From woody at pch.net  Sun Oct  3 17:43:41 2021
From: woody at pch.net (Bill Woodcock)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 02:43:41 +0200
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
Message-ID: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>

Perhaps of interest?  Eric and Kirk have been very active members of the Berkeley Hillside Club, our neighborhood social club, for the past two decades.  Eric will shortly (this evening) be giving a public talk on the history of email.

                                -Bill


October Fireside Meeting ? Monday, October 4th, 2021
7:30 pm on Zoom


October Fireside Meeting
Monday, October 4th, 2021

 <https://hillsideclub.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=42d3e713c28ba5d4d8c2226fd&id=d02885f080&e=78bfa10bd7>
In Conversation with Eric Allman:  The Evolution of Sendmail and the Internet

Most Hillside Club members are aware than our new Club President is a wine aficionado, having seen him and his husband Kirk McKusick lead wine tastings, and coordinate the wine pouring at our Club dinners. But you may not realize that he is also an esteemed member of the Internet Hall of Fame, nor know how much you are indebted to Eric if you have ever used email. This conversation will discuss the origins of sendmail, the attitudes of the time, and how the Internet grew and changed over the years.

Join us on Monday, October 4th as 1st Vice President Arlene Baxter engages Eric Allman in conversation about those early, heady days as electronic communication began to be an essential part of all of our lives.

A bit of background:  On January 1, 1983, the Internet was born from the ashes of the ARPAnet, and sendmail was already there. Written by Eric Allman as a stopgap measure in the early 1980s, it grew with the Internet, at one point delivering around 90% of all the email on the network.
The early developers of the Internet believed that "universal communication" would promote democracy and bring people closer together. Things didn't work out that way. Many folks, including Eric, gave away their work for free. That changed too.
Come learn more about the evolution of these tools we now take for granted on Monday, October 4th at 7:30 pm as part of our Hillside Club Fireside Series on Zoom, free and open to the public.


Register here: bit.ly/HSC-Firesides2021 <http://bit.ly/HSC-Firesides2021>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: signature.asc
Type: application/pgp-signature
Size: 833 bytes
Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP
URL: <http://elists.isoc.org/pipermail/internet-history/attachments/20211004/ba526788/attachment.asc>

From el at lisse.na  Sun Oct  3 22:34:29 2021
From: el at lisse.na (Dr Eberhard W Lisse)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 07:34:29 +0200
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
Message-ID: <e42468e0-d4ae-47c5-b69c-a9ee4e5247f1@Spark>

Biil,

as keen as I am to listen to this (having managed to configure sendmail in 9 lines of M4 in my younger days:?https://linuxgazette.net/issue34/lisse.html) the time is 04:30 am my time.

Will this be recorded and put up somewhere?

greetings, el

?
Sent from Dr Lisse?s iPhone
On 4. Oct 2021, 02:43 +0200, Bill Woodcock via Internet-history <internet-history at elists.isoc.org>, wrote:
> Perhaps of interest? Eric and Kirk have been very active members of the Berkeley Hillside Club, our neighborhood social club, for the past two decades. Eric will shortly (this evening) be giving a public talk on the history of email.
>
> -Bill
>
>
> October Fireside Meeting ? Monday, October 4th, 2021
> 7:30 pm on Zoom
>
>
> October Fireside Meeting
> Monday, October 4th, 2021
>
> <https://hillsideclub.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=42d3e713c28ba5d4d8c2226fd&id=d02885f080&e=78bfa10bd7>
> In Conversation with Eric Allman: The Evolution of Sendmail and the Internet
>
> Most Hillside Club members are aware than our new Club President is a wine aficionado, having seen him and his husband Kirk McKusick lead wine tastings, and coordinate the wine pouring at our Club dinners. But you may not realize that he is also an esteemed member of the Internet Hall of Fame, nor know how much you are indebted to Eric if you have ever used email. This conversation will discuss the origins of sendmail, the attitudes of the time, and how the Internet grew and changed over the years.
>
> Join us on Monday, October 4th as 1st Vice President Arlene Baxter engages Eric Allman in conversation about those early, heady days as electronic communication began to be an essential part of all of our lives.
>
> A bit of background: On January 1, 1983, the Internet was born from the ashes of the ARPAnet, and sendmail was already there. Written by Eric Allman as a stopgap measure in the early 1980s, it grew with the Internet, at one point delivering around 90% of all the email on the network.
> The early developers of the Internet believed that "universal communication" would promote democracy and bring people closer together. Things didn't work out that way. Many folks, including Eric, gave away their work for free. That changed too.
> Come learn more about the evolution of these tools we now take for granted on Monday, October 4th at 7:30 pm as part of our Hillside Club Fireside Series on Zoom, free and open to the public.
>
>
> Register here: bit.ly/HSC-Firesides2021 <http://bit.ly/HSC-Firesides2021>
>
> --
> Internet-history mailing list
> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history


From joly at punkcast.com  Sun Oct  3 22:55:31 2021
From: joly at punkcast.com (Joly MacFie)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 01:55:31 -0400
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <e42468e0-d4ae-47c5-b69c-a9ee4e5247f1@Spark>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <e42468e0-d4ae-47c5-b69c-a9ee4e5247f1@Spark>
Message-ID: <CAM9VJk14F6iCKv3pYgo35CfuyLDGLB6g6MWhDhc4rDbM=gRdHA@mail.gmail.com>

I could simulcast this over ISOC channels if there's no objection.

joly



On Mon, Oct 4, 2021 at 1:34 AM Dr Eberhard W Lisse via Internet-history <
internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:

> Biil,
>
> as keen as I am to listen to this (having managed to configure sendmail in
> 9 lines of M4 in my younger days:
> https://linuxgazette.net/issue34/lisse.html) the time is 04:30 am my time.
>
> Will this be recorded and put up somewhere?
>
> greetings, el
>
> ?
> Sent from Dr Lisse?s iPhone
> On 4. Oct 2021, 02:43 +0200, Bill Woodcock via Internet-history <
> internet-history at elists.isoc.org>, wrote:
> > Perhaps of interest? Eric and Kirk have been very active members of the
> Berkeley Hillside Club, our neighborhood social club, for the past two
> decades. Eric will shortly (this evening) be giving a public talk on the
> history of email.
> >
> > -Bill
> >
> >
> > October Fireside Meeting ? Monday, October 4th, 2021
> > 7:30 pm on Zoom
> >
> >
> > October Fireside Meeting
> > Monday, October 4th, 2021
> >
> > <
> https://hillsideclub.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=42d3e713c28ba5d4d8c2226fd&id=d02885f080&e=78bfa10bd7
> >
> > In Conversation with Eric Allman: The Evolution of Sendmail and the
> Internet
> >
> > Most Hillside Club members are aware than our new Club President is a
> wine aficionado, having seen him and his husband Kirk McKusick lead wine
> tastings, and coordinate the wine pouring at our Club dinners. But you may
> not realize that he is also an esteemed member of the Internet Hall of
> Fame, nor know how much you are indebