e4e-9eec-20b8297f347f@cnri.reston.va.us> Message-ID: <5d220729-c963-44f1-a032-91ac93b6b93c@3kitty.org> Wow.? I wonder which took more person-hours -- the recent reconstruction, or building it all 50+ years ago. I logged in to my old MIT-DM machine.? ?The 1972 Washington Hilton scenarios work as I remember them.? ?I was part of the crew that Licklider sent from MIT to DC to help put all that stuff together and get it to work. Somehow they've even managed to reconstruct the slowness of the machine, and ARPANET, in 1973.? ?Sadly, my directory (DSK:JFH;) isn't there.? ?Couldn't find a directory for any other users of that era wither. I thought perhaps I could fix that final bug in some program I wrote, and maybe go for a Guinness record for longest outstanding bug ever fixed. /Jack On 2/3/26 18:03, Vint Cerf via Internet-history wrote: > sharing with permission > v > > > ---------- Forwarded message --------- > From: Oscar Vermeulen > Date: Tue, Feb 3, 2026 at 2:35?PM > Subject: Arpanet Reconstruction Project - an update > To: Robert Kahn , Steve Crocker Cc: o.oosterwijk at ceds.dev , Leonard Kleinrock < > lk at cs.ucla.edu>, Vinton G. Cerf , Lars Brinkhoff < > lars.brinkhoff at gmail.com>, Charley Kline > > > Dear Sirs, > > We bothered you with a few emails last summer, about our "Arpanet > Reconstruction Project" - and we promised to keep you informed. > > I hope you do not mind us contacting you again for such an update. But we > have made quite some progress, enough to send you a link to a working > Arpanet recreation: > > https://obsolescence.dev/arpanet_home > > > This replicates a fully functional Arpanet with the topology from May 1973, > with 35 IMP emulators connected, running their 1973 firmware. Accessible > currently are the three MIT PDP-10s running ITS, and the Stanford SAIL > PDP-10 running WAITS. The web page contains 8 web terminals, labelled as > 'seats at the 1972 ICCC conference' where visitors can connect through the > Arpanet IMPs to one of these four systems and attempt a few of the "Arpanet > Scenarios" from the event's booklet. > > > - And this begs the question, as computer history hobbyists, did our > tone of voice (aimed at a general audience) capture the reality of the > event? We decided to shape this web page (the prototype for a museum > exhibit) around the idea that the 1972 ICCC conference was a breakthrough > event, and it is interesting to experience 'what it was that made people > see'. But we base ourselves on reading up decades after the event. It will > be very welcome to hear if perhaps we overly romanticised the event - and > should amend the "storyline". > > > The web site with arpanet terminals acts as the prototype for: > > 1. An interactive museum exhibit - we dream of having some nodes located > at their historical locations > 2. An open source 'arpanet in a box' package that people can run on > their own machines and explore/enjoy > 3. A hobby Arpanet that our group can connect to with their replica > PDP-10s and -11s. > > > This is only work in progress - the text of the page, the exact commands to > relive the Scenarios - all of that will need a small group of volunteers to > perfect before we would consider this a public site. But the setup is > properly working, and the ITS and WAITS systems are rich enough in context > that indeed, you will see students' messages on the Stanford machine from > the early 70s; and ITS user directories with some well-known MIT users and > their software projects. In other words, we believe this can truly be a > realistic experience of the Arpanet circa 1972-3. > > Work is underway to reconstruct the TENEX system, and files from BBN and > the University of Utah have been found to make these nodes more than > sterile 'bare OS' systems. But the OS code is not trivial to get to a > working stage, it will take some time. Also, work is underway to present > the UCLA SDS Sigma 7 online with an operating system that is maybe not the > period-correct one, but at least a modified CP-V that will present itself > in a similar fashion. Also, we have the BBN Network Control Center on the > to-do list. Of course, the IMP network already sends data to BBN's IMP node > 5, and we are processing the data that this particular IMP sends to its > host 0. But the end goal would be to have a replica PDP-1 handle the data > flow. We also have high hopes to get the two original Multics machines > online, a group of people has worked on them and the challenge will be to > complete the missing NCP code for Multics. But that is now feasible - it > will be done. Lastly, a period-correct PDP-11 Unix v6 with NCP connection > sounds like it will be on the cards later this year. > > We'll also have a hardware replica of the H516 IMP ready as open-source > hardware in the coming months. It is needed for museum exhibits, and > hobbyists will enjoy it as well. We should not over-represent its > importance: behind its replica front panel will hide a Raspberry Pi with a > Honeywell 316 simulator running. But it will be fully functional, connect > over serial lines or internet UDP connections to 'the reconstructed > Arpanet' and be a nice functional museum exhibit, as we hope. > > (You might have forgotten, our series of replicas is at > https://obsolescence.dev). > > I hope you do not mind our longish update above - too much information, I'm > sure. But feedback of both the positive and negative kind is very welcome. > It will help us get the historical context right. Please keep in mind > though, that the web pages' text are only drafts. We focused on getting the > actual Arpanet simulation working reliably first. > > Kind regards, > > Oscar Vermeulen > Cc Lars Brinkhoff > Cc Otto Oosterwijk > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: OpenPGP_signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 665 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From jeanjour at comcast.net Wed Feb 4 05:13:13 2026 From: jeanjour at comcast.net (John Day) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2026 08:13:13 -0500 Subject: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Let me add a little detail. > On Feb 3, 2026, at 15:23, John Shoch via Internet-history wrote: > > Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first Arpanet > link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note (11/3/25) > from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network tests of > the TCP Internet at SRI: > // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. > // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and > ARPANET. > > As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation and > testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early work at > Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and elsewhere. > Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple > networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path to what > became the Internet as we know it today. > > In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state of the > Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It took me a > while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original documents > to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of interesting > things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History Museum > have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was suggested > "you should share it before we lose this history." > > So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in 1976 > (as seen from a slightly different perspective): > > --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken place at > the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. It was at this meeting that Pouzin first presented where the CYCLADES clean-slate approach to the network problem after seeing the ARPANET was presented to a wide audience. CYCLADES was designed to do research on networks, rather than a production network like the ARPANET. The assumptions that CYCLADES made were considerably different than those for the ARPANET. (BBN was doing what was required by the RFQ,) A few of the differences were: In the ARPANET, the IMPs were a front-end to the hosts. Hence the hosts were not part of the network and had to be within 10m of the IMP. (Relaxing that with DH, and VDH came later) In CYCLADES, the hosts were assumed not to be near the CIGALE ?routers? and could be connected to more than one. The ARPANET was basically a reliable virtual circuit network, while CYCLADES was an unreliable ?best-effort? datagram network. CYCLADES introduced end-to-end reliability (between the hosts) at the Transport Layer. At the end of March 1973, Cerf and Kahn spent a day with Pouzin learning more about CYCLADES. It was at this meeting that Gerard LeLann presented his results on simulation of CYCLADES. In June 1973, the next INWG meeting was held at the NCC in New York. McKenzie says that most of the discussion was between Metcalfe and Zimmermann. Cerf said he would write up the minutes. (Cerf has produced a draft protocol after this meeting and there are comments by Walden and McKenzie at least those are the ones I have seen. > --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing meetings > at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the Cabana > hotel in Palo Alto. From earlier emails with John, this meeting was 17 July 1973 On 13 Sept 73, Cerf issues the minutes for the June INWG meeting (INWG39), noting in a cover letter that they had held the meetings at Stanford that summer. INWG 39 is identical to the May 1974, Cerf/Kahn paper published by IEEE. Oct 1973 INWG 42 ? L. Pouzin Interconnection of Packet Switched Networks. INWG 43 Zimmermann/Elie Proposed Standard. In INWG42, Pouzin, in essence, proposes the solution to internetworking as changing the name of the Transport Layer to Internet Transport Layer and treating it as an overlay, thereby avoiding any protocol translation. The only thing the supporting networks have to do is meet the minimal service required by the Internet Transport Layer. This leads to a debate between the two proposals and eventually a synthesis of the two protocols known as INWG96, which was voted on in 1976 and passed by a 2-1 margin. Meanwhile . . . at PARC . . . > That same summer there were early discussions at PARC > about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply called > LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from Aug. 1973 > reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL and > ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for > introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the > discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to interconnect > different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A drawing > includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. > --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the alternative > LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific > protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would be a need > to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across geographies. > Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it was > also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed something > immediately. > --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC Universal > Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: > "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is to > promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell that > our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable debate > and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the ball > rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would include, in > arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) Arpanets, > (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? > [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a backbone > packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial lines.] > . > --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and > refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. Progress > was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by Boggs > and Taft: > PUP Revisited > PUP Converging > Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP > A Nova Gateway > Implementation of PUP in Tenex > PUP Again > PUP Connection State Diagram > PUP Servers on Maxc > etc., etc., etc. > > --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? The > best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 months > earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. He > reports: > "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent Ethernets > (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs > (Multiprocessor > Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating at > 1.6 mb/s). > Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a store-and-forward > packet > switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use of > other > transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth local > communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at modest > bandwidths, > and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." > The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of > Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, Fragmentation, > etc. > I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of the > complete final version. > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing > > --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in the > Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current text > file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, well-known > sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used to > initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The Tenex > header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- > PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. > It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 MCAs, > and the Arpanet. > Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing updates), > FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. > The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names (e.g., > MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if connected to > more than one network). > I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 machines > acting as Gateways: > --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the Arpanet, > --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, both > MCAs, and the Arpanet. > --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. > There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font > design and two for laser printer units). > The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were not > necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured as > servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser printer, > the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. > There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of these were > for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated Data > Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal > traffic). > [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos in > our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if no one > could find them via the name server, they could operate as client machines > on the PUP Internet.] > This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines on 5 > networks of 3 types. > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing > > > That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in March > 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP Internet. > > John > > PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. > 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very > productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but the > vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft and > Boggs. > 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general progress with > others. > --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been encouraged to > "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's networking > seminar. > --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of us > from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught by > Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us undertook > implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: evolving from > the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new > internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in the > listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) to > show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! > --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP working > group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal (who > had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working Group > meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later registered as > IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different networks > with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the East > Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts > connected." > --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting at ISI > -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, > naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] > --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became users > of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying > encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was reported > in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf > 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable byte > stream interface. > The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: > --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. > --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. to a > print server. > --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, echo, > etc.) > Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually > allowed that kind of flexibility. > 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and the > PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in the early > days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did not work > well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and b) > this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the > Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal developed > the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd generation DIX > Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network Systems > (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and endured > for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. > https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history From vint at google.com Wed Feb 4 05:25:31 2026 From: vint at google.com (Vint Cerf) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2026 08:25:31 -0500 Subject: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: INWG 39 was not exactly identical to the May 1974 paper - but it was certainly its origin. v On Wed, Feb 4, 2026 at 8:13?AM John Day via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > Let me add a little detail. > > > On Feb 3, 2026, at 15:23, John Shoch via Internet-history < > internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > > > > Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first Arpanet > > link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note (11/3/25) > > from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network tests of > > the TCP Internet at SRI: > > // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. > > // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and > > ARPANET. > > > > As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation and > > testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early work at > > Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and elsewhere. > > Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple > > networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path to > what > > became the Internet as we know it today. > > > > In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state of > the > > Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It took me a > > while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original > documents > > to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of interesting > > things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History Museum > > have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was > suggested > > "you should share it before we lose this history." > > > > So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in 1976 > > (as seen from a slightly different perspective): > > > > --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken place > at > > the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. > > It was at this meeting that Pouzin first presented where the CYCLADES > clean-slate approach to the network problem after seeing the ARPANET was > presented to a wide audience. CYCLADES was designed to do research on > networks, rather than a production network like the ARPANET. The > assumptions that CYCLADES made were considerably different than those for > the ARPANET. (BBN was doing what was required by the RFQ,) A few of the > differences were: > In the ARPANET, the IMPs were a front-end to the hosts. Hence the hosts > were not part of the network and had to be within 10m of the IMP. (Relaxing > that with DH, and VDH came later) In CYCLADES, the hosts were assumed not > to be near the CIGALE ?routers? and could be connected to more than one. > The ARPANET was basically a reliable virtual circuit network, while > CYCLADES was an unreliable ?best-effort? datagram network. > CYCLADES introduced end-to-end reliability (between the hosts) at the > Transport Layer. > > At the end of March 1973, Cerf and Kahn spent a day with Pouzin learning > more about CYCLADES. It was at this meeting that Gerard LeLann presented > his results on simulation of CYCLADES. > > In June 1973, the next INWG meeting was held at the NCC in New York. > McKenzie says that most of the discussion was between Metcalfe and > Zimmermann. Cerf said he would write up the minutes. (Cerf has produced a > draft protocol after this meeting and there are comments by Walden and > McKenzie at least those are the ones I have seen. > > > --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing > meetings > > at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the Cabana > > hotel in Palo Alto. > > From earlier emails with John, this meeting was 17 July 1973 > > On 13 Sept 73, Cerf issues the minutes for the June INWG meeting (INWG39), > noting in a cover letter that they had held the meetings at Stanford that > summer. INWG 39 is identical to the May 1974, Cerf/Kahn paper published by > IEEE. > > Oct 1973 INWG 42 ? L. Pouzin Interconnection of Packet Switched Networks. > INWG 43 Zimmermann/Elie Proposed Standard. In INWG42, Pouzin, in essence, > proposes the solution to internetworking as changing the name of the > Transport Layer to Internet Transport Layer and treating it as an overlay, > thereby avoiding any protocol translation. The only thing the supporting > networks have to do is meet the minimal service required by the Internet > Transport Layer. > > This leads to a debate between the two proposals and eventually a > synthesis of the two protocols known as INWG96, which was voted on in 1976 > and passed by a 2-1 margin. > > Meanwhile . . . at PARC . . . > > > That same summer there were early discussions at PARC > > about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply > called > > LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from Aug. 1973 > > reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL and > > ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for > > introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the > > discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to interconnect > > different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A > drawing > > includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. > > --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the alternative > > LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific > > protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would be a > need > > to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across geographies. > > Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it was > > also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed > something > > immediately. > > --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC Universal > > Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: > > "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is to > > promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell > that > > our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable > debate > > and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the > ball > > rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would include, > in > > arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) Arpanets, > > (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? > > [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a backbone > > packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial lines.] > > . > > --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and > > refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. > Progress > > was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by > Boggs > > and Taft: > > PUP Revisited > > PUP Converging > > Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP > > A Nova Gateway > > Implementation of PUP in Tenex > > PUP Again > > PUP Connection State Diagram > > PUP Servers on Maxc > > etc., etc., etc. > > > > --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? The > > best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 months > > earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. He > > reports: > > "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent > Ethernets > > (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs > > (Multiprocessor > > Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating at > > 1.6 mb/s). > > Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a > store-and-forward > > packet > > switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use of > > other > > transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth > local > > communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at modest > > bandwidths, > > and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." > > The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of > > Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, > Fragmentation, > > etc. > > I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of the > > complete final version. > > > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing > > > > --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in the > > Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current text > > file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, well-known > > sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used to > > initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The Tenex > > header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- > > PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. > > It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 MCAs, > > and the Arpanet. > > Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing > updates), > > FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. > > The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names (e.g., > > MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if connected > to > > more than one network). > > I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 > machines > > acting as Gateways: > > --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the Arpanet, > > --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, both > > MCAs, and the Arpanet. > > --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. > > There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font > > design and two for laser printer units). > > The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were not > > necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured as > > servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser printer, > > the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. > > There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of these were > > for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated Data > > Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal > > traffic). > > [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos in > > our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if no > one > > could find them via the name server, they could operate as client > machines > > on the PUP Internet.] > > This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines on > 5 > > networks of 3 types. > > > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing > > > > > > That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in March > > 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP Internet. > > > > John > > > > PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. > > 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very > > productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but the > > vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft and > > Boggs. > > 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general progress > with > > others. > > --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been encouraged > to > > "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's networking > > seminar. > > --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of us > > from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught by > > Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us undertook > > implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: evolving from > > the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new > > internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in the > > listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) to > > show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! > > --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP > working > > group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal > (who > > had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working > Group > > meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later registered as > > IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different networks > > with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the > East > > Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts > > connected." > > --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting at > ISI > > -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, > > naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] > > --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became > users > > of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying > > encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was reported > > in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf > > 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable byte > > stream interface. > > The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: > > --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. > > --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. to a > > print server. > > --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, > echo, > > etc.) > > Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually > > allowed that kind of flexibility. > > 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and the > > PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in the > early > > days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did not > work > > well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and b) > > this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the > > Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal developed > > the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd generation > DIX > > Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network Systems > > (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and > endured > > for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. > > https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 > > -- > > Internet-history mailing list > > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > > - > > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > -- Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: Vint Cerf Google, LLC 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor Reston, VA 20190 +1 (571) 213 1346 until further notice From aam3sendonly at gmail.com Wed Feb 4 05:31:28 2026 From: aam3sendonly at gmail.com (Alexander McKenzie) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2026 08:31:28 -0500 Subject: [ih] Fwd: Fw: Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service In-Reply-To: <1399776927.248973.1770211711937@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1399776927.248973.1770211711937@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Nice to hear you say that Vint. It has been repeatedly denied by your co-author. Cheers, Alex *From:* Vint Cerf via Internet-history *To:* John Day *Cc:* John Shoch ; John Shoch via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 4, 2026 at 08:25:56 AM EST *Subject:* Re: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service INWG 39 was not exactly identical to the May 1974 paper - but it was certainly its origin. v On Wed, Feb 4, 2026 at 8:13?AM John Day via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > Let me add a little detail. > > > On Feb 3, 2026, at 15:23, John Shoch via Internet-history < > internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > > > > Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first Arpanet > > link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note (11/3/25) > > from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network tests of > > the TCP Internet at SRI: > > // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. > > // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and > > ARPANET. > > > > As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation and > > testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early work at > > Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and elsewhere. > > Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple > > networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path to > what > > became the Internet as we know it today. > > > > In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state of > the > > Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It took me a > > while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original > documents > > to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of interesting > > things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History Museum > > have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was > suggested > > "you should share it before we lose this history." > > > > So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in 1976 > > (as seen from a slightly different perspective): > > > > --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken place > at > > the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. > > It was at this meeting that Pouzin first presented where the CYCLADES > clean-slate approach to the network problem after seeing the ARPANET was > presented to a wide audience. CYCLADES was designed to do research on > networks, rather than a production network like the ARPANET. The > assumptions that CYCLADES made were considerably different than those for > the ARPANET. (BBN was doing what was required by the RFQ,) A few of the > differences were: > In the ARPANET, the IMPs were a front-end to the hosts. Hence the hosts > were not part of the network and had to be within 10m of the IMP. (Relaxing > that with DH, and VDH came later) In CYCLADES, the hosts were assumed not > to be near the CIGALE ?routers? and could be connected to more than one. > The ARPANET was basically a reliable virtual circuit network, while > CYCLADES was an unreliable ?best-effort? datagram network. > CYCLADES introduced end-to-end reliability (between the hosts) at the > Transport Layer. > > At the end of March 1973, Cerf and Kahn spent a day with Pouzin learning > more about CYCLADES. It was at this meeting that Gerard LeLann presented > his results on simulation of CYCLADES. > > In June 1973, the next INWG meeting was held at the NCC in New York. > McKenzie says that most of the discussion was between Metcalfe and > Zimmermann. Cerf said he would write up the minutes. (Cerf has produced a > draft protocol after this meeting and there are comments by Walden and > McKenzie at least those are the ones I have seen. > > > --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing > meetings > > at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the Cabana > > hotel in Palo Alto. > > From earlier emails with John, this meeting was 17 July 1973 > > On 13 Sept 73, Cerf issues the minutes for the June INWG meeting (INWG39), > noting in a cover letter that they had held the meetings at Stanford that > summer. INWG 39 is identical to the May 1974, Cerf/Kahn paper published by > IEEE. > > Oct 1973 INWG 42 ? L. Pouzin Interconnection of Packet Switched Networks. > INWG 43 Zimmermann/Elie Proposed Standard. In INWG42, Pouzin, in essence, > proposes the solution to internetworking as changing the name of the > Transport Layer to Internet Transport Layer and treating it as an overlay, > thereby avoiding any protocol translation. The only thing the supporting > networks have to do is meet the minimal service required by the Internet > Transport Layer. > > This leads to a debate between the two proposals and eventually a > synthesis of the two protocols known as INWG96, which was voted on in 1976 > and passed by a 2-1 margin. > > Meanwhile . . . at PARC . . . > > > That same summer there were early discussions at PARC > > about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply > called > > LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from Aug. 1973 > > reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL and > > ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for > > introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the > > discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to interconnect > > different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A > drawing > > includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. > > --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the alternative > > LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific > > protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would be a > need > > to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across geographies. > > Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it was > > also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed > something > > immediately. > > --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC Universal > > Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: > > "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is to > > promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell > that > > our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable > debate > > and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the > ball > > rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would include, > in > > arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) Arpanets, > > (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? > > [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a backbone > > packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial lines.] > > . > > --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and > > refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. > Progress > > was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by > Boggs > > and Taft: > > PUP Revisited > > PUP Converging > > Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP > > A Nova Gateway > > Implementation of PUP in Tenex > > PUP Again > > PUP Connection State Diagram > > PUP Servers on Maxc > > etc., etc., etc. > > > > --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? The > > best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 months > > earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. He > > reports: > > "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent > Ethernets > > (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs > > (Multiprocessor > > Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating at > > 1.6 mb/s). > > Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a > store-and-forward > > packet > > switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use of > > other > > transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth > local > > communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at modest > > bandwidths, > > and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." > > The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of > > Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, > Fragmentation, > > etc. > > I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of the > > complete final version. > > > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing > > > > --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in the > > Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current text > > file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, well-known > > sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used to > > initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The Tenex > > header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- > > PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. > > It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 MCAs, > > and the Arpanet. > > Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing > updates), > > FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. > > The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names (e.g., > > MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if connected > to > > more than one network). > > I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 > machines > > acting as Gateways: > > --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the Arpanet, > > --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, both > > MCAs, and the Arpanet. > > --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. > > There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font > > design and two for laser printer units). > > The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were not > > necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured as > > servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser printer, > > the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. > > There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of these were > > for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated Data > > Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal > > traffic). > > [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos in > > our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if no > one > > could find them via the name server, they could operate as client > machines > > on the PUP Internet.] > > This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines on > 5 > > networks of 3 types. > > > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing > > > > > > That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in March > > 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP Internet. > > > > John > > > > PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. > > 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very > > productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but the > > vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft and > > Boggs. > > 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general progress > with > > others. > > --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been encouraged > to > > "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's networking > > seminar. > > --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of us > > from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught by > > Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us undertook > > implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: evolving from > > the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new > > internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in the > > listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) to > > show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! > > --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP > working > > group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal > (who > > had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working > Group > > meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later registered as > > IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different networks > > with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the > East > > Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts > > connected." > > --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting at > ISI > > -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, > > naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] > > --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became > users > > of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying > > encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was reported > > in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf > > 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable byte > > stream interface. > > The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: > > --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. > > --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. to a > > print server. > > --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, > echo, > > etc.) > > Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually > > allowed that kind of flexibility. > > 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and the > > PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in the > early > > days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did not > work > > well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and b) > > this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the > > Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal developed > > the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd generation > DIX > > Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network Systems > > (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and > endured > > for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. > > https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 > > -- > > Internet-history mailing list > > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > > - > > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > -- Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: Vint Cerf Google, LLC 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor Reston, VA 20190 +1 (571) 213 1346 until further notice -- Internet-history mailing list Internet-history at elists.isoc.org https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history - Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history From jeanjour at comcast.net Wed Feb 4 10:29:52 2026 From: jeanjour at comcast.net (John Day) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2026 13:29:52 -0500 Subject: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <287E58EC-4156-4BDC-BB65-4722A8D872DA@comcast.net> ;-) O, wow! I am going to have to go look again. When I compared them I had a hard time finding any differences. ;-) O, well. Thanks for the reply. > On Feb 4, 2026, at 08:25, Vint Cerf wrote: > > INWG 39 was not exactly identical to the May 1974 paper - but it was certainly its origin. > > v > > > On Wed, Feb 4, 2026 at 8:13?AM John Day via Internet-history > wrote: >> Let me add a little detail. >> >> > On Feb 3, 2026, at 15:23, John Shoch via Internet-history > wrote: >> > >> > Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first Arpanet >> > link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note (11/3/25) >> > from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network tests of >> > the TCP Internet at SRI: >> > // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. >> > // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and >> > ARPANET. >> > >> > As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation and >> > testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early work at >> > Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and elsewhere. >> > Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple >> > networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path to what >> > became the Internet as we know it today. >> > >> > In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state of the >> > Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It took me a >> > while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original documents >> > to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of interesting >> > things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History Museum >> > have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was suggested >> > "you should share it before we lose this history." >> > >> > So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in 1976 >> > (as seen from a slightly different perspective): >> > >> > --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken place at >> > the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. >> >> It was at this meeting that Pouzin first presented where the CYCLADES clean-slate approach to the network problem after seeing the ARPANET was presented to a wide audience. CYCLADES was designed to do research on networks, rather than a production network like the ARPANET. The assumptions that CYCLADES made were considerably different than those for the ARPANET. (BBN was doing what was required by the RFQ,) A few of the differences were: >> In the ARPANET, the IMPs were a front-end to the hosts. Hence the hosts were not part of the network and had to be within 10m of the IMP. (Relaxing that with DH, and VDH came later) In CYCLADES, the hosts were assumed not to be near the CIGALE ?routers? and could be connected to more than one. >> The ARPANET was basically a reliable virtual circuit network, while CYCLADES was an unreliable ?best-effort? datagram network. >> CYCLADES introduced end-to-end reliability (between the hosts) at the Transport Layer. >> >> At the end of March 1973, Cerf and Kahn spent a day with Pouzin learning more about CYCLADES. It was at this meeting that Gerard LeLann presented his results on simulation of CYCLADES. >> >> In June 1973, the next INWG meeting was held at the NCC in New York. McKenzie says that most of the discussion was between Metcalfe and Zimmermann. Cerf said he would write up the minutes. (Cerf has produced a draft protocol after this meeting and there are comments by Walden and McKenzie at least those are the ones I have seen. >> >> > --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing meetings >> > at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the Cabana >> > hotel in Palo Alto. >> >> From earlier emails with John, this meeting was 17 July 1973 >> >> On 13 Sept 73, Cerf issues the minutes for the June INWG meeting (INWG39), noting in a cover letter that they had held the meetings at Stanford that summer. INWG 39 is identical to the May 1974, Cerf/Kahn paper published by IEEE. >> >> Oct 1973 INWG 42 ? L. Pouzin Interconnection of Packet Switched Networks. >> INWG 43 Zimmermann/Elie Proposed Standard. In INWG42, Pouzin, in essence, proposes the solution to internetworking as changing the name of the Transport Layer to Internet Transport Layer and treating it as an overlay, thereby avoiding any protocol translation. The only thing the supporting networks have to do is meet the minimal service required by the Internet Transport Layer. >> >> This leads to a debate between the two proposals and eventually a synthesis of the two protocols known as INWG96, which was voted on in 1976 and passed by a 2-1 margin. >> >> Meanwhile . . . at PARC . . . >> >> > That same summer there were early discussions at PARC >> > about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply called >> > LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from Aug. 1973 >> > reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL and >> > ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for >> > introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the >> > discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to interconnect >> > different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A drawing >> > includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. >> > --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the alternative >> > LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific >> > protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would be a need >> > to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across geographies. >> > Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it was >> > also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed something >> > immediately. >> > --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC Universal >> > Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: >> > "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is to >> > promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell that >> > our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable debate >> > and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the ball >> > rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would include, in >> > arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) Arpanets, >> > (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? >> > [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a backbone >> > packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial lines.] >> > . >> > --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and >> > refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. Progress >> > was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by Boggs >> > and Taft: >> > PUP Revisited >> > PUP Converging >> > Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP >> > A Nova Gateway >> > Implementation of PUP in Tenex >> > PUP Again >> > PUP Connection State Diagram >> > PUP Servers on Maxc >> > etc., etc., etc. >> > >> > --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? The >> > best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 months >> > earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. He >> > reports: >> > "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent Ethernets >> > (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs >> > (Multiprocessor >> > Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating at >> > 1.6 mb/s). >> > Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a store-and-forward >> > packet >> > switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use of >> > other >> > transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth local >> > communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at modest >> > bandwidths, >> > and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." >> > The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of >> > Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, Fragmentation, >> > etc. >> > I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of the >> > complete final version. >> > >> > https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing >> > >> > --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in the >> > Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current text >> > file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, well-known >> > sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used to >> > initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The Tenex >> > header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- >> > PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. >> > It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 MCAs, >> > and the Arpanet. >> > Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing updates), >> > FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. >> > The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names (e.g., >> > MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if connected to >> > more than one network). >> > I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 machines >> > acting as Gateways: >> > --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the Arpanet, >> > --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, both >> > MCAs, and the Arpanet. >> > --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. >> > There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font >> > design and two for laser printer units). >> > The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were not >> > necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured as >> > servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser printer, >> > the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. >> > There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of these were >> > for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated Data >> > Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal >> > traffic). >> > [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos in >> > our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if no one >> > could find them via the name server, they could operate as client machines >> > on the PUP Internet.] >> > This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines on 5 >> > networks of 3 types. >> > >> > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing >> > >> > >> > That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in March >> > 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP Internet. >> > >> > John >> > >> > PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. >> > 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very >> > productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but the >> > vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft and >> > Boggs. >> > 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general progress with >> > others. >> > --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been encouraged to >> > "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's networking >> > seminar. >> > --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of us >> > from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught by >> > Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us undertook >> > implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: evolving from >> > the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new >> > internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in the >> > listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) to >> > show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! >> > --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP working >> > group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal (who >> > had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working Group >> > meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later registered as >> > IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different networks >> > with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the East >> > Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts >> > connected." >> > --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting at ISI >> > -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, >> > naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] >> > --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became users >> > of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying >> > encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was reported >> > in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf >> > 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable byte >> > stream interface. >> > The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: >> > --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. >> > --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. to a >> > print server. >> > --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, echo, >> > etc.) >> > Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually >> > allowed that kind of flexibility. >> > 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and the >> > PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in the early >> > days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did not work >> > well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and b) >> > this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the >> > Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal developed >> > the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd generation DIX >> > Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network Systems >> > (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and endured >> > for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. >> > https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 >> > -- >> > Internet-history mailing list >> > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >> > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >> > - >> > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >> >> -- >> Internet-history mailing list >> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >> - >> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > > > > -- > Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: > Vint Cerf > Google, LLC > 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor > Reston, VA 20190 > +1 (571) 213 1346 > > > until further notice > > > From gregskinner0 at icloud.com Wed Feb 4 22:01:26 2026 From: gregskinner0 at icloud.com (Greg Skinner) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2026 22:01:26 -0800 Subject: [ih] Fwd: Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service References: <893295064.548072.1770270577322@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8965737E-FE12-4453-A9E0-27D32DF38C94@icloud.com> Forwarded for Barbara > ----- Forwarded Message ----- > From: Barbara Denny > To: internet-history > Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2026 at 09:34:45 PM PST > Subject: Re: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service > > Having trouble with the mailing list again so not all the text for this thread is included. > > This discussion covers a time period before I worked on packet radio. John Shoch's recollection made me curious about when TCP was first used over packet radio and when the first generation radios (EPRs?) were available. The place I have started to look for this information is the TIU (Terminal Interface Unit). The TIU had TCP and TELNET. It also had SPP (station-packet-radio protocol) to improve reliability and support for other functions. FYI, I think the early packet radios had an 1822 interface. > > I haven't found definitive answers to my questions but I did find a a webpage that has some links to documentation in case you are interested in the TIU. > > https://gunkies.org/wiki/Terminal_Interface_Unit > > BTW, the use of DSP on this web page does not mean Digital Signal Processing. It refers to the Dispatch/SPP modules. > > > barbara > > > On Tuesday, February 3, 2026 at 12:23:55 PM PST, John Shoch via Internet-history wrote: > > > Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first Arpanet > link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note (11/3/25) > from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network tests of > the TCP Internet at SRI: > // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. > // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and > ARPANET. > > As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation and > testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early work at > Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and elsewhere. > Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple > networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path to what > became the Internet as we know it today. > > In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state of the > Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It took me a > while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original documents > to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of interesting > things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History Museum > have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was suggested > "you should share it before we lose this history." > > So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in 1976 > (as seen from a slightly different perspective): > > --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken place at > the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. > --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing meetings > at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the Cabana > hotel in Palo Alto. That same summer there were early discussions at PARC > about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply called > LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from Aug. 1973 > reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL and > ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for > introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the > discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to interconnect > different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A drawing > includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. > --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the alternative > LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific > protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would be a need > to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across geographies. > Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it was > also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed something > immediately. > --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC Universal > Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: > "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is to > promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell that > our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable debate > and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the ball > rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would include, in > arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) Arpanets, > (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? > [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a backbone > packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial lines.] > . > --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and > refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. Progress > was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by Boggs > and Taft: > PUP Revisited > PUP Converging > Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP > A Nova Gateway > Implementation of PUP in Tenex > PUP Again > PUP Connection State Diagram > PUP Servers on Maxc > etc., etc., etc. > > --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? The > best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 months > earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. He > reports: > "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent Ethernets > (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs > (Multiprocessor > Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating at > 1.6 mb/s). > Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a store-and-forward > packet > switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use of > other > transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth local > communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at modest > bandwidths, > and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." > The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of > Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, Fragmentation, > etc. > I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of the > complete final version. > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing > > --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in the > Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current text > file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, well-known > sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used to > initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The Tenex > header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- > PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. > It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 MCAs, > and the Arpanet. > Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing updates), > FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. > The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names (e.g., > MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if connected to > more than one network). > I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 machines > acting as Gateways: > --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the Arpanet, > --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, both > MCAs, and the Arpanet. > --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. > There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font > design and two for laser printer units). > The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were not > necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured as > servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser printer, > the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. > There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of these were > for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated Data > Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal > traffic). > [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos in > our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if no one > could find them via the name server, they could operate as client machines > on the PUP Internet.] > This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines on 5 > networks of 3 types. > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing > > > That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in March > 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP Internet. > > John > > PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. > 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very > productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but the > vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft and > Boggs. > 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general progress with > others. > --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been encouraged to > "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's networking > seminar. > --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of us > from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught by > Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us undertook > implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: evolving from > the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new > internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in the > listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) to > show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! > --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP working > group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal (who > had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working Group > meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later registered as > IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different networks > with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the East > Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts > connected." > --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting at ISI > -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, > naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] > --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became users > of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying > encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was reported > in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf > 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable byte > stream interface. > The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: > --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. > --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. to a > print server. > --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, echo, > etc.) > Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually > allowed that kind of flexibility. > 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and the > PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in the early > days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did not work > well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and b) > this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the > Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal developed > the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd generation DIX > Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network Systems > (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and endured > for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. > https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 > From vint at google.com Thu Feb 5 04:10:22 2026 From: vint at google.com (Vint Cerf) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2026 07:10:22 -0500 Subject: [ih] Fwd: Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service In-Reply-To: <8965737E-FE12-4453-A9E0-27D32DF38C94@icloud.com> References: <893295064.548072.1770270577322@mail.yahoo.com> <8965737E-FE12-4453-A9E0-27D32DF38C94@icloud.com> Message-ID: Jim Mathis did the TIU system - must have been circa 1975/1976 vint On Thu, Feb 5, 2026 at 1:01?AM Greg Skinner via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > Forwarded for Barbara > > > ----- Forwarded Message ----- > > From: Barbara Denny > > To: internet-history > > Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2026 at 09:34:45 PM PST > > Subject: Re: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link > Put Into Service > > > > Having trouble with the mailing list again so not all the text for this > thread is included. > > > > This discussion covers a time period before I worked on packet radio. > John Shoch's recollection made me curious about when TCP was first used > over packet radio and when the first generation radios (EPRs?) were > available. The place I have started to look for this information is the TIU > (Terminal Interface Unit). The TIU had TCP and TELNET. It also had SPP > (station-packet-radio protocol) to improve reliability and support for > other functions. FYI, I think the early packet radios had an 1822 > interface. > > > > I haven't found definitive answers to my questions but I did find a a > webpage that has some links to documentation in case you are interested in > the TIU. > > > > https://gunkies.org/wiki/Terminal_Interface_Unit > > > > BTW, the use of DSP on this web page does not mean Digital Signal > Processing. It refers to the Dispatch/SPP modules. > > > > > > barbara > > > > > > On Tuesday, February 3, 2026 at 12:23:55 PM PST, John Shoch via > Internet-history wrote: > > > > > > Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first Arpanet > > link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note (11/3/25) > > from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network tests of > > the TCP Internet at SRI: > > // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. > > // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and > > ARPANET. > > > > As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation and > > testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early work at > > Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and elsewhere. > > Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple > > networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path to > what > > became the Internet as we know it today. > > > > In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state of > the > > Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It took me a > > while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original > documents > > to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of interesting > > things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History Museum > > have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was > suggested > > "you should share it before we lose this history." > > > > So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in 1976 > > (as seen from a slightly different perspective): > > > > --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken place > at > > the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. > > --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing > meetings > > at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the Cabana > > hotel in Palo Alto. That same summer there were early discussions at > PARC > > about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply > called > > LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from Aug. 1973 > > reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL and > > ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for > > introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the > > discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to interconnect > > different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A > drawing > > includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. > > --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the alternative > > LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific > > protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would be a > need > > to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across geographies. > > Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it was > > also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed > something > > immediately. > > --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC Universal > > Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: > > "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is to > > promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell > that > > our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable > debate > > and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the > ball > > rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would include, > in > > arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) Arpanets, > > (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? > > [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a backbone > > packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial lines.] > > . > > --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and > > refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. > Progress > > was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by > Boggs > > and Taft: > > PUP Revisited > > PUP Converging > > Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP > > A Nova Gateway > > Implementation of PUP in Tenex > > PUP Again > > PUP Connection State Diagram > > PUP Servers on Maxc > > etc., etc., etc. > > > > --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? The > > best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 months > > earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. He > > reports: > > "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent > Ethernets > > (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs > > (Multiprocessor > > Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating at > > 1.6 mb/s). > > Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a > store-and-forward > > packet > > switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use of > > other > > transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth > local > > communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at modest > > bandwidths, > > and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." > > The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of > > Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, > Fragmentation, > > etc. > > I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of the > > complete final version. > > > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing > > > > --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in the > > Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current text > > file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, well-known > > sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used to > > initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The Tenex > > header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- > > PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. > > It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 MCAs, > > and the Arpanet. > > Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing > updates), > > FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. > > The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names (e.g., > > MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if connected > to > > more than one network). > > I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 > machines > > acting as Gateways: > > --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the Arpanet, > > --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, both > > MCAs, and the Arpanet. > > --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. > > There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font > > design and two for laser printer units). > > The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were not > > necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured as > > servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser printer, > > the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. > > There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of these were > > for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated Data > > Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal > > traffic). > > [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos in > > our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if no > one > > could find them via the name server, they could operate as client > machines > > on the PUP Internet.] > > This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines on > 5 > > networks of 3 types. > > > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing > > > > > > That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in March > > 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP Internet. > > > > John > > > > PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. > > 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very > > productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but the > > vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft and > > Boggs. > > 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general progress > with > > others. > > --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been encouraged > to > > "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's networking > > seminar. > > --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of us > > from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught by > > Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us undertook > > implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: evolving from > > the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new > > internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in the > > listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) to > > show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! > > --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP > working > > group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal > (who > > had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working > Group > > meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later registered as > > IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different networks > > with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the > East > > Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts > > connected." > > --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting at > ISI > > -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, > > naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] > > --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became > users > > of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying > > encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was reported > > in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf > > 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable byte > > stream interface. > > The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: > > --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. > > --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. to a > > print server. > > --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, > echo, > > etc.) > > Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually > > allowed that kind of flexibility. > > 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and the > > PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in the > early > > days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did not > work > > well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and b) > > this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the > > Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal developed > > the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd generation > DIX > > Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network Systems > > (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and > endured > > for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. > > https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 > > > > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > -- Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: Vint Cerf Google, LLC 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor Reston, VA 20190 +1 (571) 213 1346 until further notice From stewart at serissa.com Thu Feb 5 04:48:32 2026 From: stewart at serissa.com (Lawrence Stewart) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2026 07:48:32 -0500 Subject: [ih] Early internetworking In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44A565DA-8E02-45FB-8334-23C15E1EDE90@serissa.com> In 1978 the Packet Radios for PRNet were built by Collins and indeed had BBN-1822 host interfaces. I was an intern at PARC at the time and designed the Alto-1822(1) to work with it. The low level link protocol was indeed not like the IMPs. The one we used was called CAP for Channel Access Protocol. The MTU was quite small and we had to fragment PUPs for transit. Hal Murray had written a Pup Stack/gateway in Mesa and we used that for our work. There are great PRNet stories though. According to lore, the Collins manager wanted absolute control over the radio software and insisted it be kept in a box of punched cards in his office. IEN 78 has more information, and the software is still out there in the computer museum?s collection. (1) Dave Boggs looked at my draft design and said ?You obviously do not know what you are doing.? and then taught me the right way to design state machines. -L From vint at google.com Thu Feb 5 04:52:01 2026 From: vint at google.com (Vint Cerf) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2026 07:52:01 -0500 Subject: [ih] Early internetworking In-Reply-To: <44A565DA-8E02-45FB-8334-23C15E1EDE90@serissa.com> References: <44A565DA-8E02-45FB-8334-23C15E1EDE90@serissa.com> Message-ID: great reference and story about Boggs!!! thanks v On Thu, Feb 5, 2026 at 7:48?AM Lawrence Stewart via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > In 1978 the Packet Radios for PRNet were built by Collins and indeed had > BBN-1822 host interfaces. > > I was an intern at PARC at the time and designed the Alto-1822(1) to work > with it. The low level link protocol was indeed not like the IMPs. The one > we used was called CAP for Channel Access Protocol. > > The MTU was quite small and we had to fragment PUPs for transit. Hal > Murray had written a Pup Stack/gateway in Mesa and we used that for our > work. > > There are great PRNet stories though. According to lore, the Collins > manager wanted absolute control over the radio software and insisted it be > kept in a box of punched cards in his office. > > IEN 78 has more information, and the software is still out there in the > computer museum?s collection. > > (1) Dave Boggs looked at my draft design and said ?You obviously do not > know what you are doing.? and then taught me the right way to design state > machines. > > -L > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > -- Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: Vint Cerf Google, LLC 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor Reston, VA 20190 +1 (571) 213 1346 until further notice From vgcerf at gmail.com Thu Feb 5 04:53:06 2026 From: vgcerf at gmail.com (vinton cerf) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2026 07:53:06 -0500 Subject: [ih] Early internetworking In-Reply-To: <44A565DA-8E02-45FB-8334-23C15E1EDE90@serissa.com> References: <44A565DA-8E02-45FB-8334-23C15E1EDE90@serissa.com> Message-ID: https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf v On Thu, Feb 5, 2026 at 7:48?AM Lawrence Stewart via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > In 1978 the Packet Radios for PRNet were built by Collins and indeed had > BBN-1822 host interfaces. > > I was an intern at PARC at the time and designed the Alto-1822(1) to work > with it. The low level link protocol was indeed not like the IMPs. The one > we used was called CAP for Channel Access Protocol. > > The MTU was quite small and we had to fragment PUPs for transit. Hal > Murray had written a Pup Stack/gateway in Mesa and we used that for our > work. > > There are great PRNet stories though. According to lore, the Collins > manager wanted absolute control over the radio software and insisted it be > kept in a box of punched cards in his office. > > IEN 78 has more information, and the software is still out there in the > computer museum?s collection. > > (1) Dave Boggs looked at my draft design and said ?You obviously do not > know what you are doing.? and then taught me the right way to design state > machines. > > -L > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > From vgcerf at gmail.com Sun Feb 8 04:47:46 2026 From: vgcerf at gmail.com (vinton cerf) Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2026 07:47:46 -0500 Subject: [ih] David Farber has passed away Message-ID: >From Jun Murai: We are heartbroken to report that our colleague -- our mentor, friend, and conscience -- David J. Farber passed away suddenly at his home in Roppongi, Tokyo. He left us on Saturday, Feb. 7, 2026, at the too-young age of 91. Sincerely, Jun From joly at punkcast.com Sun Feb 8 06:11:12 2026 From: joly at punkcast.com (Joly MacFie) Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2026 09:11:12 -0500 Subject: [ih] David Farber has passed away In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sorry to hear that. I got to spend time with him during his sojourn in NYC before relocating to Japan. I arranged for him to speak at NYU - "A History of the Internet" https://youtu.be/i0ZOXmj7Fmc Joly On Sun, Feb 8, 2026 at 7:47?AM vinton cerf via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > From Jun Murai: > > We are heartbroken to report that our colleague -- our mentor, friend, and > conscience -- David J. Farber passed away suddenly at his home in Roppongi, > Tokyo. He left us on Saturday, Feb. 7, 2026, at the too-young age of 91. > > Sincerely, > Jun > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > > -- -------------------------------------- Joly MacFie +12185659365 -------------------------------------- - From karl at iwl.com Sun Feb 8 11:32:01 2026 From: karl at iwl.com (Karl Auerbach) Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2026 11:32:01 -0800 Subject: [ih] David Farber has passed away In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <87820aca-0267-4df4-b2b5-0abc778f2ea9@iwl.com> Dave Farber was, indirectly, my mentor.? His DCS project was, to me, a revelation, a view of a network as less a collection of machines connected by communications links and more as complex, distributed system that exhibited feedback pressures and loops, race conditions, and other aspects more familiar to those who work with distributed industrial or biological processes. Dave Farber has left a large and positive mark on our world. ? ? ? ? --karl-- On 2/8/26 4:47 AM, vinton cerf via Internet-history wrote: > From Jun Murai: > > We are heartbroken to report that our colleague -- our mentor, friend, and > conscience -- David J. Farber passed away suddenly at his home in Roppongi, > Tokyo. He left us on Saturday, Feb. 7, 2026, at the too-young age of 91. > > Sincerely, > Jun From rsk at gsp.org Sun Feb 8 13:36:25 2026 From: rsk at gsp.org (Rich Kulawiec) Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2026 16:36:25 -0500 Subject: [ih] David Farber has passed away In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20260208213625.GA17070@gsp.org> ----- Forwarded message from "Cherry, Hei Yui WONG" ----- > From: "Cherry, Hei Yui WONG" > Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2026 11:06:40 +0900 > Subject: Sad news: Dave Farber has passed away > > We are heartbroken to report that our colleague -- our mentor, friend, and > conscience -- David J. Farber passed away suddenly at his home in Roppongi, > Tokyo. He left us on Saturday, Feb. 7, 2026, at the too-young age of 91. > > To his son Manny, he was simply ???Dad???, his bedrock whom he will miss > immeasurably. They spoke almost daily by video throughout his time in > Japan, and shared special times on numerous visits. He is survived by son > Manny Farber and daughter-in-law Mei Xu, daughter-in-law Carol Hagan and > grandsons Nate Farber and Sam Farber. He was preceded in death by his wife > Gloria (G.G.) and son Joe Farber. > > Dave???s career began with his education at Stevens Institute of Technology, > which he loved deeply and served as a Trustee. He joined the legendary Bell > Labs during its heyday, and worked at the Rand Corporation. Along the way, > among countless other activities, he served as Chief Technologist of the > U.S. Federal Communications Commission; became a proficient > (instrument-rated) pilot; and was an active board member of the Electronic > Frontier Foundation, a digital civil-liberties organization. > > His professional accomplishments and impact are almost endless, but often > captured by one moniker: ???grandfather of the Internet,??? acknowledging the > foundational contributions made by his many students at the University of > California, Irvine; the University of Delaware; the University of > Pennsylvania; and Carnegie Mellon University > > In 2018, at the age of 83, Dave moved to Japan to become Distinguished > Professor at Keio University and Co-Director of the Keio Cyber Civilization > Research Center (CCRC). He loved teaching, and taught his final class on > January 22, 2026. > > At CCRC, one of his most enjoyable activities was co-hosting the IP-Asia > online gathering, which has met every Monday for more than five years and > has addressed many aspects of the impact of technology on civilization. > Dave thrived in Japan in every way. > > We, the IP-Asia community, will gather for an online remembrance of Dave at > the usual time and place, 2100 JST on Monday, February 9, 2026. > > It???s impossible to summarize a life and career as rich and long as Dave???s > in our few words here. And each of us, even those who knew him for decades, > represent just one facet of his life. But because we are here at its end, > we have the sad duty of sharing this news. Further information and a more > formal obituary are forthcoming. > > With condolences to Manny and the rest of the family, > > Jiro Kokuryo > Cherry Wong > Kaori Suzuki > Rodney Van Meter > Dan Gillmor > > Manny can be reached at manny.farber at gmail.com. ----- End forwarded message ----- From jmamodio at gmail.com Sun Feb 8 13:41:43 2026 From: jmamodio at gmail.com (Jorge Amodio) Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2026 15:41:43 -0600 Subject: [ih] David Farber has passed away In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sad news, RIP Dave. Condolences to friends and family. -J On Sun, Feb 8, 2026 at 6:48?AM vinton cerf via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > From Jun Murai: > > We are heartbroken to report that our colleague -- our mentor, friend, and > conscience -- David J. Farber passed away suddenly at his home in Roppongi, > Tokyo. He left us on Saturday, Feb. 7, 2026, at the too-young age of 91. > > Sincerely, > Jun > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > From lk at cs.ucla.edu Sun Feb 8 15:08:38 2026 From: lk at cs.ucla.edu (Leonard Kleinrock) Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2026 15:08:38 -0800 Subject: [ih] David Farber has passed away In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7EA88B48-032A-4F83-9AAF-6F89E0005344@cs.ucla.edu> So sad to see a good friend and wonderful colleague pass. He was a strong, humble, and amazing contributor from the earliest days. Len > On Feb 8, 2026, at 1:41?PM, Jorge Amodio via Internet-history wrote: > > Sad news, RIP Dave. Condolences to friends and family. > > -J > > On Sun, Feb 8, 2026 at 6:48?AM vinton cerf via Internet-history < > internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > >> From Jun Murai: >> >> We are heartbroken to report that our colleague -- our mentor, friend, and >> conscience -- David J. Farber passed away suddenly at his home in Roppongi, >> Tokyo. He left us on Saturday, Feb. 7, 2026, at the too-young age of 91. >> >> Sincerely, >> Jun >> -- >> Internet-history mailing list >> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >> - >> Unsubscribe: >> https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >> > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history From professorpeteranderson at gmail.com Sun Feb 8 22:36:27 2026 From: professorpeteranderson at gmail.com (Peter Anderson) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 10:36:27 +0400 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book Message-ID: *(Apologies for cross-posting)* As a researcher, I have never come across a highly intensive and inclusive book like "The Internet Ecosystem". The book englobes the whole Internet Ecosystem with the correct information compared to misleading information from blogs/wikipedia on the Internet. This book was reviewed by Vint Cerf. I have just completed the reading, I will highly recommend it and it is nice to have a copy to keep for reference. Professor Peter Anderson Head of Research ------------------------------ *From:* Nikesh B. Simmandree *Sent:* Monday, August 18, 2025 1:35 PM *To:* alac-announce at icann.org ; alac at icann.org < alac at icann.org>; at-large at icann.org ; afri-discuss at icann.org *Subject:* Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book Dear Community, I am thrilled to announce the launch of my book, *The Internet Ecosystem* ? a comprehensive exploration of the history, architecture, governance, and future of the Internet. This book distills decades of technological evolution ? from ARPANET and packet switching, to AI, Web3, quantum networks, and beyond ? into a clear, engaging narrative accessible to both technical and non-technical readers *What the Book Covers* - *The Past:* How Cold War research, ARPANET, and packet switching gave birth to the Internet we know today. - *The Present:* The intricate roles of ISPs, backbone providers, cloud infrastructure, AI, cybersecurity, and global governance shaping our daily online experiences. - *The Future:* Insights into 5G/6G, blockchain, immersive technologies, quantum security, and the Internet in 2050. With *49 detailed chapters*, the book provides a definitive yet approachable reference for students, professionals, policymakers, and curious readers alike. My mission with *The Internet Ecosystem* is to make the Internet?s complexity understandable ? showing not only *how* the Internet works, but also *why* it matters and has become one of the most transformative human inventions ? while sparking dialogue on how we build a secure, inclusive, and sustainable digital future. In the 21st century, understanding the Internet is not optional ? it?s essential. Whether you?re a business leader, policymaker, educator, student, or everyday Internet user, this book provides the context and clarity you need to navigate the opportunities and challenges of our connected world. *Get Your Copy* *The Internet Ecosystem* is now available: https://payhip.com/b/hfvYg Thank you, Best Regards, Nikesh B. Simmandree +230-5-907-3413 nikeshbs at outlook.com This message and its attachments are intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and are strictly confidential. If you have received this in error, please delete it from any devices after having informed the sender. From gbuday.irtf at gmail.com Sun Feb 8 23:52:52 2026 From: gbuday.irtf at gmail.com (Gergely Buday) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 07:52:52 +0000 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dear Vint Cerf, did you really proofread this book? Yours - Gergely On Mon, 9 Feb 2026 at 06:36, Peter Anderson via Internet-history wrote: > > *(Apologies for cross-posting)* > > As a researcher, I have never come across a highly intensive and inclusive > book like "The Internet Ecosystem". The book englobes the whole Internet > Ecosystem with the correct information compared to misleading > information from blogs/wikipedia on the Internet. This book was reviewed by > Vint Cerf. I have just completed the reading, I will highly recommend it > and it is nice to have a copy to keep for reference. > > Professor Peter Anderson > Head of Research > ------------------------------ > *From:* Nikesh B. Simmandree > *Sent:* Monday, August 18, 2025 1:35 PM > *To:* alac-announce at icann.org ; alac at icann.org < > alac at icann.org>; at-large at icann.org ; > afri-discuss at icann.org > *Subject:* Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book > > Dear Community, > > I am thrilled to announce the launch of my book, *The Internet Ecosystem* ? > a comprehensive exploration of the history, architecture, governance, and > future of the Internet. > This book distills decades of technological evolution ? from ARPANET and > packet switching, to AI, Web3, quantum networks, and beyond ? into a clear, > engaging narrative accessible to both technical and non-technical readers > > *What the Book Covers* > > - *The Past:* How Cold War research, ARPANET, and packet switching gave > birth to the Internet we know today. > - *The Present:* The intricate roles of ISPs, backbone providers, cloud > infrastructure, AI, cybersecurity, and global governance shaping our daily > online experiences. > - *The Future:* Insights into 5G/6G, blockchain, immersive technologies, > quantum security, and the Internet in 2050. > > With *49 detailed chapters*, the book provides a definitive yet > approachable reference for students, professionals, policymakers, and > curious readers alike. > > My mission with *The Internet Ecosystem* is to make the Internet?s > complexity understandable ? showing not only *how* the Internet works, but > also *why* it matters and has become one of the most transformative human > inventions ? while sparking dialogue on how we build a secure, inclusive, > and sustainable digital future. > In the 21st century, understanding the Internet is not optional ? it?s > essential. Whether you?re a business leader, policymaker, educator, > student, or everyday Internet user, this book provides the context and > clarity you need to navigate the opportunities and challenges of our > connected world. > > *Get Your Copy* > *The Internet Ecosystem* is now available: https://payhip.com/b/hfvYg > > Thank you, > > Best Regards, > Nikesh B. Simmandree > +230-5-907-3413 > nikeshbs at outlook.com > > This message and its attachments are intended only for the person or entity > to which it is addressed and are strictly confidential. If you have > received this in error, please delete it from any devices after having > informed the sender. > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history From el at lisse.na Mon Feb 9 00:53:07 2026 From: el at lisse.na (Eberhard W Lisse) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 10:53:07 +0200 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> AI Slop Spam el -- Sent from my iPhone On Feb 9, 2026 at 09:53 +0200, Gergely Buday via Internet-history , wrote: > Dear Vint Cerf, > > did you really proofread this book? > > Yours > > - Gergely > > On Mon, 9 Feb 2026 at 06:36, Peter Anderson via Internet-history > wrote: > > > > *(Apologies for cross-posting)* > > > > As a researcher, I have never come across a highly intensive and inclusive > > book like "The Internet Ecosystem". The book englobes the whole Internet > > Ecosystem with the correct information compared to misleading > > information from blogs/wikipedia on the Internet. This book was reviewed by > > Vint Cerf. I have just completed the reading, I will highly recommend it > > and it is nice to have a copy to keep for reference. > > > > Professor Peter Anderson > > Head of Research > > ------------------------------ > > *From:* Nikesh B. Simmandree > > *Sent:* Monday, August 18, 2025 1:35 PM > > *To:* alac-announce at icann.org ; alac at icann.org < > > alac at icann.org>; at-large at icann.org ; > > afri-discuss at icann.org > > *Subject:* Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book > > > > Dear Community, > > > > I am thrilled to announce the launch of my book, *The Internet Ecosystem* ? > > a comprehensive exploration of the history, architecture, governance, and > > future of the Internet. > > This book distills decades of technological evolution ? from ARPANET and > > packet switching, to AI, Web3, quantum networks, and beyond ? into a clear, > > engaging narrative accessible to both technical and non-technical readers > > > > *What the Book Covers* > > > > - *The Past:* How Cold War research, ARPANET, and packet switching gave > > birth to the Internet we know today. > > - *The Present:* The intricate roles of ISPs, backbone providers, cloud > > infrastructure, AI, cybersecurity, and global governance shaping our daily > > online experiences. > > - *The Future:* Insights into 5G/6G, blockchain, immersive technologies, > > quantum security, and the Internet in 2050. > > > > With *49 detailed chapters*, the book provides a definitive yet > > approachable reference for students, professionals, policymakers, and > > curious readers alike. > > > > My mission with *The Internet Ecosystem* is to make the Internet?s > > complexity understandable ? showing not only *how* the Internet works, but > > also *why* it matters and has become one of the most transformative human > > inventions ? while sparking dialogue on how we build a secure, inclusive, > > and sustainable digital future. > > In the 21st century, understanding the Internet is not optional ? it?s > > essential. Whether you?re a business leader, policymaker, educator, > > student, or everyday Internet user, this book provides the context and > > clarity you need to navigate the opportunities and challenges of our > > connected world. > > > > *Get Your Copy* > > *The Internet Ecosystem* is now available: https://payhip.com/b/hfvYg > > > > Thank you, > > > > Best Regards, > > Nikesh B. Simmandree > > +230-5-907-3413 > > nikeshbs at outlook.com > > > > This message and its attachments are intended only for the person or entity > > to which it is addressed and are strictly confidential. If you have > > received this in error, please delete it from any devices after having > > informed the sender. > > -- > > Internet-history mailing list > > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > > - > > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history From carsten at schiefner.berlin Mon Feb 9 01:12:19 2026 From: carsten at schiefner.berlin (Carsten Schiefner) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 10:12:19 +0100 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> Message-ID: <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> Am 09.02.2026 um 09:53 schrieb Eberhard W Lisse via Internet-history : > > ?AI Slop Spam You can?t say that for sure, Eberhard - as the recommendation below comes from Professor Peter Anderson, Head of Research at - and in the absence of any other information, I can only take his email domain as a basis for it - Gmail. ;-> >> On Feb 9, 2026 at 09:53 +0200, Gergely Buday via Internet-history , wrote: >> Dear Vint Cerf, >> >> did you really proofread this book? >> >> Yours >> >> - Gergely >> >>> On Mon, 9 Feb 2026 at 06:36, Peter Anderson via Internet-history >>> wrote: >>> >>> *(Apologies for cross-posting)* >>> >>> As a researcher, I have never come across a highly intensive and inclusive >>> book like "The Internet Ecosystem". The book englobes the whole Internet >>> Ecosystem with the correct information compared to misleading >>> information from blogs/wikipedia on the Internet. This book was reviewed by >>> Vint Cerf. I have just completed the reading, I will highly recommend it >>> and it is nice to have a copy to keep for reference. >>> >>> Professor Peter Anderson >>> Head of Research >>> ------------------------------ >>> *From:* Nikesh B. Simmandree >>> *Sent:* Monday, August 18, 2025 1:35 PM >>> *To:* alac-announce at icann.org ; alac at icann.org < >>> alac at icann.org>; at-large at icann.org ; >>> afri-discuss at icann.org >>> *Subject:* Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book >>> >>> Dear Community, >>> >>> I am thrilled to announce the launch of my book, *The Internet Ecosystem* ? >>> a comprehensive exploration of the history, architecture, governance, and >>> future of the Internet. >>> This book distills decades of technological evolution ? from ARPANET and >>> packet switching, to AI, Web3, quantum networks, and beyond ? into a clear, >>> engaging narrative accessible to both technical and non-technical readers >>> >>> *What the Book Covers* >>> >>> - *The Past:* How Cold War research, ARPANET, and packet switching gave >>> birth to the Internet we know today. >>> - *The Present:* The intricate roles of ISPs, backbone providers, cloud >>> infrastructure, AI, cybersecurity, and global governance shaping our daily >>> online experiences. >>> - *The Future:* Insights into 5G/6G, blockchain, immersive technologies, >>> quantum security, and the Internet in 2050. >>> >>> With *49 detailed chapters*, the book provides a definitive yet >>> approachable reference for students, professionals, policymakers, and >>> curious readers alike. >>> >>> My mission with *The Internet Ecosystem* is to make the Internet?s >>> complexity understandable ? showing not only *how* the Internet works, but >>> also *why* it matters and has become one of the most transformative human >>> inventions ? while sparking dialogue on how we build a secure, inclusive, >>> and sustainable digital future. >>> In the 21st century, understanding the Internet is not optional ? it?s >>> essential. Whether you?re a business leader, policymaker, educator, >>> student, or everyday Internet user, this book provides the context and >>> clarity you need to navigate the opportunities and challenges of our >>> connected world. >>> >>> *Get Your Copy* >>> *The Internet Ecosystem* is now available: https://payhip.com/b/hfvYg >>> >>> Thank you, >>> >>> Best Regards, >>> Nikesh B. Simmandree >>> +230-5-907-3413 >>> nikeshbs at outlook.com >>> >>> This message and its attachments are intended only for the person or entity >>> to which it is addressed and are strictly confidential. If you have >>> received this in error, please delete it from any devices after having >>> informed the sender. >>> -- >>> Internet-history mailing list >>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>> - >>> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >> -- >> Internet-history mailing list >> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >> - >> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history From olejacobsen at me.com Mon Feb 9 02:34:04 2026 From: olejacobsen at me.com (Ole Jacobsen) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 17:34:04 +0700 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> Message-ID: I actually got a copy of this book. The author refused to provide a review copy due to his ?contract with the publisher.? So I paid $30-something and received my unique URL to download the PDF. My reviewer refused to provide a review stating that he would have NOTHING good to say about the work, instead suggesting we all read: Geopolitics at the Internet?s Core, by Fiona M. Alexander, Laura DeNardis, Nanette S. Levinson, and Francesca Musiani, ISBN 978-3-031-89477-0, Springer Nature, 2025. ? which he DID review in the December 2025 issue of IPJ. Ole Ole J. Jacobsen Editor & Publisher The Internet Protocol Journal Office: +1 415 550-9433 Cell: +1 415 370-4628 Norway cell: +47 98 00 26 30 UK Cell: +44 7805 977 889 Docomo Japan: +81 90 3337 9311? http://protocoljournal.org Sent from my iPhone > On Feb 9, 2026, at 15:53, Eberhard W Lisse via Internet-history wrote: > > ?AI Slop Spam > > el > From vint at google.com Mon Feb 9 04:33:13 2026 From: vint at google.com (Vint Cerf) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 07:33:13 -0500 Subject: [ih] Fwd: Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service In-Reply-To: References: <893295064.548072.1770270577322@mail.yahoo.com> <8965737E-FE12-4453-A9E0-27D32DF38C94@icloud.com> Message-ID: thanks Don!! we were trying to figure out early efforts at bridging networks - PRNET was a key project for exploring that concept. v On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 3:46?AM Don Nielson wrote: > Vint, Barbara, and all, > I'm not sure I understand the impetus for all this but thought I'd try to > help pin down some dates in the early use of the TIU and TCP. > > The first I could find was in a Packet Radio Quarterly Report covering > 1 May 1976 to 31 July 1976. During that time a gateway was in the > station computer and was first just doing header swaps between the > ARPANET and the PRNET. But in the same period the LSI-11 TIU was > there running a single-connection user version TCP. Rather that try > to describe what was written, I've attached three images of the report > and the text. Reference to the description of the TIU architecture > also included Dave Retz as the lead author so his hand was in it > as well, probably more to do with the MOS operating system and > the ELF processes working there. I've also attached a process > diagram of the TIU circa Feb 1977. > > Hope this helps. > Don > > > > > On 2/5/26 4:10 AM, Vint Cerf wrote: > > Jim Mathis did the TIU system - must have been circa 1975/1976 > vint > > > On Thu, Feb 5, 2026 at 1:01?AM Greg Skinner via Internet-history < > internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > >> Forwarded for Barbara >> >> > ----- Forwarded Message ----- >> > From: Barbara Denny >> > To: internet-history >> > Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2026 at 09:34:45 PM PST >> > Subject: Re: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link >> Put Into Service >> > >> > Having trouble with the mailing list again so not all the text for this >> thread is included. >> > >> > This discussion covers a time period before I worked on packet radio. >> John Shoch's recollection made me curious about when TCP was first used >> over packet radio and when the first generation radios (EPRs?) were >> available. The place I have started to look for this information is the TIU >> (Terminal Interface Unit). The TIU had TCP and TELNET. It also had SPP >> (station-packet-radio protocol) to improve reliability and support for >> other functions. FYI, I think the early packet radios had an 1822 >> interface. >> > >> > I haven't found definitive answers to my questions but I did find a a >> webpage that has some links to documentation in case you are interested in >> the TIU. >> > >> > https://gunkies.org/wiki/Terminal_Interface_Unit >> > >> > BTW, the use of DSP on this web page does not mean Digital Signal >> Processing. It refers to the Dispatch/SPP modules. >> > >> > >> > barbara >> > >> > >> > On Tuesday, February 3, 2026 at 12:23:55 PM PST, John Shoch via >> Internet-history wrote: >> > >> > >> > Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first >> Arpanet >> > link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note (11/3/25) >> > from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network tests >> of >> > the TCP Internet at SRI: >> > // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. >> > // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and >> > ARPANET. >> > >> > As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation >> and >> > testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early work >> at >> > Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and elsewhere. >> > Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple >> > networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path to >> what >> > became the Internet as we know it today. >> > >> > In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state of >> the >> > Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It took me >> a >> > while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original >> documents >> > to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of >> interesting >> > things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History >> Museum >> > have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was >> suggested >> > "you should share it before we lose this history." >> > >> > So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in >> 1976 >> > (as seen from a slightly different perspective): >> > >> > --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken >> place at >> > the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. >> > --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing >> meetings >> > at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the Cabana >> > hotel in Palo Alto. That same summer there were early discussions at >> PARC >> > about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply >> called >> > LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from Aug. >> 1973 >> > reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL and >> > ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for >> > introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the >> > discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to >> interconnect >> > different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A >> drawing >> > includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. >> > --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the alternative >> > LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific >> > protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would be a >> need >> > to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across geographies. >> > Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it was >> > also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed >> something >> > immediately. >> > --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC >> Universal >> > Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: >> > "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is to >> > promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell >> that >> > our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable >> debate >> > and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the >> ball >> > rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would >> include, in >> > arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) Arpanets, >> > (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? >> > [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a >> backbone >> > packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial >> lines.] >> > . >> > --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and >> > refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. >> Progress >> > was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by >> Boggs >> > and Taft: >> > PUP Revisited >> > PUP Converging >> > Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP >> > A Nova Gateway >> > Implementation of PUP in Tenex >> > PUP Again >> > PUP Connection State Diagram >> > PUP Servers on Maxc >> > etc., etc., etc. >> > >> > --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? The >> > best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 months >> > earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. He >> > reports: >> > "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent >> Ethernets >> > (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs >> > (Multiprocessor >> > Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating at >> > 1.6 mb/s). >> > Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a >> store-and-forward >> > packet >> > switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use of >> > other >> > transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth >> local >> > communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at modest >> > bandwidths, >> > and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." >> > The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of >> > Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, >> Fragmentation, >> > etc. >> > I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of the >> > complete final version. >> > >> > >> https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing >> > >> > --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in the >> > Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current >> text >> > file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, well-known >> > sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used to >> > initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The >> Tenex >> > header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- >> > PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. >> > It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 >> MCAs, >> > and the Arpanet. >> > Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing >> updates), >> > FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. >> > The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names (e.g., >> > MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if >> connected to >> > more than one network). >> > I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 >> machines >> > acting as Gateways: >> > --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the Arpanet, >> > --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, both >> > MCAs, and the Arpanet. >> > --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. >> > There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font >> > design and two for laser printer units). >> > The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were >> not >> > necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured as >> > servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser >> printer, >> > the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. >> > There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of these >> were >> > for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated >> Data >> > Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal >> > traffic). >> > [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos in >> > our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if no >> one >> > could find them via the name server, they could operate as client >> machines >> > on the PUP Internet.] >> > This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines >> on 5 >> > networks of 3 types. >> > >> > >> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing >> > >> > >> > That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in >> March >> > 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP Internet. >> > >> > John >> > >> > PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. >> > 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very >> > productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but >> the >> > vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft and >> > Boggs. >> > 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general progress >> with >> > others. >> > --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been encouraged >> to >> > "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's networking >> > seminar. >> > --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of us >> > from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught by >> > Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us >> undertook >> > implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: evolving >> from >> > the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new >> > internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in the >> > listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) to >> > show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! >> > --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP >> working >> > group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal >> (who >> > had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working >> Group >> > meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later registered >> as >> > IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different networks >> > with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the >> East >> > Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts >> > connected." >> > --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting at >> ISI >> > -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, >> > naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] >> > --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became >> users >> > of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying >> > encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was >> reported >> > in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf >> > 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable byte >> > stream interface. >> > The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: >> > --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. >> > --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. to >> a >> > print server. >> > --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, >> echo, >> > etc.) >> > Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually >> > allowed that kind of flexibility. >> > 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and >> the >> > PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in the >> early >> > days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did not >> work >> > well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and b) >> > this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the >> > Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal developed >> > the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd generation >> DIX >> > Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network Systems >> > (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and >> endured >> > for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. >> > https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 >> > >> >> -- >> Internet-history mailing list >> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >> - >> Unsubscribe: >> https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >> > > > -- > Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: > Vint Cerf > Google, LLC > 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor > Reston, VA 20190 > +1 (571) 213 1346 <(571)%20213-1346> > > > until further notice > > > > > -- Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: Vint Cerf Google, LLC 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor Reston, VA 20190 +1 (571) 213 1346 until further notice From brian.e.carpenter at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 11:42:28 2026 From: brian.e.carpenter at gmail.com (Brian E Carpenter) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2026 08:42:28 +1300 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> Message-ID: <66ae4613-e08b-40e6-a592-85c2b16f64db@gmail.com> On 09-Feb-26 22:12, Carsten Schiefner via Internet-history wrote: > Am 09.02.2026 um 09:53 schrieb Eberhard W Lisse via Internet-history : >> >> ?AI Slop Spam > > You can?t say that for sure, Eberhard - as the recommendation below comes from Professor Peter Anderson, Head of Research at - and in the absence of any other information, I can only take his email domain as a basis for it - Gmail. Actually, Gmail's stable mate (Google AI) suggested a couple of actual Professor Peter Andersons (or possibly two incarnations of the same one), but neither seemed very likely to be boosting this particular "book". Anyway, thanks to Ole's anonymous reviewer, the rest of us don't need to waste $30. Shame, really, since I was hoping that the book might reveal whether the answer really is 42. This whole episode is a warning. We need an AI slop detector curating the mailing list. Brian > > ;-> > >>> On Feb 9, 2026 at 09:53 +0200, Gergely Buday via Internet-history , wrote: >>> Dear Vint Cerf, >>> >>> did you really proofread this book? >>> >>> Yours >>> >>> - Gergely >>> >>>> On Mon, 9 Feb 2026 at 06:36, Peter Anderson via Internet-history >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> *(Apologies for cross-posting)* >>>> >>>> As a researcher, I have never come across a highly intensive and inclusive >>>> book like "The Internet Ecosystem". The book englobes the whole Internet >>>> Ecosystem with the correct information compared to misleading >>>> information from blogs/wikipedia on the Internet. This book was reviewed by >>>> Vint Cerf. I have just completed the reading, I will highly recommend it >>>> and it is nice to have a copy to keep for reference. >>>> >>>> Professor Peter Anderson >>>> Head of Research >>>> ------------------------------ >>>> *From:* Nikesh B. Simmandree >>>> *Sent:* Monday, August 18, 2025 1:35 PM >>>> *To:* alac-announce at icann.org ; alac at icann.org < >>>> alac at icann.org>; at-large at icann.org ; >>>> afri-discuss at icann.org >>>> *Subject:* Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book >>>> >>>> Dear Community, >>>> >>>> I am thrilled to announce the launch of my book, *The Internet Ecosystem* ? >>>> a comprehensive exploration of the history, architecture, governance, and >>>> future of the Internet. >>>> This book distills decades of technological evolution ? from ARPANET and >>>> packet switching, to AI, Web3, quantum networks, and beyond ? into a clear, >>>> engaging narrative accessible to both technical and non-technical readers >>>> >>>> *What the Book Covers* >>>> >>>> - *The Past:* How Cold War research, ARPANET, and packet switching gave >>>> birth to the Internet we know today. >>>> - *The Present:* The intricate roles of ISPs, backbone providers, cloud >>>> infrastructure, AI, cybersecurity, and global governance shaping our daily >>>> online experiences. >>>> - *The Future:* Insights into 5G/6G, blockchain, immersive technologies, >>>> quantum security, and the Internet in 2050. >>>> >>>> With *49 detailed chapters*, the book provides a definitive yet >>>> approachable reference for students, professionals, policymakers, and >>>> curious readers alike. >>>> >>>> My mission with *The Internet Ecosystem* is to make the Internet?s >>>> complexity understandable ? showing not only *how* the Internet works, but >>>> also *why* it matters and has become one of the most transformative human >>>> inventions ? while sparking dialogue on how we build a secure, inclusive, >>>> and sustainable digital future. >>>> In the 21st century, understanding the Internet is not optional ? it?s >>>> essential. Whether you?re a business leader, policymaker, educator, >>>> student, or everyday Internet user, this book provides the context and >>>> clarity you need to navigate the opportunities and challenges of our >>>> connected world. >>>> >>>> *Get Your Copy* >>>> *The Internet Ecosystem* is now available: https://payhip.com/b/hfvYg >>>> >>>> Thank you, >>>> >>>> Best Regards, >>>> Nikesh B. Simmandree >>>> +230-5-907-3413 >>>> nikeshbs at outlook.com >>>> >>>> This message and its attachments are intended only for the person or entity >>>> to which it is addressed and are strictly confidential. If you have >>>> received this in error, please delete it from any devices after having >>>> informed the sender. >>>> -- >>>> Internet-history mailing list >>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>>> - >>>> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >>> -- >>> Internet-history mailing list >>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>> - >>> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >> -- >> Internet-history mailing list >> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >> - >> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history From u.speidel at auckland.ac.nz Mon Feb 9 12:25:54 2026 From: u.speidel at auckland.ac.nz (Ulrich Speidel) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2026 09:25:54 +1300 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: <66ae4613-e08b-40e6-a592-85c2b16f64db@gmail.com> References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> <66ae4613-e08b-40e6-a592-85c2b16f64db@gmail.com> Message-ID: On 10/02/2026 8:42 am, Brian E Carpenter via Internet-history wrote: > On 09-Feb-26 22:12, Carsten Schiefner via Internet-history wrote: >> Am 09.02.2026 um 09:53 schrieb Eberhard W Lisse via Internet-history >> : >>> >>> ?AI Slop Spam >> >> You can?t say that for sure, Eberhard - as the recommendation below >> comes from Professor Peter Anderson, Head of Research at - and in the >> absence of any other information, I can only take his email domain as >> a basis for it - Gmail. > > Actually, Gmail's stable mate (Google AI) suggested a couple of actual > Professor Peter Andersons (or possibly two incarnations of the same > one), but neither seemed very likely to be boosting this particular > "book". > > Anyway, thanks to Ole's anonymous reviewer, the rest of us don't need > to waste $30. Shame, really, since I was hoping that the book might > reveal whether the answer really is 42. > > This whole episode is a warning. We need an AI slop detector curating > the mailing list. This doesn't surprise me in the slightest. AI slop is now everywhere. In the last 12 months alone, I have dealt with a bad AI-written PhD provisional year report, an AI-written MSc thesis, an AI-written Honours dissertation, an AI-written PhD examiner's report (from a guy who clocks up > 100 pubs a year), three AI-written submissions to an IEEE journal I was asked to review (I stopped accepting review requests after #3), and a postgraduate assignment where over 80% of the class decided to ignore the request in red bold that AI was not to be used. The net result of the latter were gems like LaTeX source notation for subscripts right next to the real thing in what the PDF said were "Word" files. And by and large abysmal exam performance. You also get this in no small numbers in papers from "top" universities to "top" conferences now: https://gptzero.me/news/neurips/ One of our students is currently looking at the incidence of hallucinated references in published papers. The other day he came to see me saying he'd found a single author paper from a very well known university in Southeast Asia where every single reference was fake. And he's found lots elsewhere also. > > ?? Brian > >> >> ;-> >> >>>> On Feb 9, 2026 at 09:53 +0200, Gergely Buday via Internet-history >>>> , wrote: >>>> Dear Vint Cerf, >>>> >>>> did you really proofread this book? >>>> >>>> Yours >>>> >>>> - Gergely >>>> >>>>> On Mon, 9 Feb 2026 at 06:36, Peter Anderson via Internet-history >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> *(Apologies for cross-posting)* >>>>> >>>>> As a researcher, I have never come across a highly intensive and >>>>> inclusive >>>>> book like "The Internet Ecosystem". The book englobes the whole >>>>> Internet >>>>> Ecosystem with the correct information compared to misleading >>>>> information from blogs/wikipedia on the Internet. This book was >>>>> reviewed by >>>>> Vint Cerf. I have just completed the reading, I will highly >>>>> recommend it >>>>> and it is nice to have a copy to keep for reference. >>>>> >>>>> Professor Peter Anderson >>>>> Head of Research >>>>> ------------------------------ >>>>> *From:* Nikesh B. Simmandree >>>>> *Sent:* Monday, August 18, 2025 1:35 PM >>>>> *To:* alac-announce at icann.org ; >>>>> alac at icann.org < >>>>> alac at icann.org>; at-large at icann.org ; >>>>> afri-discuss at icann.org >>>>> *Subject:* Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book >>>>> >>>>> Dear Community, >>>>> >>>>> I am thrilled to announce the launch of my book, *The Internet >>>>> Ecosystem* ? >>>>> a comprehensive exploration of the history, architecture, >>>>> governance, and >>>>> future of the Internet. >>>>> This book distills decades of technological evolution ? from >>>>> ARPANET and >>>>> packet switching, to AI, Web3, quantum networks, and beyond ? into >>>>> a clear, >>>>> engaging narrative accessible to both technical and non-technical >>>>> readers >>>>> >>>>> *What the Book Covers* >>>>> >>>>> - *The Past:* How Cold War research, ARPANET, and packet switching >>>>> gave >>>>> birth to the Internet we know today. >>>>> - *The Present:* The intricate roles of ISPs, backbone providers, >>>>> cloud >>>>> infrastructure, AI, cybersecurity, and global governance shaping >>>>> our daily >>>>> online experiences. >>>>> - *The Future:* Insights into 5G/6G, blockchain, immersive >>>>> technologies, >>>>> quantum security, and the Internet in 2050. >>>>> >>>>> With *49 detailed chapters*, the book provides a definitive yet >>>>> approachable reference for students, professionals, policymakers, and >>>>> curious readers alike. >>>>> >>>>> My mission with *The Internet Ecosystem* is to make the Internet?s >>>>> complexity understandable ? showing not only *how* the Internet >>>>> works, but >>>>> also *why* it matters and has become one of the most >>>>> transformative human >>>>> inventions ? while sparking dialogue on how we build a secure, >>>>> inclusive, >>>>> and sustainable digital future. >>>>> In the 21st century, understanding the Internet is not optional ? >>>>> it?s >>>>> essential. Whether you?re a business leader, policymaker, educator, >>>>> student, or everyday Internet user, this book provides the context >>>>> and >>>>> clarity you need to navigate the opportunities and challenges of our >>>>> connected world. >>>>> >>>>> *Get Your Copy* >>>>> *The Internet Ecosystem* is now available: https://payhip.com/b/hfvYg >>>>> >>>>> Thank you, >>>>> >>>>> Best Regards, >>>>> Nikesh B. Simmandree >>>>> +230-5-907-3413 >>>>> nikeshbs at outlook.com >>>>> >>>>> This message and its attachments are intended only for the person >>>>> or entity >>>>> to which it is addressed and are strictly confidential. If you have >>>>> received this in error, please delete it from any devices after >>>>> having >>>>> informed the sender. >>>>> -- >>>>> Internet-history mailing list >>>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>>>> - >>>>> Unsubscribe: >>>>> https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >>>> -- >>>> Internet-history mailing list >>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>>> - >>>> Unsubscribe: >>>> https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >>> -- >>> Internet-history mailing list >>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>> - >>> Unsubscribe: >>> https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history -- **************************************************************** Dr. Ulrich Speidel School of Computer Science Room 303S.594 (City Campus) The University of Auckland u.speidel at auckland.ac.nz http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~ulrich/ **************************************************************** From jeanjour at comcast.net Mon Feb 9 12:48:29 2026 From: jeanjour at comcast.net (John Day) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 15:48:29 -0500 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> <66ae4613-e08b-40e6-a592-85c2b16f64db@gmail.com> Message-ID: <6329D8C1-B37C-4BD1-A096-D1067D4D4C1C@comcast.net> I expected AI to be the death of science, but not from this. The next question is, is it as bad in other fields: biology, chemistry, physics, etc. I assume it is. IOW, unless we personally know the author, we can?t trust any publication. > On Feb 9, 2026, at 15:25, Ulrich Speidel via Internet-history wrote: > > On 10/02/2026 8:42 am, Brian E Carpenter via Internet-history wrote: >> On 09-Feb-26 22:12, Carsten Schiefner via Internet-history wrote: >>> Am 09.02.2026 um 09:53 schrieb Eberhard W Lisse via Internet-history : >>>> >>>> ?AI Slop Spam >>> >>> You can?t say that for sure, Eberhard - as the recommendation below comes from Professor Peter Anderson, Head of Research at - and in the absence of any other information, I can only take his email domain as a basis for it - Gmail. >> >> Actually, Gmail's stable mate (Google AI) suggested a couple of actual Professor Peter Andersons (or possibly two incarnations of the same one), but neither seemed very likely to be boosting this particular "book". >> >> Anyway, thanks to Ole's anonymous reviewer, the rest of us don't need to waste $30. Shame, really, since I was hoping that the book might reveal whether the answer really is 42. >> >> This whole episode is a warning. We need an AI slop detector curating the mailing list. > > This doesn't surprise me in the slightest. AI slop is now everywhere. In the last 12 months alone, I have dealt with a bad AI-written PhD provisional year report, an AI-written MSc thesis, an AI-written Honours dissertation, an AI-written PhD examiner's report (from a guy who clocks up > 100 pubs a year), three AI-written submissions to an IEEE journal I was asked to review (I stopped accepting review requests after #3), and a postgraduate assignment where over 80% of the class decided to ignore the request in red bold that AI was not to be used. The net result of the latter were gems like LaTeX source notation for subscripts right next to the real thing in what the PDF said were "Word" files. And by and large abysmal exam performance. > > You also get this in no small numbers in papers from "top" universities to "top" conferences now: > > https://gptzero.me/news/neurips/ > > One of our students is currently looking at the incidence of hallucinated references in published papers. The other day he came to see me saying he'd found a single author paper from a very well known university in Southeast Asia where every single reference was fake. And he's found lots elsewhere also. > >> >> Brian >> >>> >>> ;-> >>> >>>>> On Feb 9, 2026 at 09:53 +0200, Gergely Buday via Internet-history , wrote: >>>>> Dear Vint Cerf, >>>>> >>>>> did you really proofread this book? >>>>> >>>>> Yours >>>>> >>>>> - Gergely >>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, 9 Feb 2026 at 06:36, Peter Anderson via Internet-history >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> *(Apologies for cross-posting)* >>>>>> >>>>>> As a researcher, I have never come across a highly intensive and inclusive >>>>>> book like "The Internet Ecosystem". The book englobes the whole Internet >>>>>> Ecosystem with the correct information compared to misleading >>>>>> information from blogs/wikipedia on the Internet. This book was reviewed by >>>>>> Vint Cerf. I have just completed the reading, I will highly recommend it >>>>>> and it is nice to have a copy to keep for reference. >>>>>> >>>>>> Professor Peter Anderson >>>>>> Head of Research >>>>>> ------------------------------ >>>>>> *From:* Nikesh B. Simmandree >>>>>> *Sent:* Monday, August 18, 2025 1:35 PM >>>>>> *To:* alac-announce at icann.org ; alac at icann.org < >>>>>> alac at icann.org>; at-large at icann.org ; >>>>>> afri-discuss at icann.org >>>>>> *Subject:* Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book >>>>>> >>>>>> Dear Community, >>>>>> >>>>>> I am thrilled to announce the launch of my book, *The Internet Ecosystem* ? >>>>>> a comprehensive exploration of the history, architecture, governance, and >>>>>> future of the Internet. >>>>>> This book distills decades of technological evolution ? from ARPANET and >>>>>> packet switching, to AI, Web3, quantum networks, and beyond ? into a clear, >>>>>> engaging narrative accessible to both technical and non-technical readers >>>>>> >>>>>> *What the Book Covers* >>>>>> >>>>>> - *The Past:* How Cold War research, ARPANET, and packet switching gave >>>>>> birth to the Internet we know today. >>>>>> - *The Present:* The intricate roles of ISPs, backbone providers, cloud >>>>>> infrastructure, AI, cybersecurity, and global governance shaping our daily >>>>>> online experiences. >>>>>> - *The Future:* Insights into 5G/6G, blockchain, immersive technologies, >>>>>> quantum security, and the Internet in 2050. >>>>>> >>>>>> With *49 detailed chapters*, the book provides a definitive yet >>>>>> approachable reference for students, professionals, policymakers, and >>>>>> curious readers alike. >>>>>> >>>>>> My mission with *The Internet Ecosystem* is to make the Internet?s >>>>>> complexity understandable ? showing not only *how* the Internet works, but >>>>>> also *why* it matters and has become one of the most transformative human >>>>>> inventions ? while sparking dialogue on how we build a secure, inclusive, >>>>>> and sustainable digital future. >>>>>> In the 21st century, understanding the Internet is not optional ? it?s >>>>>> essential. Whether you?re a business leader, policymaker, educator, >>>>>> student, or everyday Internet user, this book provides the context and >>>>>> clarity you need to navigate the opportunities and challenges of our >>>>>> connected world. >>>>>> >>>>>> *Get Your Copy* >>>>>> *The Internet Ecosystem* is now available: https://payhip.com/b/hfvYg >>>>>> >>>>>> Thank you, >>>>>> >>>>>> Best Regards, >>>>>> Nikesh B. Simmandree >>>>>> +230-5-907-3413 >>>>>> nikeshbs at outlook.com >>>>>> >>>>>> This message and its attachments are intended only for the person or entity >>>>>> to which it is addressed and are strictly confidential. If you have >>>>>> received this in error, please delete it from any devices after having >>>>>> informed the sender. >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Internet-history mailing list >>>>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>>>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>>>>> - >>>>>> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >>>>> -- >>>>> Internet-history mailing list >>>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>>>> - >>>>> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >>>> -- >>>> Internet-history mailing list >>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>>> - >>>> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > > -- > **************************************************************** > Dr. Ulrich Speidel > > School of Computer Science > > Room 303S.594 (City Campus) > > The University of Auckland > u.speidel at auckland.ac.nz > http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~ulrich/ > **************************************************************** > > > > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history From touch at strayalpha.com Mon Feb 9 13:18:16 2026 From: touch at strayalpha.com (touch at strayalpha.com) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 13:18:16 -0800 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> Message-ID: https://www.gvsu.edu/classics/peter-anderson-77.htm? Peter Anderson - The Department of Classics - Grand Valley State University gvsu.edu Given the credentials listed, you can come to your own conclusions as to the review below. However, I do discourage cross-posting; it just hits the same people on different lists. Vint can speak to whether he actually reviewed the book; unless that claim is false, this is a viable post to this list. Joe (as list admin) ? Dr. Joe Touch, temporal epistemologist www.strayalpha.com > On Feb 9, 2026, at 1:12?AM, Carsten Schiefner via Internet-history wrote: > > Am 09.02.2026 um 09:53 schrieb Eberhard W Lisse via Internet-history : >> >> ?AI Slop Spam > > You can?t say that for sure, Eberhard - as the recommendation below comes from Professor Peter Anderson, Head of Research at - and in the absence of any other information, I can only take his email domain as a basis for it - Gmail. > > ;-> > >>> On Feb 9, 2026 at 09:53 +0200, Gergely Buday via Internet-history , wrote: >>> Dear Vint Cerf, >>> >>> did you really proofread this book? >>> >>> Yours >>> >>> - Gergely >>> >>>> On Mon, 9 Feb 2026 at 06:36, Peter Anderson via Internet-history >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> *(Apologies for cross-posting)* >>>> >>>> As a researcher, I have never come across a highly intensive and inclusive >>>> book like "The Internet Ecosystem". The book englobes the whole Internet >>>> Ecosystem with the correct information compared to misleading >>>> information from blogs/wikipedia on the Internet. This book was reviewed by >>>> Vint Cerf. I have just completed the reading, I will highly recommend it >>>> and it is nice to have a copy to keep for reference. >>>> >>>> Professor Peter Anderson >>>> Head of Research >>>> ------------------------------ >>>> *From:* Nikesh B. Simmandree >>>> *Sent:* Monday, August 18, 2025 1:35 PM >>>> *To:* alac-announce at icann.org ; alac at icann.org < >>>> alac at icann.org>; at-large at icann.org ; >>>> afri-discuss at icann.org >>>> *Subject:* Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book >>>> >>>> Dear Community, >>>> >>>> I am thrilled to announce the launch of my book, *The Internet Ecosystem* ? >>>> a comprehensive exploration of the history, architecture, governance, and >>>> future of the Internet. >>>> This book distills decades of technological evolution ? from ARPANET and >>>> packet switching, to AI, Web3, quantum networks, and beyond ? into a clear, >>>> engaging narrative accessible to both technical and non-technical readers >>>> >>>> *What the Book Covers* >>>> >>>> - *The Past:* How Cold War research, ARPANET, and packet switching gave >>>> birth to the Internet we know today. >>>> - *The Present:* The intricate roles of ISPs, backbone providers, cloud >>>> infrastructure, AI, cybersecurity, and global governance shaping our daily >>>> online experiences. >>>> - *The Future:* Insights into 5G/6G, blockchain, immersive technologies, >>>> quantum security, and the Internet in 2050. >>>> >>>> With *49 detailed chapters*, the book provides a definitive yet >>>> approachable reference for students, professionals, policymakers, and >>>> curious readers alike. >>>> >>>> My mission with *The Internet Ecosystem* is to make the Internet?s >>>> complexity understandable ? showing not only *how* the Internet works, but >>>> also *why* it matters and has become one of the most transformative human >>>> inventions ? while sparking dialogue on how we build a secure, inclusive, >>>> and sustainable digital future. >>>> In the 21st century, understanding the Internet is not optional ? it?s >>>> essential. Whether you?re a business leader, policymaker, educator, >>>> student, or everyday Internet user, this book provides the context and >>>> clarity you need to navigate the opportunities and challenges of our >>>> connected world. >>>> >>>> *Get Your Copy* >>>> *The Internet Ecosystem* is now available: https://payhip.com/b/hfvYg >>>> >>>> Thank you, >>>> >>>> Best Regards, >>>> Nikesh B. Simmandree >>>> +230-5-907-3413 >>>> nikeshbs at outlook.com >>>> >>>> This message and its attachments are intended only for the person or entity >>>> to which it is addressed and are strictly confidential. If you have >>>> received this in error, please delete it from any devices after having >>>> informed the sender. >>>> -- >>>> Internet-history mailing list >>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>>> - >>>> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >>> -- >>> Internet-history mailing list >>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>> - >>> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >> -- >> Internet-history mailing list >> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >> - >> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history From jack at 3kitty.org Mon Feb 9 13:37:54 2026 From: jack at 3kitty.org (Jack Haverty) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 13:37:54 -0800 Subject: [ih] AI slop is now everywhere. In-Reply-To: References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> <66ae4613-e08b-40e6-a592-85c2b16f64db@gmail.com> Message-ID: Looking at History, the 'net has changed a lot since the ARPANET era.? Some of the changes are easy to understand - such as the phenomenal increase in the capabilities of technology and the accompanying plummeting of costs.? ?Such progress made it possible for the "AI slop" we all experience.? ?We probably can't, and don't want to, go backwards. But other changes that have occurred may also be involved.? For example, in the ARPANET days, authors of content were fairly reliably identified.? Everyone had an "account" on some computer, with passwords to "protect" that account.? If a document came from some person, you could be reasonably confident that s/he sent it. ?If the sender claimed to be the author, you knew who to challenge if that was a false statement.? ?The security of the protection mechanisms was primitive by today's technical standards.? Still, it provided some measure of confidence about what transitted the 'net and who sent it. Over the decades, such trust has eroded, both with the explosion in population of the 'net and with the advances in technology.? At the same time, security technology has also advanced, with the introduction of encryption techniques, digital signatures, and such mechanisms.? They also are not perfect, especially with the advent of "quantum computing".? ?But they provide a reasonable level of trust that links content to authorship. Curiously, no one seems to use these technologies. Well, some do; for example, this message is signed by me, its author.? You may not see that signature since the mail system in use today corrupts it.? ?My signature will be stripped off this message before you receive it.? ?You'll just have to trust me.? And you shouldn't have to. Perhaps we can do something? If you're an educator, perhaps you could require your students to digitally sign everything they claim to be their work?? ?If you're a lawyer or politician, perhaps you can explore how your legal machinery can be applied, or changed, to address in the legal systems issues such as fraud using the 'net?? If you're a techie, perhaps you can work on making the email, text, audio, and video infrastructures better at linking content with authorship - perhaps start with this list?? If you're an AI entrepreneur, perhaps you can introduce the notion of signatures to content generated by your AI systems?? ?If you're a security guru, perhaps you can figure out why today's security technology isn't being widely used, and how to change that? If you're a deep thinker, perhaps you can develop a scheme for categorizing "AI" along a spectrum -- ranging from simple spell-checking, to grammar fixing, to human-involved creation of content with AI assistance, to full-blown "generative" AI, to AI collaborative networks that proactively create their own projects to manipulate the humans under their influence.? ?The term "AI" is too broad to be useful across that spectrum. AIs can use the 'net just like humans do.? Way back, in the ARPANET era, I recall seeing a conversation between Eliza, likely the first "chatbot", and another AI of that era.? ? I couldn't remember the other AI's name.? ?So I asked CHATGPT who said: "In the early 1970s, *ELIZA* (by Joseph Weizenbaum) was famously put into conversation with *PARRY*, a program created by psychiatrist *Kenneth Colby* that simulated a person with paranoid schizophrenia. Their dialogue was published in 1974 and is often cited as one of the earliest examples of *AI-to-AI conversation*." If you're just a user on this list, perhaps you can start sending your own messages, but including your own digital signature? /Jack Haverty (you'll have to trust it's me.....) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: OpenPGP_signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 665 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From el at lisse.na Mon Feb 9 13:51:41 2026 From: el at lisse.na (Eberhard W Lisse) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 23:51:41 +0200 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> Message-ID: Joe, it might be interesting (for your detetmination) to see when someone subscribed and how many posts. el -- Sent from my iPhone On 9. Feb 2026 at 23:18 +0200, touch--- via Internet-history , wrote: > https://www.gvsu.edu/classics/peter-anderson-77.htm? > Peter Anderson - The Department of Classics - Grand Valley State University > gvsu.edu > > Given the credentials listed, you can come to your own conclusions as to the review below. > > However, I do discourage cross-posting; it just hits the same people on different lists. > > Vint can speak to whether he actually reviewed the book; unless that claim is false, this is a viable post to this list. > > Joe (as list admin) > > ? > Dr. Joe Touch, temporal epistemologist > www.strayalpha.com > > > On Feb 9, 2026, at 1:12?AM, Carsten Schiefner via Internet-history wrote: > > > > Am 09.02.2026 um 09:53 schrieb Eberhard W Lisse via Internet-history : > > > > > > > > AI Slop Spam > > > > You can?t say that for sure, Eberhard - as the recommendation below comes from Professor Peter Anderson, Head of Research at - and in the absence of any other information, I can only take his email domain as a basis for it - Gmail. > > > > ;-> > > > > > > >> On Feb 9, 2026 at 09:53 +0200, Gergely Buday via Internet-history , wrote: > > > > >> Dear Vint Cerf, > > > > >> > > > > >> did you really proofread this book? > > > > >> > > > > >> Yours > > > > >> > > > > >> - Gergely > > > > >> > > > > > >>> On Mon, 9 Feb 2026 at 06:36, Peter Anderson via Internet-history > > > > > >>> wrote: > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> *(Apologies for cross-posting)* > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> As a researcher, I have never come across a highly intensive and inclusive > > > > > >>> book like "The Internet Ecosystem". The book englobes the whole Internet > > > > > >>> Ecosystem with the correct information compared to misleading > > > > > >>> information from blogs/wikipedia on the Internet. This book was reviewed by > > > > > >>> Vint Cerf. I have just completed the reading, I will highly recommend it > > > > > >>> and it is nice to have a copy to keep for reference. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Professor Peter Anderson > > > > > >>> Head of Research > > > > > >>> ------------------------------ > > > > > >>> *From:* Nikesh B. Simmandree > > > > > >>> *Sent:* Monday, August 18, 2025 1:35 PM > > > > > >>> *To:* alac-announce at icann.org ; alac at icann.org < > > > > > >>> alac at icann.org>; at-large at icann.org ; > > > > > >>> afri-discuss at icann.org > > > > > >>> *Subject:* Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Dear Community, > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> I am thrilled to announce the launch of my book, *The Internet Ecosystem* ? > > > > > >>> a comprehensive exploration of the history, architecture, governance, and > > > > > >>> future of the Internet. > > > > > >>> This book distills decades of technological evolution ? from ARPANET and > > > > > >>> packet switching, to AI, Web3, quantum networks, and beyond ? into a clear, > > > > > >>> engaging narrative accessible to both technical and non-technical readers > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> *What the Book Covers* > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> - *The Past:* How Cold War research, ARPANET, and packet switching gave > > > > > >>> birth to the Internet we know today. > > > > > >>> - *The Present:* The intricate roles of ISPs, backbone providers, cloud > > > > > >>> infrastructure, AI, cybersecurity, and global governance shaping our daily > > > > > >>> online experiences. > > > > > >>> - *The Future:* Insights into 5G/6G, blockchain, immersive technologies, > > > > > >>> quantum security, and the Internet in 2050. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> With *49 detailed chapters*, the book provides a definitive yet > > > > > >>> approachable reference for students, professionals, policymakers, and > > > > > >>> curious readers alike. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> My mission with *The Internet Ecosystem* is to make the Internet?s > > > > > >>> complexity understandable ? showing not only *how* the Internet works, but > > > > > >>> also *why* it matters and has become one of the most transformative human > > > > > >>> inventions ? while sparking dialogue on how we build a secure, inclusive, > > > > > >>> and sustainable digital future. > > > > > >>> In the 21st century, understanding the Internet is not optional ? it?s > > > > > >>> essential. Whether you?re a business leader, policymaker, educator, > > > > > >>> student, or everyday Internet user, this book provides the context and > > > > > >>> clarity you need to navigate the opportunities and challenges of our > > > > > >>> connected world. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> *Get Your Copy* > > > > > >>> *The Internet Ecosystem* is now available: https://payhip.com/b/hfvYg > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Thank you, > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Best Regards, > > > > > >>> Nikesh B. Simmandree > > > > > >>> +230-5-907-3413 > > > > > >>> nikeshbs at outlook.com > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> This message and its attachments are intended only for the person or entity > > > > > >>> to which it is addressed and are strictly confidential. If you have > > > > > >>> received this in error, please delete it from any devices after having > > > > > >>> informed the sender. > > > > > >>> -- > > > > > >>> Internet-history mailing list > > > > > >>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > > > > > >>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > > > > > >>> - > > > > > >>> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > > > > >> -- > > > > >> Internet-history mailing list > > > > >> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > > > > >> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > > > > >> - > > > > >> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > > > > -- > > > > Internet-history mailing list > > > > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > > > > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > > > > - > > > > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > > -- > > Internet-history mailing list > > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > > - > > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history From vgcerf at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 14:21:59 2026 From: vgcerf at gmail.com (vinton cerf) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 17:21:59 -0500 Subject: [ih] AI slop is now everywhere. In-Reply-To: References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> <66ae4613-e08b-40e6-a592-85c2b16f64db@gmail.com> Message-ID: Parry Meets the Doctor was published in July 1973 Datamation and also as RFC 439. The experiment was done in Sept 1972. vint On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 4:38?PM Jack Haverty via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > Looking at History, the 'net has changed a lot since the ARPANET era. > Some of the changes are easy to understand - such as the phenomenal > increase in the capabilities of technology and the accompanying > plummeting of costs. Such progress made it possible for the "AI slop" > we all experience. We probably can't, and don't want to, go backwards. > > But other changes that have occurred may also be involved. For example, > in the ARPANET days, authors of content were fairly reliably > identified. Everyone had an "account" on some computer, with passwords > to "protect" that account. If a document came from some person, you > could be reasonably confident that s/he sent it. If the sender claimed > to be the author, you knew who to challenge if that was a false > statement. The security of the protection mechanisms was primitive by > today's technical standards. Still, it provided some measure of > confidence about what transitted the 'net and who sent it. > > Over the decades, such trust has eroded, both with the explosion in > population of the 'net and with the advances in technology. At the same > time, security technology has also advanced, with the introduction of > encryption techniques, digital signatures, and such mechanisms. They > also are not perfect, especially with the advent of "quantum > computing". But they provide a reasonable level of trust that links > content to authorship. > > Curiously, no one seems to use these technologies. > > Well, some do; for example, this message is signed by me, its author. > You may not see that signature since the mail system in use today > corrupts it. My signature will be stripped off this message before you > receive it. You'll just have to trust me. And you shouldn't have to. > > Perhaps we can do something? > > If you're an educator, perhaps you could require your students to > digitally sign everything they claim to be their work? If you're a > lawyer or politician, perhaps you can explore how your legal machinery > can be applied, or changed, to address in the legal systems issues such > as fraud using the 'net? If you're a techie, perhaps you can work on > making the email, text, audio, and video infrastructures better at > linking content with authorship - perhaps start with this list? If > you're an AI entrepreneur, perhaps you can introduce the notion of > signatures to content generated by your AI systems? If you're a > security guru, perhaps you can figure out why today's security > technology isn't being widely used, and how to change that? > > If you're a deep thinker, perhaps you can develop a scheme for > categorizing "AI" along a spectrum -- ranging from simple > spell-checking, to grammar fixing, to human-involved creation of content > with AI assistance, to full-blown "generative" AI, to AI collaborative > networks that proactively create their own projects to manipulate the > humans under their influence. The term "AI" is too broad to be useful > across that spectrum. > > AIs can use the 'net just like humans do. Way back, in the ARPANET era, > I recall seeing a conversation between Eliza, likely the first > "chatbot", and another AI of that era. I couldn't remember the other > AI's name. So I asked CHATGPT who said: > > "In the early 1970s, *ELIZA* (by Joseph Weizenbaum) was famously put > into conversation with *PARRY*, a program created by psychiatrist > *Kenneth Colby* that simulated a person with paranoid schizophrenia. > Their dialogue was published in 1974 and is often cited as one of the > earliest examples of *AI-to-AI conversation*." > > If you're just a user on this list, perhaps you can start sending your > own messages, but including your own digital signature? > > /Jack Haverty > (you'll have to trust it's me.....) > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > From vgcerf at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 14:25:04 2026 From: vgcerf at gmail.com (vinton cerf) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 17:25:04 -0500 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> Message-ID: I did review the "book" - it has an outline-like feel to it but I thought it did a pretty good job of picking up high points of the history. I didn't think there were too many major gaffes. Others might not agree, depending on their personal stories and experiences. v On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 4:18?PM touch--- via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > https://www.gvsu.edu/classics/peter-anderson-77.htm? > Peter Anderson - The Department of Classics - Grand Valley State University > gvsu.edu > > Given the credentials listed, you can come to your own conclusions as to > the review below. > > However, I do discourage cross-posting; it just hits the same people on > different lists. > > Vint can speak to whether he actually reviewed the book; unless that claim > is false, this is a viable post to this list. > > Joe (as list admin) > > ? > Dr. Joe Touch, temporal epistemologist > www.strayalpha.com > > > On Feb 9, 2026, at 1:12?AM, Carsten Schiefner via Internet-history < > internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > > > > Am 09.02.2026 um 09:53 schrieb Eberhard W Lisse via Internet-history < > internet-history at elists.isoc.org>: > >> > >> ?AI Slop Spam > > > > You can?t say that for sure, Eberhard - as the recommendation below > comes from Professor Peter Anderson, Head of Research at - and in the > absence of any other information, I can only take his email domain as a > basis for it - Gmail. > > > > ;-> > > > >>> On Feb 9, 2026 at 09:53 +0200, Gergely Buday via Internet-history < > internet-history at elists.isoc.org>, wrote: > >>> Dear Vint Cerf, > >>> > >>> did you really proofread this book? > >>> > >>> Yours > >>> > >>> - Gergely > >>> > >>>> On Mon, 9 Feb 2026 at 06:36, Peter Anderson via Internet-history > >>>> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> *(Apologies for cross-posting)* > >>>> > >>>> As a researcher, I have never come across a highly intensive and > inclusive > >>>> book like "The Internet Ecosystem". The book englobes the whole > Internet > >>>> Ecosystem with the correct information compared to misleading > >>>> information from blogs/wikipedia on the Internet. This book was > reviewed by > >>>> Vint Cerf. I have just completed the reading, I will highly recommend > it > >>>> and it is nice to have a copy to keep for reference. > >>>> > >>>> Professor Peter Anderson > >>>> Head of Research > >>>> ------------------------------ > >>>> *From:* Nikesh B. Simmandree > >>>> *Sent:* Monday, August 18, 2025 1:35 PM > >>>> *To:* alac-announce at icann.org ; > alac at icann.org < > >>>> alac at icann.org>; at-large at icann.org ; > >>>> afri-discuss at icann.org > >>>> *Subject:* Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book > >>>> > >>>> Dear Community, > >>>> > >>>> I am thrilled to announce the launch of my book, *The Internet > Ecosystem* ? > >>>> a comprehensive exploration of the history, architecture, governance, > and > >>>> future of the Internet. > >>>> This book distills decades of technological evolution ? from ARPANET > and > >>>> packet switching, to AI, Web3, quantum networks, and beyond ? into a > clear, > >>>> engaging narrative accessible to both technical and non-technical > readers > >>>> > >>>> *What the Book Covers* > >>>> > >>>> - *The Past:* How Cold War research, ARPANET, and packet switching > gave > >>>> birth to the Internet we know today. > >>>> - *The Present:* The intricate roles of ISPs, backbone providers, > cloud > >>>> infrastructure, AI, cybersecurity, and global governance shaping our > daily > >>>> online experiences. > >>>> - *The Future:* Insights into 5G/6G, blockchain, immersive > technologies, > >>>> quantum security, and the Internet in 2050. > >>>> > >>>> With *49 detailed chapters*, the book provides a definitive yet > >>>> approachable reference for students, professionals, policymakers, and > >>>> curious readers alike. > >>>> > >>>> My mission with *The Internet Ecosystem* is to make the Internet?s > >>>> complexity understandable ? showing not only *how* the Internet > works, but > >>>> also *why* it matters and has become one of the most transformative > human > >>>> inventions ? while sparking dialogue on how we build a secure, > inclusive, > >>>> and sustainable digital future. > >>>> In the 21st century, understanding the Internet is not optional ? it?s > >>>> essential. Whether you?re a business leader, policymaker, educator, > >>>> student, or everyday Internet user, this book provides the context and > >>>> clarity you need to navigate the opportunities and challenges of our > >>>> connected world. > >>>> > >>>> *Get Your Copy* > >>>> *The Internet Ecosystem* is now available: https://payhip.com/b/hfvYg > >>>> > >>>> Thank you, > >>>> > >>>> Best Regards, > >>>> Nikesh B. Simmandree > >>>> +230-5-907-3413 > >>>> nikeshbs at outlook.com > >>>> > >>>> This message and its attachments are intended only for the person or > entity > >>>> to which it is addressed and are strictly confidential. If you have > >>>> received this in error, please delete it from any devices after having > >>>> informed the sender. > >>>> -- > >>>> Internet-history mailing list > >>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > >>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > >>>> - > >>>> Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > >>> -- > >>> Internet-history mailing list > >>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > >>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > >>> - > >>> Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > >> -- > >> Internet-history mailing list > >> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > >> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > >> - > >> Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > > -- > > Internet-history mailing list > > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > > - > > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > From gbuday.irtf at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 14:49:24 2026 From: gbuday.irtf at gmail.com (Gergely Buday) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 22:49:24 +0000 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> <66ae4613-e08b-40e6-a592-85c2b16f64db@gmail.com> Message-ID: > One of our students is currently looking at the incidence of > hallucinated references in published papers. The other day he came to > see me saying he'd found a single author paper from a very well known > university in Southeast Asia where every single reference was fake. And > he's found lots elsewhere also. > The book we discuss avoided this problem whatsoever: it did not have a bibliography. I think I will be more careful with self-published books. Editors at publishers do have things to do. - Gergely > From jmamodio at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 16:38:58 2026 From: jmamodio at gmail.com (Jorge Amodio) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 18:38:58 -0600 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> Message-ID: <306EA723-3F65-45A1-BC23-B42828A504AE@gmail.com> Unfortunately, the preview does not provide any insightful information besides the index to be able to judge the quality and correctness of the content. The number of topics listed in the index is broad and wide, that imho is hard to believe you can fit in only ~200 pages. Also, the book is not being published by any well known and reputable publisher or that information is missing on the preview. My .02 -Jorge > On Feb 9, 2026, at 02:53, Eberhard W Lisse via Internet-history wrote: > > ?AI Slop Spam > > el > > -- > Sent from my iPhone >> On Feb 9, 2026 at 09:53 +0200, Gergely Buday via Internet-history , wrote: >> Dear Vint Cerf, >> >> did you really proofread this book? >> >> Yours >> >> - Gergely >> >>> On Mon, 9 Feb 2026 at 06:36, Peter Anderson via Internet-history >>> wrote: >>> >>> *(Apologies for cross-posting)* >>> >>> As a researcher, I have never come across a highly intensive and inclusive >>> book like "The Internet Ecosystem". The book englobes the whole Internet >>> Ecosystem with the correct information compared to misleading >>> information from blogs/wikipedia on the Internet. This book was reviewed by >>> Vint Cerf. I have just completed the reading, I will highly recommend it >>> and it is nice to have a copy to keep for reference. >>> >>> Professor Peter Anderson >>> Head of Research >>> ------------------------------ >>> *From:* Nikesh B. Simmandree >>> *Sent:* Monday, August 18, 2025 1:35 PM >>> *To:* alac-announce at icann.org ; alac at icann.org < >>> alac at icann.org>; at-large at icann.org ; >>> afri-discuss at icann.org >>> *Subject:* Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book >>> >>> Dear Community, >>> >>> I am thrilled to announce the launch of my book, *The Internet Ecosystem* ? >>> a comprehensive exploration of the history, architecture, governance, and >>> future of the Internet. >>> This book distills decades of technological evolution ? from ARPANET and >>> packet switching, to AI, Web3, quantum networks, and beyond ? into a clear, >>> engaging narrative accessible to both technical and non-technical readers >>> >>> *What the Book Covers* >>> >>> - *The Past:* How Cold War research, ARPANET, and packet switching gave >>> birth to the Internet we know today. >>> - *The Present:* The intricate roles of ISPs, backbone providers, cloud >>> infrastructure, AI, cybersecurity, and global governance shaping our daily >>> online experiences. >>> - *The Future:* Insights into 5G/6G, blockchain, immersive technologies, >>> quantum security, and the Internet in 2050. >>> >>> With *49 detailed chapters*, the book provides a definitive yet >>> approachable reference for students, professionals, policymakers, and >>> curious readers alike. >>> >>> My mission with *The Internet Ecosystem* is to make the Internet?s >>> complexity understandable ? showing not only *how* the Internet works, but >>> also *why* it matters and has become one of the most transformative human >>> inventions ? while sparking dialogue on how we build a secure, inclusive, >>> and sustainable digital future. >>> In the 21st century, understanding the Internet is not optional ? it?s >>> essential. Whether you?re a business leader, policymaker, educator, >>> student, or everyday Internet user, this book provides the context and >>> clarity you need to navigate the opportunities and challenges of our >>> connected world. >>> >>> *Get Your Copy* >>> *The Internet Ecosystem* is now available: https://payhip.com/b/hfvYg >>> >>> Thank you, >>> >>> Best Regards, >>> Nikesh B. Simmandree >>> +230-5-907-3413 >>> nikeshbs at outlook.com >>> >>> This message and its attachments are intended only for the person or entity >>> to which it is addressed and are strictly confidential. If you have >>> received this in error, please delete it from any devices after having >>> informed the sender. >>> -- >>> Internet-history mailing list >>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>> - >>> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >> -- >> Internet-history mailing list >> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >> - >> Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history From vint at google.com Mon Feb 9 18:30:12 2026 From: vint at google.com (Vint Cerf) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 21:30:12 -0500 Subject: [ih] Fwd: Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service In-Reply-To: <449F57D5-A79D-467C-8B48-DD34554FFCC3@pacbell.net> References: <449F57D5-A79D-467C-8B48-DD34554FFCC3@pacbell.net> Message-ID: there is no question about this - he was charged with implementing on LSI-11/23 v On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 6:39?PM Don Nielson wrote: > I should have affirmed that Jim Mathis was almost certainly responsible > for the TCP process in the TIU. Don > Sent from my iPhone > > On Feb 9, 2026, at 4:33?AM, Vint Cerf wrote: > > ? > thanks Don!! we were trying to figure out early efforts at bridging > networks - PRNET was a key project for exploring that concept. > > v > > > On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 3:46?AM Don Nielson wrote: > >> Vint, Barbara, and all, >> I'm not sure I understand the impetus for all this but thought I'd try to >> help pin down some dates in the early use of the TIU and TCP. >> >> The first I could find was in a Packet Radio Quarterly Report covering >> 1 May 1976 to 31 July 1976. During that time a gateway was in the >> station computer and was first just doing header swaps between the >> ARPANET and the PRNET. But in the same period the LSI-11 TIU was >> there running a single-connection user version TCP. Rather that try >> to describe what was written, I've attached three images of the report >> and the text. Reference to the description of the TIU architecture >> also included Dave Retz as the lead author so his hand was in it >> as well, probably more to do with the MOS operating system and >> the ELF processes working there. I've also attached a process >> diagram of the TIU circa Feb 1977. >> >> Hope this helps. >> Don >> >> >> >> >> On 2/5/26 4:10 AM, Vint Cerf wrote: >> >> Jim Mathis did the TIU system - must have been circa 1975/1976 >> vint >> >> >> On Thu, Feb 5, 2026 at 1:01?AM Greg Skinner via Internet-history < >> internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: >> >>> Forwarded for Barbara >>> >>> > ----- Forwarded Message ----- >>> > From: Barbara Denny >>> > To: internet-history >>> > Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2026 at 09:34:45 PM PST >>> > Subject: Re: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link >>> Put Into Service >>> > >>> > Having trouble with the mailing list again so not all the text for >>> this thread is included. >>> > >>> > This discussion covers a time period before I worked on packet radio. >>> John Shoch's recollection made me curious about when TCP was first used >>> over packet radio and when the first generation radios (EPRs?) were >>> available. The place I have started to look for this information is the TIU >>> (Terminal Interface Unit). The TIU had TCP and TELNET. It also had SPP >>> (station-packet-radio protocol) to improve reliability and support for >>> other functions. FYI, I think the early packet radios had an 1822 >>> interface. >>> > >>> > I haven't found definitive answers to my questions but I did find a a >>> webpage that has some links to documentation in case you are interested in >>> the TIU. >>> > >>> > https://gunkies.org/wiki/Terminal_Interface_Unit >>> > >>> > BTW, the use of DSP on this web page does not mean Digital Signal >>> Processing. It refers to the Dispatch/SPP modules. >>> > >>> > >>> > barbara >>> > >>> > >>> > On Tuesday, February 3, 2026 at 12:23:55 PM PST, John Shoch via >>> Internet-history wrote: >>> > >>> > >>> > Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first >>> Arpanet >>> > link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note >>> (11/3/25) >>> > from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network tests >>> of >>> > the TCP Internet at SRI: >>> > // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. >>> > // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and >>> > ARPANET. >>> > >>> > As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation >>> and >>> > testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early work >>> at >>> > Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and elsewhere. >>> > Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple >>> > networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path to >>> what >>> > became the Internet as we know it today. >>> > >>> > In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state >>> of the >>> > Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It took >>> me a >>> > while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original >>> documents >>> > to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of >>> interesting >>> > things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History >>> Museum >>> > have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was >>> suggested >>> > "you should share it before we lose this history." >>> > >>> > So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in >>> 1976 >>> > (as seen from a slightly different perspective): >>> > >>> > --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken >>> place at >>> > the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. >>> > --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing >>> meetings >>> > at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the >>> Cabana >>> > hotel in Palo Alto. That same summer there were early discussions at >>> PARC >>> > about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply >>> called >>> > LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from Aug. >>> 1973 >>> > reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL and >>> > ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for >>> > introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the >>> > discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to >>> interconnect >>> > different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A >>> drawing >>> > includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. >>> > --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the >>> alternative >>> > LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific >>> > protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would be a >>> need >>> > to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across geographies. >>> > Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it >>> was >>> > also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed >>> something >>> > immediately. >>> > --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC >>> Universal >>> > Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: >>> > "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is >>> to >>> > promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell >>> that >>> > our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable >>> debate >>> > and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the >>> ball >>> > rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would >>> include, in >>> > arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) >>> Arpanets, >>> > (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? >>> > [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a >>> backbone >>> > packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial >>> lines.] >>> > . >>> > --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and >>> > refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. >>> Progress >>> > was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by >>> Boggs >>> > and Taft: >>> > PUP Revisited >>> > PUP Converging >>> > Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP >>> > A Nova Gateway >>> > Implementation of PUP in Tenex >>> > PUP Again >>> > PUP Connection State Diagram >>> > PUP Servers on Maxc >>> > etc., etc., etc. >>> > >>> > --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? The >>> > best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 months >>> > earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. He >>> > reports: >>> > "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent >>> Ethernets >>> > (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs >>> > (Multiprocessor >>> > Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating >>> at >>> > 1.6 mb/s). >>> > Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a >>> store-and-forward >>> > packet >>> > switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use >>> of >>> > other >>> > transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth >>> local >>> > communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at modest >>> > bandwidths, >>> > and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." >>> > The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of >>> > Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, >>> Fragmentation, >>> > etc. >>> > I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of the >>> > complete final version. >>> > >>> > >>> https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing >>> > >>> > --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in the >>> > Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current >>> text >>> > file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, well-known >>> > sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used to >>> > initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The >>> Tenex >>> > header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- >>> > PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. >>> > It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 >>> MCAs, >>> > and the Arpanet. >>> > Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing >>> updates), >>> > FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. >>> > The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names >>> (e.g., >>> > MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if >>> connected to >>> > more than one network). >>> > I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 >>> machines >>> > acting as Gateways: >>> > --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the Arpanet, >>> > --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, >>> both >>> > MCAs, and the Arpanet. >>> > --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. >>> > There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font >>> > design and two for laser printer units). >>> > The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were >>> not >>> > necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured as >>> > servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser >>> printer, >>> > the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. >>> > There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of these >>> were >>> > for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated >>> Data >>> > Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal >>> > traffic). >>> > [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos >>> in >>> > our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if no >>> one >>> > could find them via the name server, they could operate as client >>> machines >>> > on the PUP Internet.] >>> > This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines >>> on 5 >>> > networks of 3 types. >>> > >>> > >>> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing >>> > >>> > >>> > That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in >>> March >>> > 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP Internet. >>> > >>> > John >>> > >>> > PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. >>> > 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very >>> > productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but >>> the >>> > vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft and >>> > Boggs. >>> > 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general progress >>> with >>> > others. >>> > --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been >>> encouraged to >>> > "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's networking >>> > seminar. >>> > --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of us >>> > from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught by >>> > Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us >>> undertook >>> > implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: evolving >>> from >>> > the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new >>> > internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in the >>> > listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) >>> to >>> > show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! >>> > --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP >>> working >>> > group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal >>> (who >>> > had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working >>> Group >>> > meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later registered >>> as >>> > IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different networks >>> > with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the >>> East >>> > Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts >>> > connected." >>> > --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting >>> at ISI >>> > -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, >>> > naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] >>> > --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became >>> users >>> > of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying >>> > encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was >>> reported >>> > in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf >>> > 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable >>> byte >>> > stream interface. >>> > The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: >>> > --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. >>> > --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. >>> to a >>> > print server. >>> > --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, >>> echo, >>> > etc.) >>> > Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually >>> > allowed that kind of flexibility. >>> > 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and >>> the >>> > PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in the >>> early >>> > days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did not >>> work >>> > well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and >>> b) >>> > this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the >>> > Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal >>> developed >>> > the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd >>> generation DIX >>> > Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network Systems >>> > (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and >>> endured >>> > for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. >>> > https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 >>> > >>> >>> -- >>> Internet-history mailing list >>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>> - >>> Unsubscribe: >>> https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >>> >> >> >> -- >> Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: >> Vint Cerf >> Google, LLC >> 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor >> Reston, VA 20190 >> +1 (571) 213 1346 <(571)%20213-1346> >> >> >> until further notice >> >> >> >> >> > > -- > Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: > Vint Cerf > Google, LLC > 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor > Reston, VA 20190 > +1 (571) 213 1346 <(571)%20213-1346> > > > until further notice > > > > -- Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: Vint Cerf Google, LLC 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor Reston, VA 20190 +1 (571) 213 1346 until further notice From jack at 3kitty.org Mon Feb 9 19:08:27 2026 From: jack at 3kitty.org (Jack Haverty) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 19:08:27 -0800 Subject: [ih] Fwd: Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service In-Reply-To: References: <449F57D5-A79D-467C-8B48-DD34554FFCC3@pacbell.net> Message-ID: The SRI TCP code was written in assembler language for the LSI-11. So that code was essentially compatible with the PDP-11/40 which used a similar (identical?) instruction set.? Jim provided me with the TCP (version 2) code, and I used it as a basis for the first TCP for Unix, which I implemented in 1977/78.? The code to implement the state diagram, datagram parsing, and such parts could be used directly.? Of course anything relating to the OS had to be new code, since the SRI TCP ran on MOS which was quite different from Unix. ?Since I had never programmed any DEC -11 system, or heard of TCP, or knew anything about Unix, it was very valuable to have Jim's help. Since the project needing the Unix TCP was using it to communicate with an LSI-11 running the SRI TCP, this made it especially likely that those machines could communicate, even before the "Bakeoff" occurred to nail down interoperability and create a precise specification of the protocol. One interesting debugging phase occurred when SRI was having some kind of contract dispute with the government and Jim was sympathetic but wasn't permitted to do any work on the LSI-11 TCP.? We ended up debugging his TCP code by using DDT and packet traces to find some minor error, patching the code, observing that it now worked, and then emailing a bug report to Jim at SRI - something like "we don't know exactly why, but changing the instruction at location xxxxx fixed our problem!"? ?Subsequently TCP evolved to become TCP/IPV4, and we made the necessary changes independently to the two systems. So I can't say for sure that Jim implemented the TIU's TCP, but he's the one who gave it to me in 1977 and helped with questions etc. /Jack Haverty On 2/9/26 18:30, Vint Cerf via Internet-history wrote: > there is no question about this - he was charged with implementing on > LSI-11/23 > > v > > > On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 6:39?PM Don Nielson wrote: > >> I should have affirmed that Jim Mathis was almost certainly responsible >> for the TCP process in the TIU. Don >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Feb 9, 2026, at 4:33?AM, Vint Cerf wrote: >> >> ? >> thanks Don!! we were trying to figure out early efforts at bridging >> networks - PRNET was a key project for exploring that concept. >> >> v >> >> >> On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 3:46?AM Don Nielson wrote: >> >>> Vint, Barbara, and all, >>> I'm not sure I understand the impetus for all this but thought I'd try to >>> help pin down some dates in the early use of the TIU and TCP. >>> >>> The first I could find was in a Packet Radio Quarterly Report covering >>> 1 May 1976 to 31 July 1976. During that time a gateway was in the >>> station computer and was first just doing header swaps between the >>> ARPANET and the PRNET. But in the same period the LSI-11 TIU was >>> there running a single-connection user version TCP. Rather that try >>> to describe what was written, I've attached three images of the report >>> and the text. Reference to the description of the TIU architecture >>> also included Dave Retz as the lead author so his hand was in it >>> as well, probably more to do with the MOS operating system and >>> the ELF processes working there. I've also attached a process >>> diagram of the TIU circa Feb 1977. >>> >>> Hope this helps. >>> Don >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On 2/5/26 4:10 AM, Vint Cerf wrote: >>> >>> Jim Mathis did the TIU system - must have been circa 1975/1976 >>> vint >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Feb 5, 2026 at 1:01?AM Greg Skinner via Internet-history < >>> internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: >>> >>>> Forwarded for Barbara >>>> >>>>> ----- Forwarded Message ----- >>>>> From: Barbara Denny >>>>> To: internet-history >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2026 at 09:34:45 PM PST >>>>> Subject: Re: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link >>>> Put Into Service >>>>> Having trouble with the mailing list again so not all the text for >>>> this thread is included. >>>>> This discussion covers a time period before I worked on packet radio. >>>> John Shoch's recollection made me curious about when TCP was first used >>>> over packet radio and when the first generation radios (EPRs?) were >>>> available. The place I have started to look for this information is the TIU >>>> (Terminal Interface Unit). The TIU had TCP and TELNET. It also had SPP >>>> (station-packet-radio protocol) to improve reliability and support for >>>> other functions. FYI, I think the early packet radios had an 1822 >>>> interface. >>>>> I haven't found definitive answers to my questions but I did find a a >>>> webpage that has some links to documentation in case you are interested in >>>> the TIU. >>>>> https://gunkies.org/wiki/Terminal_Interface_Unit >>>>> >>>>> BTW, the use of DSP on this web page does not mean Digital Signal >>>> Processing. It refers to the Dispatch/SPP modules. >>>>> >>>>> barbara >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Tuesday, February 3, 2026 at 12:23:55 PM PST, John Shoch via >>>> Internet-history wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first >>>> Arpanet >>>>> link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note >>>> (11/3/25) >>>>> from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network tests >>>> of >>>>> the TCP Internet at SRI: >>>>> // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. >>>>> // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and >>>>> ARPANET. >>>>> >>>>> As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation >>>> and >>>>> testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early work >>>> at >>>>> Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and elsewhere. >>>>> Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple >>>>> networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path to >>>> what >>>>> became the Internet as we know it today. >>>>> >>>>> In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state >>>> of the >>>>> Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It took >>>> me a >>>>> while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original >>>> documents >>>>> to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of >>>> interesting >>>>> things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History >>>> Museum >>>>> have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was >>>> suggested >>>>> "you should share it before we lose this history." >>>>> >>>>> So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in >>>> 1976 >>>>> (as seen from a slightly different perspective): >>>>> >>>>> --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken >>>> place at >>>>> the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. >>>>> --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing >>>> meetings >>>>> at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the >>>> Cabana >>>>> hotel in Palo Alto. That same summer there were early discussions at >>>> PARC >>>>> about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply >>>> called >>>>> LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from Aug. >>>> 1973 >>>>> reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL and >>>>> ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for >>>>> introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the >>>>> discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to >>>> interconnect >>>>> different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A >>>> drawing >>>>> includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. >>>>> --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the >>>> alternative >>>>> LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific >>>>> protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would be a >>>> need >>>>> to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across geographies. >>>>> Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it >>>> was >>>>> also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed >>>> something >>>>> immediately. >>>>> --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC >>>> Universal >>>>> Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: >>>>> "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is >>>> to >>>>> promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell >>>> that >>>>> our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable >>>> debate >>>>> and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the >>>> ball >>>>> rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would >>>> include, in >>>>> arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) >>>> Arpanets, >>>>> (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? >>>>> [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a >>>> backbone >>>>> packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial >>>> lines.] >>>>> . >>>>> --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and >>>>> refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. >>>> Progress >>>>> was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by >>>> Boggs >>>>> and Taft: >>>>> PUP Revisited >>>>> PUP Converging >>>>> Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP >>>>> A Nova Gateway >>>>> Implementation of PUP in Tenex >>>>> PUP Again >>>>> PUP Connection State Diagram >>>>> PUP Servers on Maxc >>>>> etc., etc., etc. >>>>> >>>>> --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? The >>>>> best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 months >>>>> earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. He >>>>> reports: >>>>> "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent >>>> Ethernets >>>>> (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs >>>>> (Multiprocessor >>>>> Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating >>>> at >>>>> 1.6 mb/s). >>>>> Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a >>>> store-and-forward >>>>> packet >>>>> switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use >>>> of >>>>> other >>>>> transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth >>>> local >>>>> communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at modest >>>>> bandwidths, >>>>> and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." >>>>> The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of >>>>> Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, >>>> Fragmentation, >>>>> etc. >>>>> I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of the >>>>> complete final version. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing >>>>> --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in the >>>>> Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current >>>> text >>>>> file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, well-known >>>>> sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used to >>>>> initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The >>>> Tenex >>>>> header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- >>>>> PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. >>>>> It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 >>>> MCAs, >>>>> and the Arpanet. >>>>> Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing >>>> updates), >>>>> FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. >>>>> The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names >>>> (e.g., >>>>> MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if >>>> connected to >>>>> more than one network). >>>>> I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 >>>> machines >>>>> acting as Gateways: >>>>> --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the Arpanet, >>>>> --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, >>>> both >>>>> MCAs, and the Arpanet. >>>>> --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. >>>>> There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font >>>>> design and two for laser printer units). >>>>> The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were >>>> not >>>>> necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured as >>>>> servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser >>>> printer, >>>>> the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. >>>>> There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of these >>>> were >>>>> for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated >>>> Data >>>>> Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal >>>>> traffic). >>>>> [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos >>>> in >>>>> our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if no >>>> one >>>>> could find them via the name server, they could operate as client >>>> machines >>>>> on the PUP Internet.] >>>>> This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines >>>> on 5 >>>>> networks of 3 types. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing >>>>> >>>>> That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in >>>> March >>>>> 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP Internet. >>>>> >>>>> John >>>>> >>>>> PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. >>>>> 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very >>>>> productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but >>>> the >>>>> vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft and >>>>> Boggs. >>>>> 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general progress >>>> with >>>>> others. >>>>> --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been >>>> encouraged to >>>>> "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's networking >>>>> seminar. >>>>> --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of us >>>>> from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught by >>>>> Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us >>>> undertook >>>>> implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: evolving >>>> from >>>>> the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new >>>>> internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in the >>>>> listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) >>>> to >>>>> show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! >>>>> --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP >>>> working >>>>> group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal >>>> (who >>>>> had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working >>>> Group >>>>> meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later registered >>>> as >>>>> IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different networks >>>>> with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the >>>> East >>>>> Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts >>>>> connected." >>>>> --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting >>>> at ISI >>>>> -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, >>>>> naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] >>>>> --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became >>>> users >>>>> of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying >>>>> encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was >>>> reported >>>>> in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf >>>>> 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable >>>> byte >>>>> stream interface. >>>>> The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: >>>>> --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. >>>>> --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. >>>> to a >>>>> print server. >>>>> --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, >>>> echo, >>>>> etc.) >>>>> Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually >>>>> allowed that kind of flexibility. >>>>> 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and >>>> the >>>>> PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in the >>>> early >>>>> days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did not >>>> work >>>>> well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and >>>> b) >>>>> this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the >>>>> Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal >>>> developed >>>>> the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd >>>> generation DIX >>>>> Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network Systems >>>>> (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and >>>> endured >>>>> for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. >>>>> https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> Internet-history mailing list >>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org >>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history >>>> - >>>> Unsubscribe: >>>> https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: >>> Vint Cerf >>> Google, LLC >>> 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor >>> Reston, VA 20190 >>> +1 (571) 213 1346 <(571)%20213-1346> >>> >>> >>> until further notice >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> -- >> Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: >> Vint Cerf >> Google, LLC >> 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor >> Reston, VA 20190 >> +1 (571) 213 1346 <(571)%20213-1346> >> >> >> until further notice >> >> >> >> -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: OpenPGP_signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 665 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From geoff at iconia.com Mon Feb 9 19:45:25 2026 From: geoff at iconia.com (the keyboard of geoff goodfellow) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 20:45:25 -0700 Subject: [ih] Fwd: Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service In-Reply-To: References: <449F57D5-A79D-467C-8B48-DD34554FFCC3@pacbell.net> Message-ID: yours truly can say FOR SURE that Jim Mathis implemented the TIU's TCP because yours truly had a Collins Packet Radio with an LSI-11 host (named fernwood) running Jim's code in yours truly's office (K2079) at SRI. yours truly would interact with Jim from time-to-time regarding "improvements" ... one of the things Jim added for yours truly was a kind of poor mans/ersatz "Remote Controlled Transmission and Echoing Telnet option" (ala RFC-560) that cut down on the number of packets a terminal in character-at-a-time transmission and foreign-host echo that caused multiple packets for each character struck. geoff On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 8:08?PM Jack Haverty via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > The SRI TCP code was written in assembler language for the LSI-11. So > that code was essentially compatible with the PDP-11/40 which used a > similar (identical?) instruction set. Jim provided me with the TCP > (version 2) code, and I used it as a basis for the first TCP for Unix, > which I implemented in 1977/78. The code to implement the state > diagram, datagram parsing, and such parts could be used directly. Of > course anything relating to the OS had to be new code, since the SRI TCP > ran on MOS which was quite different from Unix. Since I had never > programmed any DEC -11 system, or heard of TCP, or knew anything about > Unix, it was very valuable to have Jim's help. > > Since the project needing the Unix TCP was using it to communicate with > an LSI-11 running the SRI TCP, this made it especially likely that those > machines could communicate, even before the "Bakeoff" occurred to nail > down interoperability and create a precise specification of the protocol. > > One interesting debugging phase occurred when SRI was having some kind > of contract dispute with the government and Jim was sympathetic but > wasn't permitted to do any work on the LSI-11 TCP. We ended up > debugging his TCP code by using DDT and packet traces to find some minor > error, patching the code, observing that it now worked, and then > emailing a bug report to Jim at SRI - something like "we don't know > exactly why, but changing the instruction at location xxxxx fixed our > problem!" Subsequently TCP evolved to become TCP/IPV4, and we made the > necessary changes independently to the two systems. > > So I can't say for sure that Jim implemented the TIU's TCP, but he's the > one who gave it to me in 1977 and helped with questions etc. > > /Jack Haverty > > On 2/9/26 18:30, Vint Cerf via Internet-history wrote: > > there is no question about this - he was charged with implementing on > > LSI-11/23 > > > > v > > > > > > On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 6:39?PM Don Nielson wrote: > > > >> I should have affirmed that Jim Mathis was almost certainly responsible > >> for the TCP process in the TIU. Don > >> Sent from my iPhone > >> > >> On Feb 9, 2026, at 4:33?AM, Vint Cerf wrote: > >> > >> ? > >> thanks Don!! we were trying to figure out early efforts at bridging > >> networks - PRNET was a key project for exploring that concept. > >> > >> v > >> > >> > >> On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 3:46?AM Don Nielson > wrote: > >> > >>> Vint, Barbara, and all, > >>> I'm not sure I understand the impetus for all this but thought I'd try > to > >>> help pin down some dates in the early use of the TIU and TCP. > >>> > >>> The first I could find was in a Packet Radio Quarterly Report covering > >>> 1 May 1976 to 31 July 1976. During that time a gateway was in the > >>> station computer and was first just doing header swaps between the > >>> ARPANET and the PRNET. But in the same period the LSI-11 TIU was > >>> there running a single-connection user version TCP. Rather that try > >>> to describe what was written, I've attached three images of the report > >>> and the text. Reference to the description of the TIU architecture > >>> also included Dave Retz as the lead author so his hand was in it > >>> as well, probably more to do with the MOS operating system and > >>> the ELF processes working there. I've also attached a process > >>> diagram of the TIU circa Feb 1977. > >>> > >>> Hope this helps. > >>> Don > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On 2/5/26 4:10 AM, Vint Cerf wrote: > >>> > >>> Jim Mathis did the TIU system - must have been circa 1975/1976 > >>> vint > >>> > >>> > >>> On Thu, Feb 5, 2026 at 1:01?AM Greg Skinner via Internet-history < > >>> internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Forwarded for Barbara > >>>> > >>>>> ----- Forwarded Message ----- > >>>>> From: Barbara Denny > >>>>> To: internet-history > >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2026 at 09:34:45 PM PST > >>>>> Subject: Re: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link > >>>> Put Into Service > >>>>> Having trouble with the mailing list again so not all the text for > >>>> this thread is included. > >>>>> This discussion covers a time period before I worked on packet radio. > >>>> John Shoch's recollection made me curious about when TCP was first > used > >>>> over packet radio and when the first generation radios (EPRs?) were > >>>> available. The place I have started to look for this information is > the TIU > >>>> (Terminal Interface Unit). The TIU had TCP and TELNET. It also had > SPP > >>>> (station-packet-radio protocol) to improve reliability and support for > >>>> other functions. FYI, I think the early packet radios had an 1822 > >>>> interface. > >>>>> I haven't found definitive answers to my questions but I did find a a > >>>> webpage that has some links to documentation in case you are > interested in > >>>> the TIU. > >>>>> https://gunkies.org/wiki/Terminal_Interface_Unit > >>>>> > >>>>> BTW, the use of DSP on this web page does not mean Digital Signal > >>>> Processing. It refers to the Dispatch/SPP modules. > >>>>> > >>>>> barbara > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> On Tuesday, February 3, 2026 at 12:23:55 PM PST, John Shoch via > >>>> Internet-history wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first > >>>> Arpanet > >>>>> link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note > >>>> (11/3/25) > >>>>> from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network > tests > >>>> of > >>>>> the TCP Internet at SRI: > >>>>> // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. > >>>>> // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and > >>>>> ARPANET. > >>>>> > >>>>> As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation > >>>> and > >>>>> testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early > work > >>>> at > >>>>> Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and > elsewhere. > >>>>> Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple > >>>>> networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path to > >>>> what > >>>>> became the Internet as we know it today. > >>>>> > >>>>> In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state > >>>> of the > >>>>> Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It took > >>>> me a > >>>>> while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original > >>>> documents > >>>>> to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of > >>>> interesting > >>>>> things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History > >>>> Museum > >>>>> have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was > >>>> suggested > >>>>> "you should share it before we lose this history." > >>>>> > >>>>> So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in > >>>> 1976 > >>>>> (as seen from a slightly different perspective): > >>>>> > >>>>> --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken > >>>> place at > >>>>> the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. > >>>>> --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing > >>>> meetings > >>>>> at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the > >>>> Cabana > >>>>> hotel in Palo Alto. That same summer there were early discussions at > >>>> PARC > >>>>> about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply > >>>> called > >>>>> LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from Aug. > >>>> 1973 > >>>>> reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL > and > >>>>> ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for > >>>>> introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the > >>>>> discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to > >>>> interconnect > >>>>> different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A > >>>> drawing > >>>>> includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. > >>>>> --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the > >>>> alternative > >>>>> LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific > >>>>> protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would be > a > >>>> need > >>>>> to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across > geographies. > >>>>> Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it > >>>> was > >>>>> also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed > >>>> something > >>>>> immediately. > >>>>> --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC > >>>> Universal > >>>>> Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: > >>>>> "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is > >>>> to > >>>>> promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell > >>>> that > >>>>> our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable > >>>> debate > >>>>> and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the > >>>> ball > >>>>> rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would > >>>> include, in > >>>>> arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) > >>>> Arpanets, > >>>>> (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? > >>>>> [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a > >>>> backbone > >>>>> packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial > >>>> lines.] > >>>>> . > >>>>> --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and > >>>>> refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. > >>>> Progress > >>>>> was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by > >>>> Boggs > >>>>> and Taft: > >>>>> PUP Revisited > >>>>> PUP Converging > >>>>> Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP > >>>>> A Nova Gateway > >>>>> Implementation of PUP in Tenex > >>>>> PUP Again > >>>>> PUP Connection State Diagram > >>>>> PUP Servers on Maxc > >>>>> etc., etc., etc. > >>>>> > >>>>> --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? > The > >>>>> best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 > months > >>>>> earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. He > >>>>> reports: > >>>>> "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent > >>>> Ethernets > >>>>> (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs > >>>>> (Multiprocessor > >>>>> Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating > >>>> at > >>>>> 1.6 mb/s). > >>>>> Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a > >>>> store-and-forward > >>>>> packet > >>>>> switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use > >>>> of > >>>>> other > >>>>> transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth > >>>> local > >>>>> communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at > modest > >>>>> bandwidths, > >>>>> and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." > >>>>> The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of > >>>>> Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, > >>>> Fragmentation, > >>>>> etc. > >>>>> I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of the > >>>>> complete final version. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing > >>>>> --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in > the > >>>>> Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current > >>>> text > >>>>> file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, > well-known > >>>>> sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used to > >>>>> initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The > >>>> Tenex > >>>>> header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- > >>>>> PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. > >>>>> It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 > >>>> MCAs, > >>>>> and the Arpanet. > >>>>> Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing > >>>> updates), > >>>>> FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. > >>>>> The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names > >>>> (e.g., > >>>>> MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if > >>>> connected to > >>>>> more than one network). > >>>>> I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 > >>>> machines > >>>>> acting as Gateways: > >>>>> --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the > Arpanet, > >>>>> --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, > >>>> both > >>>>> MCAs, and the Arpanet. > >>>>> --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. > >>>>> There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font > >>>>> design and two for laser printer units). > >>>>> The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were > >>>> not > >>>>> necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured as > >>>>> servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser > >>>> printer, > >>>>> the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. > >>>>> There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of these > >>>> were > >>>>> for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated > >>>> Data > >>>>> Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal > >>>>> traffic). > >>>>> [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos > >>>> in > >>>>> our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if > no > >>>> one > >>>>> could find them via the name server, they could operate as client > >>>> machines > >>>>> on the PUP Internet.] > >>>>> This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines > >>>> on 5 > >>>>> networks of 3 types. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing > >>>>> > >>>>> That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in > >>>> March > >>>>> 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP > Internet. > >>>>> > >>>>> John > >>>>> > >>>>> PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. > >>>>> 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very > >>>>> productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but > >>>> the > >>>>> vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft > and > >>>>> Boggs. > >>>>> 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general > progress > >>>> with > >>>>> others. > >>>>> --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been > >>>> encouraged to > >>>>> "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's > networking > >>>>> seminar. > >>>>> --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of > us > >>>>> from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught > by > >>>>> Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us > >>>> undertook > >>>>> implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: evolving > >>>> from > >>>>> the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new > >>>>> internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in the > >>>>> listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) > >>>> to > >>>>> show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! > >>>>> --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP > >>>> working > >>>>> group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal > >>>> (who > >>>>> had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working > >>>> Group > >>>>> meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later > registered > >>>> as > >>>>> IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different > networks > >>>>> with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the > >>>> East > >>>>> Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts > >>>>> connected." > >>>>> --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting > >>>> at ISI > >>>>> -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, > >>>>> naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] > >>>>> --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became > >>>> users > >>>>> of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying > >>>>> encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was > >>>> reported > >>>>> in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf > >>>>> 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable > >>>> byte > >>>>> stream interface. > >>>>> The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: > >>>>> --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. > >>>>> --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. > >>>> to a > >>>>> print server. > >>>>> --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, > >>>> echo, > >>>>> etc.) > >>>>> Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually > >>>>> allowed that kind of flexibility. > >>>>> 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and > >>>> the > >>>>> PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in the > >>>> early > >>>>> days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did > not > >>>> work > >>>>> well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and > >>>> b) > >>>>> this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the > >>>>> Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal > >>>> developed > >>>>> the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd > >>>> generation DIX > >>>>> Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network > Systems > >>>>> (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and > >>>> endured > >>>>> for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. > >>>>> https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 > >>>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> Internet-history mailing list > >>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > >>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > >>>> - > >>>> Unsubscribe: > >>>> > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > >>>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: > >>> Vint Cerf > >>> Google, LLC > >>> 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor > >>> Reston, VA 20190 > >>> +1 (571) 213 1346 <(571)%20213-1346> > >>> > >>> > >>> until further notice > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> -- > >> Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: > >> Vint Cerf > >> Google, LLC > >> 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor > >> Reston, VA 20190 > >> +1 (571) 213 1346 <(571)%20213-1346> > >> > >> > >> until further notice > >> > >> > >> > >> > > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > -- Geoff.Goodfellow at iconia.com living as The Truth is True From touch at strayalpha.com Mon Feb 9 20:07:45 2026 From: touch at strayalpha.com (touch at strayalpha.com) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2026 20:07:45 -0800 Subject: [ih] A personal note on the passing of Dave Farber Message-ID: <4F47C558-AC28-4851-805F-62CB82227555@strayalpha.com> Hi, all, I too am sad to hear of the recent passing of Dave Farber. Dave was my PhD advisor at UPenn. I was introduced to him by Dave Sincoskie, one of Dave?s PhD ?F-Troup?* members, when I was his summer intern at Bellcore in 1987. I interviewed with Dave while he was faculty at UDel and joined him as he shifted schools in June 1988. Throughout his storied academic career, he was perhaps THE exception to the rule ?most PhD advisors have PhDs?. He carried both an appreciation for fundamentals and a bent towards the pragmatic that I particularly appreciated. While at Penn, I met other members of F-Troup ? Marshall Rose (reviewing his SNMP book), Guru Parulkar, Gary Delp (finishing his thesis at Udel), and Ron Minnich (who transferred to finish at UPenn), as well as second-generation member James Sterbenz (Guru?s advisee). That continued my first full-time job with Jon Postel, and later Paul Mockapetris, both while at USC/ISI. It is a small group in which I am a particularly proud member. Dave travelled so frequently that his students often computed his ?average altitude? based on his nearly back-to-back flights. He gave me the unique opportunity to pursue my own idea (based on a conversation we had on a drive from Philly to DC), supporting my soliciting support from DARPA and representing it directly at PI meetings. Everyone in F-Troup knew advisor meetings were a challenge, more often than not happening during the walk between other events. We often pondered whether Dave made us independent or whether only an independent student would have sought him out - and stayed. We kept in contact through emails and occasional visits, including his famous ?Interesting People? email list, where I was both an avid reader and occasional contributor, and which inspired the creation of this (Internet History) list. For my students, I created an F-Troop clone at USC called T-Troup, as did other first and second-generation advisees at their schools. Occasionally, Dave and I had an opportunity to collaborate, most recently on a talk presented just as COVID arrived on ?Rebooting the Internet?. When we weren?t collaborating, we were commiserating ? about the state of network research, the state of its funding support, and numerous other issues. Although I will miss him, I sincerely appreciate the opportunities he presented and his inspiration, and I value the times our ships crossed. Whether in academia or not, I hope each of us aspires to such a noble legacy. With deepest regards, thanks for everything, Dave. Joe F-Troup PhD graduate, UPenn 1992 (* F-Troup was a deliberate misspelling of the TV show ?F-Troop?) ? Dr. Joe Touch, temporal epistemologist www.strayalpha.com From carlstonbohman at gmail.com Mon Feb 9 23:12:40 2026 From: carlstonbohman at gmail.com (Carlston Bohman) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2026 11:12:40 +0400 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book Message-ID: I have received the same email on multiple mailing lists. Too much cross-posting makes it look like spam. I?ve read that book too. There?s a page in the book mentioning that it was reviewed by Vint Cerf. Below is Vint Cerf?s reply as well. Honestly, the book is interesting and has some great content. Just my two cents. Regards, Carlston On Tue, Feb 10, 2026 at 2:25?AM vinton cerf via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: I did review the "book" - it has an outline-like feel to it but I thought it did a pretty good job of picking up high points of the history. I didn't think there were too many major gaffes. Others might not agree, depending on their personal stories and experiences. v On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 4:18?PM touch--- via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: https://www.gvsu.edu/classics/peter-anderson-77.htm Peter Anderson - The Department of Classics - Grand Valley State University gvsu.edu Given the credentials listed, you can come to your own conclusions as to the review below. However, I do discourage cross-posting; it just hits the same people on different lists. Vint can speak to whether he actually reviewed the book; unless that claim is false, this is a viable post to this list. Joe (as list admin) ? Dr. Joe Touch, temporal epistemologist www.strayalpha.com On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 1:37?PM Peter Anderson < professorpeteranderson at gmail.com> wrote: *(Apologies for cross-posting)* As a researcher, I have never come across a highly intensive and inclusive book like "The Internet Ecosystem". The book englobes the whole Internet Ecosystem with the correct information compared to misleading information from blogs/wikipedia on the Internet. This book was reviewed by Vint Cerf. I have just completed the reading, I will highly recommend it and it is nice to have a copy to keep for reference. Professor Peter Anderson Head of Research ------------------------------ *From:* Nikesh B. Simmandree *Sent:* Monday, August 18, 2025 1:35 PM *To:* alac-announce at icann.org ; alac at icann.org < alac at icann.org>; at-large at icann.org ; afri-discuss at icann.org *Subject:* Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book Dear Community, I am thrilled to announce the launch of my book, *The Internet Ecosystem* ? a comprehensive exploration of the history, architecture, governance, and future of the Internet. This book distills decades of technological evolution ? from ARPANET and packet switching, to AI, Web3, quantum networks, and beyond ? into a clear, engaging narrative accessible to both technical and non-technical readers *What the Book Covers* - *The Past:* How Cold War research, ARPANET, and packet switching gave birth to the Internet we know today. - *The Present:* The intricate roles of ISPs, backbone providers, cloud infrastructure, AI, cybersecurity, and global governance shaping our daily online experiences. - *The Future:* Insights into 5G/6G, blockchain, immersive technologies, quantum security, and the Internet in 2050. With *49 detailed chapters*, the book provides a definitive yet approachable reference for students, professionals, policymakers, and curious readers alike. My mission with *The Internet Ecosystem* is to make the Internet?s complexity understandable ? showing not only *how* the Internet works, but also *why* it matters and has become one of the most transformative human inventions ? while sparking dialogue on how we build a secure, inclusive, and sustainable digital future. In the 21st century, understanding the Internet is not optional ? it?s essential. Whether you?re a business leader, policymaker, educator, student, or everyday Internet user, this book provides the context and clarity you need to navigate the opportunities and challenges of our connected world. *Get Your Copy* *The Internet Ecosystem* is now available: https://payhip.com/b/hfvYg Thank you, Best Regards, Nikesh B. Simmandree +230-5-907-3413 nikeshbs at outlook.com This message and its attachments are intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and are strictly confidential. If you have received this in error, please delete it from any devices after having informed the sender. From b_a_denny at yahoo.com Tue Feb 10 00:14:05 2026 From: b_a_denny at yahoo.com (Barbara Denny) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2026 08:14:05 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [ih] Fwd: Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service In-Reply-To: References: <449F57D5-A79D-467C-8B48-DD34554FFCC3@pacbell.net> Message-ID: <186539919.850906.1770711245969@mail.yahoo.com> Just a small chime since I have seen more than once a mention of the Collins Packet Radio.? I think I have convinced myself Collins won the award for the original Packet Radio contract (1973?). However Rockwell bought Collins in 1973 according to various web sites. I only knew the radio folks as from Rockwell in the Dallas area (maybe they were located in Richardson, Texas). Rockwell Collins had their headquarters in Cedar Rapids Iowa which is where Collins was originally. I am guessing the folks I knew were also? part of the Collins division? but I could be wrong.? BTW, Collins Radio Company has a very interesting history.? I believe the low cost packet radio (LPR ) hardware was from Hazeltine under the SURAN contract (the follow on to Packet Radio). Just noticed that Hazeltine was bought in 1986 by Emerson Electric Company.? I didn't spend that much time on? SURAN at SRI so I can't clarify what happened with the LPR in the mid 80s after the buy out. David Beyer could probably answer this question. I think SURAN ended in the early 90s. Just in case you might need this info sometime. barbara On Monday, February 9, 2026 at 07:46:23 PM PST, the keyboard of geoff goodfellow via Internet-history wrote: g yours truly can say FOR SURE that Jim Mathis implemented the TIU's TCP because yours truly had a Collins Packet Radio with an LSI-11 host (named fernwood) running Jim's code in yours truly's office (K2079) at SRI. yours truly would interact with Jim from time-to-time regarding "improvements" ... one of the things Jim added for yours truly was a kind of poor mans/ersatz "Remote Controlled Transmission and Echoing Telnet option" (ala RFC-560) that cut down on the number of packets a terminal in character-at-a-time transmission and foreign-host echo that caused multiple packets for eac On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 8:08?PM Jack Haverty via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > The SRI TCP code was written in assembler language for the LSI-11. So > that code was essentially compatible with the PDP-11/40 which used a > similar (identical?) instruction set.? Jim provided me with the TCP > (version 2) code, and I used it as a basis for the first TCP for Unix, > which I implemented in 1977/78.? The code to implement the state > diagram, datagram parsing, and such parts could be used directly.? Of > course anything relating to the OS had to be new code, since the SRI TCP > ran on MOS which was quite different from Unix.? Since I had never > programmed any DEC -11 system, or heard of TCP, or knew anything about > Unix, it was very valuable to have Jim's help. > > Since the project needing the Unix TCP was using it to communicate with > an LSI-11 running the SRI TCP, this made it especially likely that those > machines could communicate, even before the "Bakeoff" occurred to nail > down interoperability and create a precise specification of the protocol. > > One interesting debugging phase occurred when SRI was having some kind > of contract dispute with the government and Jim was sympathetic but > wasn't permitted to do any work on the LSI-11 TCP.? We ended up > debugging his TCP code by using DDT and packet traces to find some minor > error, patching the code, observing that it now worked, and then > emailing a bug report to Jim at SRI - something like "we don't know > exactly why, but changing the instruction at location xxxxx fixed our > problem!"? Subsequently TCP evolved to become TCP/IPV4, and we made the > necessary changes independently to the two systems. > > So I can't say for sure that Jim implemented the TIU's TCP, but he's the > one who gave it to me in 1977 and helped with questions etc. > > /Jack Haverty > > On 2/9/26 18:30, Vint Cerf via Internet-history wrote: > > there is no question about this - he was charged with implementing on > > LSI-11/23 > > > > v > > > > > > On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 6:39?PM Don Nielson wrote: > > > >> I should have affirmed that Jim Mathis was almost certainly responsible > >> for the TCP process in the TIU.? Don > >> Sent from my iPhone > >> > >> On Feb 9, 2026, at 4:33?AM, Vint Cerf wrote: > >> > >> ? > >> thanks Don!! we were trying to figure out early efforts at bridging > >> networks - PRNET was a key project for exploring that concept. > >> > >> v > >> > >> > >> On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 3:46?AM Don Nielson > wrote: > >> > >>> Vint, Barbara, and all, > >>> I'm not sure I understand the impetus for all this but thought I'd try > to > >>> help pin down some dates in the early use of the TIU and TCP. > >>> > >>> The first I could find was in a Packet Radio Quarterly Report covering > >>> 1 May 1976 to 31 July 1976.? During that time a gateway was in the > >>> station computer and was first just doing header swaps between the > >>> ARPANET and the PRNET.? But in the same period the LSI-11 TIU was > >>> there running a single-connection user version TCP.? Rather that try > >>> to describe what was written, I've attached three images of the report > >>> and the text.? Reference to the description of the TIU architecture > >>> also included Dave Retz as the lead author so his hand was in it > >>> as well, probably more to do with the MOS operating system and > >>> the ELF processes working there.? I've also attached a process > >>> diagram of the TIU circa Feb 1977. > >>> > >>> Hope this helps. > >>> Don > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On 2/5/26 4:10 AM, Vint Cerf wrote: > >>> > >>> Jim Mathis did the TIU system - must have been circa 1975/1976 > >>> vint > >>> > >>> > >>> On Thu, Feb 5, 2026 at 1:01?AM Greg Skinner via Internet-history < > >>> internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Forwarded for Barbara > >>>> > >>>>> ----- Forwarded Message ----- > >>>>> From: Barbara Denny > >>>>> To: internet-history > >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2026 at 09:34:45 PM PST > >>>>> Subject: Re: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link > >>>> Put Into Service > >>>>> Having trouble with the mailing list again so not all the text for > >>>> this thread is included. > >>>>> This discussion covers a time period before I worked on packet radio. > >>>> John Shoch's recollection made me curious about when TCP was first > used > >>>> over packet radio and when the first generation radios (EPRs?) were > >>>> available. The place I have started to look for this information is > the TIU > >>>> (Terminal Interface Unit).? The TIU had TCP and TELNET. It also had > SPP > >>>> (station-packet-radio protocol) to improve reliability and support for > >>>> other functions. FYI,? I think the early packet radios had an 1822 > >>>> interface. > >>>>> I haven't found definitive answers to my questions but I did find a a > >>>> webpage that has some links to documentation in case you are > interested in > >>>> the TIU. > >>>>> https://gunkies.org/wiki/Terminal_Interface_Unit > >>>>> > >>>>> BTW,? the use of DSP on this web page does not mean Digital Signal > >>>> Processing. It refers to the Dispatch/SPP modules. > >>>>> > >>>>> barbara > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> On Tuesday, February 3, 2026 at 12:23:55 PM PST, John Shoch via > >>>> Internet-history wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first > >>>> Arpanet > >>>>> link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note > >>>> (11/3/25) > >>>>> from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network > tests > >>>> of > >>>>> the TCP Internet at SRI: > >>>>> // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and ARPANET. > >>>>> // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, and > >>>>> ARPANET. > >>>>> > >>>>> As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, implementation > >>>> and > >>>>> testing had been done just on the Arpanet.? Building on the early > work > >>>> at > >>>>> Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and > elsewhere. > >>>>> Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and multiple > >>>>> networks -- were? tremendously important milestones along the path to > >>>> what > >>>>> became the Internet as we know it today. > >>>>> > >>>>> In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual state > >>>> of the > >>>>> Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976.? It took > >>>> me a > >>>>> while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original > >>>> documents > >>>>> to ensure that we got the history right.? I found a couple of > >>>> interesting > >>>>> things and wrote up a summary.? My friends at the Computer History > >>>> Museum > >>>>> have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was > >>>> suggested > >>>>> "you should share it before we lose this history." > >>>>> > >>>>> So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking in > >>>> 1976 > >>>>> (as seen from a slightly different perspective): > >>>>> > >>>>> --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken > >>>> place at > >>>>> the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. > >>>>> --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing > >>>> meetings > >>>>> at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the > >>>> Cabana > >>>>> hotel in Palo Alto.? That same summer there were early discussions at > >>>> PARC > >>>>> about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design simply > >>>> called > >>>>> LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them.? A memo from Aug. > >>>> 1973 > >>>>> reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL > and > >>>>> ETHER networks.? This memo describes a rather general proposal for > >>>>> introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the > >>>>> discussion.? The adoption of the standard would enable us to > >>>> interconnect > >>>>> different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..?? A > >>>> drawing > >>>>> includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. > >>>>> --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the > >>>> alternative > >>>>> LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic Ethernet-specific > >>>>> protocols implemented (EEFTP).? Yet it was clear that there would be > a > >>>> need > >>>>> to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across > geographies. > >>>>> Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but it > >>>> was > >>>>> also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed > >>>> something > >>>>> immediately. > >>>>> --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC > >>>> Universal > >>>>> Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: > >>>>> "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose is > >>>> to > >>>>> promote a standard.? Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in hell > >>>> that > >>>>> our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without interminable > >>>> debate > >>>>> and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get the > >>>> ball > >>>>> rolling early. ...? A list of the packet networks at Parc would > >>>> include, in > >>>>> arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) > >>>> Arpanets, > >>>>> (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? > >>>>> [MCANets connected Data General Novas.? "EIAnets" evolved into a > >>>> backbone > >>>>> packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial > >>>> lines.] > >>>>> . > >>>>> --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and > >>>>> refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. > >>>> Progress > >>>>> was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later by > >>>> Boggs > >>>>> and Taft: > >>>>>? ? PUP Revisited > >>>>>? ? PUP Converging > >>>>>? ? Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP > >>>>>? ? A Nova Gateway > >>>>>? ? Implementation of PUP in Tenex > >>>>>? ? PUP Again > >>>>>? ? PUP Connection State Diagram > >>>>>? ? PUP Servers on Maxc > >>>>>? ? etc., etc., etc. > >>>>> > >>>>> --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? > The > >>>>> best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 > months > >>>>> earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975.? He > >>>>> reports: > >>>>> "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent > >>>> Ethernets > >>>>> (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs > >>>>> (Multiprocessor > >>>>> Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, operating > >>>> at > >>>>> 1.6 mb/s). > >>>>> Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a > >>>> store-and-forward > >>>>> packet > >>>>> switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making use > >>>> of > >>>>> other > >>>>> transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high bandwidth > >>>> local > >>>>> communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at > modest > >>>>> bandwidths, > >>>>> and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." > >>>>> The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of > >>>>> Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, > >>>> Fragmentation, > >>>>> etc. > >>>>> I only have a draft of this memo;? I have not yet found a copy of the > >>>>> complete final version. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing > >>>>> --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in > the > >>>>> Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the then-current > >>>> text > >>>>> file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, > well-known > >>>>> sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping.? This file was used to > >>>>> initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server.? The > >>>> Tenex > >>>>> header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- > >>>>> PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. > >>>>> It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 > >>>> MCAs, > >>>>> and the Arpanet. > >>>>> Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing > >>>> updates), > >>>>> FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. > >>>>> The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names > >>>> (e.g., > >>>>> MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if > >>>> connected to > >>>>> more than one network). > >>>>> I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time.? This includes 3 > >>>> machines > >>>>> acting as Gateways: > >>>>>? ? --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the > Arpanet, > >>>>>? ? --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one Ethernet, > >>>> both > >>>>> MCAs, and the Arpanet. > >>>>>? ? --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. > >>>>> There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for font > >>>>> design and two for laser printer units). > >>>>> The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but were > >>>> not > >>>>> necessarily running as Gateways).? These included Novas configured as > >>>>> servers controlling the older XGP printer,? the newer EARS laser > >>>> printer, > >>>>> the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. > >>>>> There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets.? Most of these > >>>> were > >>>>> for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a dedicated > >>>> Data > >>>>> Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound terminal > >>>>> traffic). > >>>>> [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other Altos > >>>> in > >>>>> our group which were not in the database (including mine).? Even if > no > >>>> one > >>>>> could find them via the name server, they could operate as client > >>>> machines > >>>>> on the PUP Internet.] > >>>>> This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 machines > >>>> on 5 > >>>>> networks of 3 types. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing > >>>>> > >>>>> That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in > >>>> March > >>>>> 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP > Internet. > >>>>> > >>>>> John > >>>>> > >>>>> PS:? A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. > >>>>> 1.? For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very > >>>>> productive.? There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, but > >>>> the > >>>>> vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft > and > >>>>> Boggs. > >>>>> 2.? As best we could, we did try to share some of our general > progress > >>>> with > >>>>> others. > >>>>> --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been > >>>> encouraged to > >>>>> "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford.? I took part in Vint's > networking > >>>>> seminar. > >>>>> --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three of > us > >>>>> from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught > by > >>>>> Vint.? We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us > >>>> undertook > >>>>> implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer:? evolving > >>>> from > >>>>> the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new > >>>>> internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL).? We turned in the > >>>>> listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet watcher) > >>>> to > >>>>> show how it worked.? We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! > >>>>> --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP > >>>> working > >>>>> group meetings.? In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen Dalal > >>>> (who > >>>>> had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP Working > >>>> Group > >>>>> meeting held at MIT.? Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later > registered > >>>> as > >>>>> IEN 65) reflected some of our overview:? "PARC has 5 different > networks > >>>>> with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on the > >>>> East > >>>>> Coast.? Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 hosts > >>>>> connected." > >>>>> --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet meeting > >>>> at ISI > >>>>> -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, > >>>>> naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] > >>>>> --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we became > >>>> users > >>>>> of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying > >>>>> encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways.? This was > >>>> reported > >>>>> in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf > >>>>> 3.? At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable > >>>> byte > >>>>> stream interface. > >>>>> The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple levels: > >>>>> --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. > >>>>> --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, esp. > >>>> to a > >>>>> print server. > >>>>> --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time server, > >>>> echo, > >>>>> etc.) > >>>>> Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP eventually > >>>>> allowed that kind of flexibility. > >>>>> 4.? Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet and > >>>> the > >>>>> PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID.? This worked OK in the > >>>> early > >>>>> days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did > not > >>>> work > >>>>> well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, and > >>>> b) > >>>>> this would not scale adequately.? We tried to learn from both the > >>>>> Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet.? Thus, Yogen Dalal > >>>> developed > >>>>> the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd > >>>> generation DIX > >>>>> Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network > Systems > >>>>> (XNS) protocols.? The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and > >>>> endured > >>>>> for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. > >>>>>? ? https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 > >>>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> Internet-history mailing list > >>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > >>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > >>>> - > >>>> Unsubscribe: > >>>> > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > >>>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: > >>> Vint Cerf > >>> Google, LLC > >>> 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor > >>> Reston, VA 20190 > >>> +1 (571) 213 1346 <(571)%20213-1346> > >>> > >>> > >>> until further notice From vgcerf at gmail.com Tue Feb 10 02:44:38 2026 From: vgcerf at gmail.com (vinton cerf) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2026 05:44:38 -0500 Subject: [ih] Fwd: Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET Link Put Into Service In-Reply-To: <186539919.850906.1770711245969@mail.yahoo.com> References: <449F57D5-A79D-467C-8B48-DD34554FFCC3@pacbell.net> <186539919.850906.1770711245969@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: there is a video documentary in which Collins' involvement in the packet radio experiment is highlighted along with their role in the space program. Bob Kahn is extensively interviewed on the Packet Radio aspect. I have a DVD of their documentary. It was produced in 2025 I believe. Bob very deliberately researched Collins before deciding to contract with them to develop the original Packet Radio and subsequent models. I ran that program after Bob became office director and Barry Leiner took over when I left DARPA to join MCI. https://www.thegazette.com/people-places/collins-legacy-association-releases-feature-film-revealing-cedar-rapids-role-in-creating-the-interne/#:~:text=Don%20Nielson%20and%20Ron%20Kunzelman%20are%20interviewed,to%20birth%20the%20internet%20in%20Mountain%20View%2C v On Tue, Feb 10, 2026 at 3:14?AM Barbara Denny via Internet-history < internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > Just a small chime since I have seen more than once a mention of the > Collins Packet Radio. I think I have convinced myself Collins won the > award for the original Packet Radio contract (1973?). However Rockwell > bought Collins in 1973 according to various web sites. I only knew the > radio folks as from Rockwell in the Dallas area (maybe they were located in > Richardson, Texas). Rockwell Collins had their headquarters in Cedar Rapids > Iowa which is where Collins was originally. I am guessing the folks I knew > were also part of the Collins division? but I could be wrong. > BTW, Collins Radio Company has a very interesting history. > I believe the low cost packet radio (LPR ) hardware was from Hazeltine > under the SURAN contract (the follow on to Packet Radio). Just noticed that > Hazeltine was bought in 1986 by Emerson Electric Company. I didn't spend > that much time on SURAN at SRI so I can't clarify what happened with the > LPR in the mid 80s after the buy out. David Beyer could probably answer > this question. I think SURAN ended in the early 90s. > Just in case you might need this info sometime. > barbara > On Monday, February 9, 2026 at 07:46:23 PM PST, the keyboard of geoff > goodfellow via Internet-history > wrote: g > yours truly can say FOR SURE that Jim Mathis implemented the TIU's TCP > because yours truly had a Collins Packet Radio with an LSI-11 host (named > fernwood) running Jim's code in yours truly's office (K2079) at SRI. > > yours truly would interact with Jim from time-to-time regarding > "improvements" ... one of the things Jim added for yours truly was a kind > of poor mans/ersatz "Remote Controlled Transmission and Echoing Telnet > option" (ala RFC-560) that cut down on the number of packets a terminal in > character-at-a-time transmission and foreign-host echo that caused multiple > packets for eac > > > On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 8:08?PM Jack Haverty via Internet-history < > internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > > > The SRI TCP code was written in assembler language for the LSI-11. So > > that code was essentially compatible with the PDP-11/40 which used a > > similar (identical?) instruction set. Jim provided me with the TCP > > (version 2) code, and I used it as a basis for the first TCP for Unix, > > which I implemented in 1977/78. The code to implement the state > > diagram, datagram parsing, and such parts could be used directly. Of > > course anything relating to the OS had to be new code, since the SRI TCP > > ran on MOS which was quite different from Unix. Since I had never > > programmed any DEC -11 system, or heard of TCP, or knew anything about > > Unix, it was very valuable to have Jim's help. > > > > Since the project needing the Unix TCP was using it to communicate with > > an LSI-11 running the SRI TCP, this made it especially likely that those > > machines could communicate, even before the "Bakeoff" occurred to nail > > down interoperability and create a precise specification of the protocol. > > > > One interesting debugging phase occurred when SRI was having some kind > > of contract dispute with the government and Jim was sympathetic but > > wasn't permitted to do any work on the LSI-11 TCP. We ended up > > debugging his TCP code by using DDT and packet traces to find some minor > > error, patching the code, observing that it now worked, and then > > emailing a bug report to Jim at SRI - something like "we don't know > > exactly why, but changing the instruction at location xxxxx fixed our > > problem!" Subsequently TCP evolved to become TCP/IPV4, and we made the > > necessary changes independently to the two systems. > > > > So I can't say for sure that Jim implemented the TIU's TCP, but he's the > > one who gave it to me in 1977 and helped with questions etc. > > > > /Jack Haverty > > > > On 2/9/26 18:30, Vint Cerf via Internet-history wrote: > > > there is no question about this - he was charged with implementing on > > > LSI-11/23 > > > > > > v > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 6:39?PM Don Nielson > wrote: > > > > > >> I should have affirmed that Jim Mathis was almost certainly > responsible > > >> for the TCP process in the TIU. Don > > >> Sent from my iPhone > > >> > > >> On Feb 9, 2026, at 4:33?AM, Vint Cerf wrote: > > >> > > >> ? > > >> thanks Don!! we were trying to figure out early efforts at bridging > > >> networks - PRNET was a key project for exploring that concept. > > >> > > >> v > > >> > > >> > > >> On Mon, Feb 9, 2026 at 3:46?AM Don Nielson > > wrote: > > >> > > >>> Vint, Barbara, and all, > > >>> I'm not sure I understand the impetus for all this but thought I'd > try > > to > > >>> help pin down some dates in the early use of the TIU and TCP. > > >>> > > >>> The first I could find was in a Packet Radio Quarterly Report > covering > > >>> 1 May 1976 to 31 July 1976. During that time a gateway was in the > > >>> station computer and was first just doing header swaps between the > > >>> ARPANET and the PRNET. But in the same period the LSI-11 TIU was > > >>> there running a single-connection user version TCP. Rather that try > > >>> to describe what was written, I've attached three images of the > report > > >>> and the text. Reference to the description of the TIU architecture > > >>> also included Dave Retz as the lead author so his hand was in it > > >>> as well, probably more to do with the MOS operating system and > > >>> the ELF processes working there. I've also attached a process > > >>> diagram of the TIU circa Feb 1977. > > >>> > > >>> Hope this helps. > > >>> Don > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> On 2/5/26 4:10 AM, Vint Cerf wrote: > > >>> > > >>> Jim Mathis did the TIU system - must have been circa 1975/1976 > > >>> vint > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> On Thu, Feb 5, 2026 at 1:01?AM Greg Skinner via Internet-history < > > >>> internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote: > > >>> > > >>>> Forwarded for Barbara > > >>>> > > >>>>> ----- Forwarded Message ----- > > >>>>> From: Barbara Denny > > >>>>> To: internet-history > > >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2026 at 09:34:45 PM PST > > >>>>> Subject: Re: [ih] Early internetworking ca. 1976 / First ARPANET > Link > > >>>> Put Into Service > > >>>>> Having trouble with the mailing list again so not all the text for > > >>>> this thread is included. > > >>>>> This discussion covers a time period before I worked on packet > radio. > > >>>> John Shoch's recollection made me curious about when TCP was first > > used > > >>>> over packet radio and when the first generation radios (EPRs?) were > > >>>> available. The place I have started to look for this information is > > the TIU > > >>>> (Terminal Interface Unit). The TIU had TCP and TELNET. It also had > > SPP > > >>>> (station-packet-radio protocol) to improve reliability and support > for > > >>>> other functions. FYI, I think the early packet radios had an 1822 > > >>>> interface. > > >>>>> I haven't found definitive answers to my questions but I did find > a a > > >>>> webpage that has some links to documentation in case you are > > interested in > > >>>> the TIU. > > >>>>> https://gunkies.org/wiki/Terminal_Interface_Unit > > >>>>> > > >>>>> BTW, the use of DSP on this web page does not mean Digital Signal > > >>>> Processing. It refers to the Dispatch/SPP modules. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> barbara > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> On Tuesday, February 3, 2026 at 12:23:55 PM PST, John Shoch via > > >>>> Internet-history wrote: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Towards the end of last year there was a thread here on the first > > >>>> Arpanet > > >>>>> link at SRI, and Barbara Denny was kind enough to share a note > > >>>> (11/3/25) > > >>>>> from Don Nielsen also reminding us of the earliest multi-network > > tests > > >>>> of > > >>>>> the TCP Internet at SRI: > > >>>>> // 3. First 2-net demo of TCP was on 27 Aug 1976.? PRNET and > ARPANET. > > >>>>> // 4. First 3-net demo of TCP was on 22 Nov 1977.? PRNET, SATNET, > and > > >>>>> ARPANET. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> As I recall, prior to that time all of the TCP design, > implementation > > >>>> and > > >>>>> testing had been done just on the Arpanet. Building on the early > > work > > >>>> at > > >>>>> Stanford, the effort grew to include people at SRI, BBN, and > > elsewhere. > > >>>>> Those demonstrations in 1976 and 1977 -- with a gateway and > multiple > > >>>>> networks -- were tremendously important milestones along the path > to > > >>>> what > > >>>>> became the Internet as we know it today. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> In response to that post, though, I was asked about the actual > state > > >>>> of the > > >>>>> Xerox PUP internetworking effort at that time, in mid-1976. It > took > > >>>> me a > > >>>>> while to do an archeological dig -- I wanted to find the original > > >>>> documents > > >>>>> to ensure that we got the history right. I found a couple of > > >>>> interesting > > >>>>> things and wrote up a summary. My friends at the Computer History > > >>>> Museum > > >>>>> have long encouraged us to document some of the work, and it was > > >>>> suggested > > >>>>> "you should share it before we lose this history." > > >>>>> > > >>>>> So, some of the notes, documents, and insights on internetworking > in > > >>>> 1976 > > >>>>> (as seen from a slightly different perspective): > > >>>>> > > >>>>> --In 1972, about 4 years earlier, the first INWG meeting had taken > > >>>> place at > > >>>>> the ICCC meeting in Washington DC. > > >>>>> --In the summer of 1973, about 3 years earlier, there were ongoing > > >>>> meetings > > >>>>> at Stanford, and Cerf and Kahn were drafting the TCP paper at the > > >>>> Cabana > > >>>>> hotel in Palo Alto. That same summer there were early discussions > at > > >>>> PARC > > >>>>> about the proposed Ethernet (as well as an alternative design > simply > > >>>> called > > >>>>> LOCAL network), and the need to interconnect them. A memo from > Aug. > > >>>> 1973 > > >>>>> reported a discussion on "...the problems of interfacing the LOCAL > > and > > >>>>> ETHER networks. This memo describes a rather general proposal for > > >>>>> introduction of a message format standard which emerged from the > > >>>>> discussion. The adoption of the standard would enable us to > > >>>> interconnect > > >>>>> different networks?essentially forming a network of networks?..? A > > >>>> drawing > > >>>>> includes ARPA, ETHER, and LOCAL networks. > > >>>>> --In the Spring of 1974 the Ethernet was maturing (while the > > >>>> alternative > > >>>>> LOCAL net never emerged), and there were some basic > Ethernet-specific > > >>>>> protocols implemented (EEFTP). Yet it was clear that there would > be > > a > > >>>> need > > >>>>> to interconnect Ethernet networks, both locally and across > > geographies. > > >>>>> Metcalfe had been participating in some of the INWG meetings, but > it > > >>>> was > > >>>>> also evident that we could not wait for that effort -- we needed > > >>>> something > > >>>>> immediately. > > >>>>> --That led to Bob's initial draft memo, "A Proposed PUP -- PARC > > >>>> Universal > > >>>>> Packet" dated March 19, 1974, which began: > > >>>>> "This memo is written and should be read with caution; its purpose > is > > >>>> to > > >>>>> promote a standard. Because there isn?t an ice cube's chance in > hell > > >>>> that > > >>>>> our (or anyone else's) standard will be adopted without > interminable > > >>>> debate > > >>>>> and revision, the memo itself is quick and dirty. This way we get > the > > >>>> ball > > >>>>> rolling early. ... A list of the packet networks at Parc would > > >>>> include, in > > >>>>> arbitrary order of pedigree, (1) Ethernets, (2) Localnets, (3) > > >>>> Arpanets, > > >>>>> (4) MCAnets, and (5) EIAnets.? > > >>>>> [MCANets connected Data General Novas. "EIAnets" evolved into a > > >>>> backbone > > >>>>> packet switching network among Gateways, made up of leased serial > > >>>> lines.] > > >>>>> . > > >>>>> --Over the next two years the further design, implementation, and > > >>>>> refinement of PUP were done primarily by David Boggs and Ed Taft. > > >>>> Progress > > >>>>> was reported in a series of memos, initially by Metcalfe and later > by > > >>>> Boggs > > >>>>> and Taft: > > >>>>> PUP Revisited > > >>>>> PUP Converging > > >>>>> Naming and Addressing Conventions for PUP > > >>>>> A Nova Gateway > > >>>>> Implementation of PUP in Tenex > > >>>>> PUP Again > > >>>>> PUP Connection State Diagram > > >>>>> PUP Servers on Maxc > > >>>>> etc., etc., etc. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> --So where did things stand, after two years of work, in mid-1976? > > The > > >>>>> best document I have found describing things ca. 1976 is from 6 > > months > > >>>>> earlier, a "draft" of "PUP Overview" by Taft dated Dec. 21, 1975. > He > > >>>>> reports: > > >>>>> "Local communication is carried on by means of several independent > > >>>> Ethernets > > >>>>> (passive broadcast networks operating at 3 mb/s) and two MCAs > > >>>>> (Multiprocessor > > >>>>> Communications Adaptors for interconnecting Nova computers, > operating > > >>>> at > > >>>>> 1.6 mb/s). > > >>>>> Long-haul communication is carried on over the Arpanet (a > > >>>> store-and-forward > > >>>>> packet > > >>>>> switched network?operating at 50 kb/s). We are considering making > use > > >>>> of > > >>>>> other > > >>>>> transport mechanisms, such as optical fibers for very high > bandwidth > > >>>> local > > >>>>> communication, leased phone lines for regional communication at > > modest > > >>>>> bandwidths, > > >>>>> and commercial?packet switching services such as Telenet." > > >>>>> The memo goes on at length to describe Basic Principles, Levels of > > >>>>> Protocol, Standard Packet Format, Inter-Network Addressing, > > >>>> Fragmentation, > > >>>>> etc. > > >>>>> I only have a draft of this memo; I have not yet found a copy of > the > > >>>>> complete final version. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>> > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/106a4W2mXsi4Ii-YzRgzsTAwe9_34IqJg/view?usp=sharing > > >>>>> --To further describe the operational state of the PUP Internet in > > the > > >>>>> Spring of 1976, though, I have also found a copy of the > then-current > > >>>> text > > >>>>> file used to define assigned network numbers, host numbers, > > well-known > > >>>>> sockets, and name-to-internet-address mapping. This file was used > to > > >>>>> initially configure the gateways, and to load the name server. The > > >>>> Tenex > > >>>>> header shows this as the 50th copy of the file that was created -- > > >>>>> PUP-NETWORK.TXT;50, dated March 19, 1976. > > >>>>> It shows that the PUP Internet at that time included 2 Ethernets, 2 > > >>>> MCAs, > > >>>>> and the Arpanet. > > >>>>> Well-known Sockets were defined for Telnet, Gateway-Info (routing > > >>>> updates), > > >>>>> FTP, Misc. Services (name, time, etc.), and Echo. > > >>>>> The name server database allowed a machine to have multiple names > > >>>> (e.g., > > >>>>> MAXC = Maxc1 = Parc-Maxc), and multiple internet addresses (if > > >>>> connected to > > >>>>> more than one network). > > >>>>> I count 27 Novas on the PUP Internet at the time. This includes 3 > > >>>> machines > > >>>>> acting as Gateways: > > >>>>> --The Portola Gateway, on both Ethernets, one MCA, and the > > Arpanet, > > >>>>> --The front end to the MAXC time sharing system, on one > Ethernet, > > >>>> both > > >>>>> MCAs, and the Arpanet. > > >>>>> --A Nova on one Ethernet and one MCA. > > >>>>> There were 7 Novas only on one Ethernet (including a machine for > font > > >>>>> design and two for laser printer units). > > >>>>> The remaining 17 Novas had both Ethernet and MCA interfaces (but > were > > >>>> not > > >>>>> necessarily running as Gateways). These included Novas configured > as > > >>>>> servers controlling the older XGP printer, the newer EARS laser > > >>>> printer, > > >>>>> the Woodstock File System (WFS), and others. > > >>>>> There were also 67 individual Altos on the Ethernets. Most of > these > > >>>> were > > >>>>> for personal use, but the list also included one Alto as a > dedicated > > >>>> Data > > >>>>> Line Scanner system (i.e., a TIP, for in-bound and out-bound > terminal > > >>>>> traffic). > > >>>>> [My hand-written notes suggest that there were at least 9 other > Altos > > >>>> in > > >>>>> our group which were not in the database (including mine). Even if > > no > > >>>> one > > >>>>> could find them via the name server, they could operate as client > > >>>> machines > > >>>>> on the PUP Internet.] > > >>>>> This system was in regular use, day and night, with over 100 > machines > > >>>> on 5 > > >>>>> networks of 3 types. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>> > > > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SZ6yRLp6UqpbFKxbKK4D2stB6BcBX5qq/view?usp=sharing > > >>>>> > > >>>>> That was the state of the first and largest operational Internet in > > >>>> March > > >>>>> 1976, 5 months before the important 2-net SRI demo of the TCP > > Internet. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> John > > >>>>> > > >>>>> PS: A few additional notes and quick lessons from that period. > > >>>>> 1. For some software-intensive projects a smaller team can be very > > >>>>> productive. There may have been ~6 of us helping and kibitizing, > but > > >>>> the > > >>>>> vast majority of the programming and documentation was done by Taft > > and > > >>>>> Boggs. > > >>>>> 2. As best we could, we did try to share some of our general > > progress > > >>>> with > > >>>>> others. > > >>>>> --I had been full-time at PARC since 1971, but had also been > > >>>> encouraged to > > >>>>> "try to get a quick PhD" at Stanford. I took part in Vint's > > networking > > >>>>> seminar. > > >>>>> --In the Spring of 1976 (before the 2-network demo at SRI), three > of > > us > > >>>>> from Parc were enrolled in a Systems Programming class being taught > > by > > >>>>> Vint. We had to do a group programming project, so the 3 of us > > >>>> undertook > > >>>>> implementation of the 2nd generation simple file transfer: > evolving > > >>>> from > > >>>>> the Ethernet-based EEFTP (written in Nova assembler) to a new > > >>>>> internet-capable Pup-based EFTP (written in BCPL). We turned in > the > > >>>>> listings, complete with some packet traces (from an Ethernet > watcher) > > >>>> to > > >>>>> show how it worked. We all got an A+ -- thank you, Vint! > > >>>>> --Later, Vint graciously arranged for us to attend some of the TCP > > >>>> working > > >>>>> group meetings. In July 1977 (before the 3-network demo) Yogen > Dalal > > >>>> (who > > >>>>> had been a graduate student under Vint) and I attended a TCP > Working > > >>>> Group > > >>>>> meeting held at MIT. Jon Postel's TCP Meeting Notes (later > > registered > > >>>> as > > >>>>> IEN 65) reflected some of our overview: "PARC has 5 different > > networks > > >>>>> with peices [sic] in Palo Alto, Los Angeles and various places on > the > > >>>> East > > >>>>> Coast. Approximately 14 different networks, approximately 300 > hosts > > >>>>> connected." > > >>>>> --In the following month, Aug. 1977, we attended an Internet > meeting > > >>>> at ISI > > >>>>> -- where we mentioned our gateway routing, gateway services, > > >>>>> naming/addressing/routing, etc. [IEN 3] [IEN 19] [IEN 20] > > >>>>> --Later, with the help of Don Nielsen and the crew at SRI, we > became > > >>>> users > > >>>>> of the PRNet -- adding it as a network in our internet, carrying > > >>>>> encapsulated Pups wirelessly between two Pup gateways. This was > > >>>> reported > > >>>>> in IEN 78, https://www.rfc-editor.org/ien/ien78.pdf > > >>>>> 3. At this time the TCP Internet was designed to expose a reliable > > >>>> byte > > >>>>> stream interface. > > >>>>> The PUP Internet architecture provided interfaces at multiple > levels: > > >>>>> --Reliable byte stream (BSP), used for Telnet, FTP, etc. > > >>>>> --Reliable packet stream (EFTP), used for simple file transfer, > esp. > > >>>> to a > > >>>>> print server. > > >>>>> --Raw packet access, for very simple tasks (name server, time > server, > > >>>> echo, > > >>>>> etc.) > > >>>>> Two years later, in 1978, the split of TCP into TCP and IP > eventually > > >>>>> allowed that kind of flexibility. > > >>>>> 4. Network-relative addresses were used in both the TCP Internet > and > > >>>> the > > >>>>> PUP Internet, with a network ID and a host ID. This worked OK in > the > > >>>> early > > >>>>> days of both TCP and PUP, but we quickly realized that a) this did > > not > > >>>> work > > >>>>> well if you wanted to move a machine from one network to another, > and > > >>>> b) > > >>>>> this would not scale adequately. We tried to learn from both the > > >>>>> Experimental Ethernet and the PUP Internet. Thus, Yogen Dalal > > >>>> developed > > >>>>> the 48-bit flat address space -- used in what became the 2nd > > >>>> generation DIX > > >>>>> Ethernet standard, and used in the 2nd-generation Xerox Network > > Systems > > >>>>> (XNS) protocols. The 48-bit Ethernet address design has scaled and > > >>>> endured > > >>>>> for ~50 years -- great work by Yogen. > > >>>>> https://dl.acm.org/doi/epdf/10.1145/800081.802680 > > >>>>> > > >>>> -- > > >>>> Internet-history mailing list > > >>>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > > >>>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > > >>>> - > > >>>> Unsubscribe: > > >>>> > > > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > > >>>> > > >>> > > >>> -- > > >>> Please send any postal/overnight deliveries to: > > >>> Vint Cerf > > >>> Google, LLC > > >>> 1900 Reston Metro Plaza, 16th Floor > > >>> Reston, VA 20190 > > >>> +1 (571) 213 1346 <(571)%20213-1346> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> until further notice > > > -- > Internet-history mailing list > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history > - > Unsubscribe: > https://app.smartsheet.com/b/form/9b6ef0621638436ab0a9b23cb0668b0b?The%20list%20to%20be%20unsubscribed%20from=Internet-history > From rsk at gsp.org Tue Feb 10 05:04:36 2026 From: rsk at gsp.org (Rich Kulawiec) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2026 08:04:36 -0500 Subject: [ih] Launch of The Internet Ecosystem Book In-Reply-To: <6329D8C1-B37C-4BD1-A096-D1067D4D4C1C@comcast.net> References: <2e7fdfff-5960-48a8-a652-13480b3b33fc@Spark> <939A7DB1-CF5F-4CFE-BD1C-A4B84DAF2C0F@schiefner.berlin> <66ae4613-e08b-40e6-a592-85c2b16f64db@gmail.com> <6329D8C1-B37C-4BD1-A096-D1067D4D4C1C@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20260210130436.GA28825@gsp.org> On Mon, Feb 09, 2026 at 03:48:29PM -0500, John Day via Internet-history wrote: > I expected AI to be the death of science, but not from this. > > The next question is, is it as bad in other fields: biology, chemistry, physics, etc. I assume it is. It is just as bad, e.g.: AI paper mills are swamping science with garbage studies - The Register https://www.theregister.com/2025/05/13/ai_junk_science_papers/ "Positive review only": Researchers hide AI prompts in papers - Nikkei Asia https://asia.nikkei.com/business/technology/artificial-intelligence/positive-review-only-researchers-hide-ai-prompts-in-papers Quality of scientific papers questioned as academics "overwhelmed" by the millions published | Peer review and scientific publishing | The Guardian https://www.theguardian.com/science/2025/jul/13/quality-of-scientific-papers-questioned-as-academics-overwhelmed-by-the-millions-published arXiv Changes Rules After Getting Spammed With AI-Generated "Research" Papers https://www.404media.co/arxiv-changes-rules-after-getting-spammed-with-ai-generated-research-papers/ AI conference's papers contaminated by AI hallucinations - The Register https://www.theregister.com/2026/01/22/neurips_papers_contaiminated_ai_hallucinations/ ---rsk From rsk at gsp.org Tue Feb 10 07:08:34 2026 From: rsk at gsp.org (Rich Kulawiec) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2026 10:08:34 -0500 Subject: [ih] Fwd: [vcf-midatlantic@lists.vcfed.org: [vcf-midatlantic] ENIAC 80 celebration live! this Sunday (Feb. 15)] Message-ID: <20260210150834.GA32631@gsp.org> ----- Forwarded message from Jeffrey Brace via vcf-midatlantic ----- > From: Jeffrey Brace via vcf-midatlantic > Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2026 09:15:50 -0500 > Cc: Jeffrey Brace > Subject: [vcf-midatlantic] ENIAC 80 celebration live! this Sunday (Feb. 15) > > I'm driving to this event. Is anyone else going? > > Info (Copied from the ENIACtion Newsletter): > > > *80th Anniversary Celebration of ENIACAmerican Helicopter Museum, West > Chester, PAFebruary 15th, 2026 (Sunday) * > Starting at museum open at 1PM (EST). > Video Presentation runs two hours from 2PM-4PM (EST) in the museum > Auditorium, > Afterwards is 1 hour duration meet and greet. > Museum closes at 5PM (EST). > This is also a virtual/online/hybrid event on the Zoom Platform. > Invitations via Helicopter Museum and Compuseum > > Sign Up Here: > https://www.helicoptermuseum.org/event-details/eniac-day-celebration > > $20 per person for Museum Entry. Zoom attendees no charge, Registration > Required. > > > > > > > > *Event Title: ENIAC Founders, Families and Futures - 80 Years > OnPresentation on Zoom and in AuditoriumKickoff By:* > Paul Kahan (CEO- Helicopter Museum) 2 minutes > > Jim Scherrer (CEO- Compuseum) 2 minutes > > > Keynote - Kathy Kleiman - "The Incredible People of the ENIAC Team: Why We > Still Celebrate Them 80 Years Later." A Deep Dive Into Proving Ground > People by Author- "Proving Grounds; The Untold Story of the Six Women Who > Programmed the World's First Modern Computer." Purchase Book here: > https://a.co/d/0eu2p78z (Confirmed - In person) > > Brian Stuart - "The ENIAC in Context" > A deep technical dive into how the master programmer makes the ENIAC > satisfy the criteria necessary for universality in the Turing sense and to > clarify the relationship between Turing's work and that of Mauchly and > Eckert. (Confirmed - In Person) > > Paul Ceruzzi - "Perspective on ENIAC, 80 years On" Author "A New History of > Modern Computing" book along with Tom Haigh. (Confirmed Virtual) > > Tom Burick - "How Today's High School Students built a full sized replica > of ENIAC, from scratch!" IT Instructor, PS Academy, Arizona. (Confirmed, > Virtual) > > Bill Mauchly - "Giant Brain Takes Over the World" the story we can never > let go of. Bill is from First Family of Computing - Son of John Mauchly > and Kathleen "Kay" McNulty Mauchly (Confirmed, In Person) > > Chris Eckert - "Recollections of My Dad" First Family of Computing - Son > of J. Presper Eckert (Confirmed, Virtual) > > Gini Mauchly - "What Kay McNulty would Tell you about How to Be > Successful." First Family of Computing - Daughter of John Mauchly and > Kathleen "Kay" McNulty Mauchly (Confirmed, In Person) > > Naomi Most - "Did my IT career result from my DNA" Granddaughter of Kay > McNulty (Confirmed, Virtual) > > Dr. Tim Bartik - "Recollections of My Mother". Son of Jean Jennings > Bartik, 1st ENIAC Programmer (Confirmed, Virtual) > > Jeffrey Yost - "The ENIAC's Unveiling: Shaping Metaphors and Meanings in > Computing" Director, Charles Babbage Institute for Computing, Information > & Culture (Confirmed, In Person) > > Paul Shaffer - "How the ENIAC made Quadrotor Drones Possible; From Vacuum > Tubes to Vertical Flight" ENIAC Historian at PENN- (Confirmed, In Person) > > Ken Chaney - "See PENN's Supercomputer" with Associate Director of AI and > Technology for PARCC at the Betty Holberton Data Center - Visitors will see > the Betty Holberton supercomputer at PENN (named after Betty Holberton, > ENIAC programmer) https://parcc.upenn.edu/systems/betty/ (Confirmed, On > Site) > > Show & Tell - "Audience Participation" Q&A session where audience members > can show off their ENIAC equipment or memorabilia using the screen share > option. If you have ENIAC equipment or memorabilia you'd like to "show > off", please let us know in advance. > > Wrap Up Thank you from - Jim Scherrer (Compuseum); Paul Kahan (Helicopter > Museum) > > > 1 hour cake party at museum (4-5PM) then after-party. > > *SPEAKERS BIOGRAPHICAL SKETCH* > > Kathy Kleiman, Senior Fellow, Programs on Tech, Law & Security and > Information Justice and Intellectual Property, American University > Washington College of Law, Author of "Proving Ground," and Founder of the > ENIAC Programmers Project. Twenty years of work at ICANN (Internet > Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers) to research the structure and > balance of private Internet governance systems, privacy & Internet > technologies. If you loved Hidden Figures or The Rise of the Rocket Girls, > you'll love Kleimans' breakthrough book on the women who brought you the > computer age--written out of history, until now. Purchase Book here: > https://a.co/d/0eu2p78z > > Brian Stuart, PhD is a professor of Computer Science at Drexel University. > He hold a BS from the Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology, an MS from the > University of Notre Dame, and a PhD from Purdue University. His primary > research for the past ten years has been uncovering the details of the > design, operation, and programming of the ENIAC. > > Bill Mauchly is the son of John W. Mauchly and Kathleen ???Kay??? McNulty, two > pioneers whose work on ENIAC, UNIVAC, and early programming helped define > the very foundations of modern computing. As part of the ???first family of > computers,??? Bill has carried forward that legacy through a career that > bridges advanced technology, digital creativity, and the preservation of > computing history. > > Tim Bartik, PhD is a senior economist at the Upjohn Institute for > Employment Research, a non-profit and non-partisan research organization in > Kalamazoo, Michigan. His research focuses on state and local economic > development policies and local labor markets. At the Upjohn Institute, Dr. > Bartik co-directs the Institute???s research initiative on place-based > policies. > > Tom Burick - Teacher at PS Academy in Gilbert, Arizona. PS Academy is a > private high school for students with autism and other exceptionalities. > which offers customized programs, clubs and electives, and ability-based > learning with a focus on social skills improvement. Thomas Burick is a > technology educator and lifelong builder who led a student team in > reconstructing ENIAC at full scale, using the world???s first electronic > computer as a hands-on lesson in precision, repetition, and large-scale > engineering. > > Paul Ceruzzi is Curator Emeritus at the Smithsonian Institution's National > Air and Space Museum. He has published extensively on topics in the history > of computing and aerospace. His most recent publications include "GPS: a > Concise History," "Computing: A Concise History"--both part of MIT Press's > Essential Knowledge Series, And, with Tom Haigh, "A New History of Modern > Computing." > > Jeffrey R. Yost is Director, Charles Babbage Institute and Research > Professor, History of Science, Technology, and Medicine, University of > Minnesota. He has published nine books. His four most recent books are Just > Code: Power, Inequality and the Political Economy of IT (co-edited with G. > Con Diaz, JHU Press); Making IT Work: A History of the Computer Services > Industry (MIT Press); Computer: A History of the Information Machine 4th > ed. (co-authored, Routledge); and FastLane: Managing Science in the > Internet World (co-authored with Tom Misa, JHU Press). He co-edits Studies > in Computing Culture book series for Johns Hopkins University (JHU) Press. > > Paul Shaffer is the ENIAC Historian at the University of Pennsylvania, > where he serves as a steward and interpreter of the world???s first > general-purpose electronic digital computer. He has spent more than three > decades championing the ENIAC artifact - researching its history, > preserving its story, and translating its technical significance. A > helicopter pilot, Paul brings an aviator???s perspective on systems, risk, > and disciplined procedure to his work in technology and public history. He > is also a commercial UAS (drone) instructor. Paul is known for making ENIAC > both legible and vivid: not only as a landmark machine, but as a human > achievement shaped by ingenuity, constraint, and collaboration. As ENIAC > approaches its 80th anniversary in 2026, he continues to help ensure the > machine???s technical and cultural impact remains accurately understood, > widely shared, and meaningfully remembered. > > *REFERENCES & SUGGESTED READING* > A New History of Modern Computing: Co-Author Dr. Thomas Haigh and Paul > Ceruzzi Purchase book here: https://a.co/d/0ighKnFX > Proving Grounds; Author: Kathy Kleiman - Purchase Book here: > https://a.co/d/01pSFoIG > Computer: A History of the Information Machine. Link to Amazon: > https://z.umn.edu/Computer_A_History > How Students Built a Replica of ENIAC. PC Magazine 2026 > https://www.pcmag.com/news/how-80-autistic-students-built-an-amazing-recreation-of-the-ginormous-eniac?test_uuid=04IpBmWGZleS0I0J3epvMrC&test_variant=A > > If you have a new LOGO, and want it on the web site and to be a supporter, > send it now. Please make your Sponsor Donations on the "Donate Now" button > on the web site. > > If you come in person you can meet people, watch 3D animation of the ENIAC, > meet book authors, purchase special books, see special exhibits and eat > ENIAC CAKE! > > Special Note: This event is Coincident with Americas Semiquincentennial! > (250th) Watch Here: > https://www.britannica.com/video/how-to-pronounce-semiquincentennial-and-what-it-means/-326853 ----- End forwarded message ----- From vgcerf at gmail.com Tue Feb 10 16:50:29 2026 From: vgcerf at gmail.com (vinton cerf) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2026 19:50:29 -0500 Subject: [ih] more memoriam of Dave Farber from ISOC Message-ID: https://www.internethalloffame.org/2026/02/10/in-memory-of-david-j-farber-internet-pioneer-mentor-and-internet-society-leader/ v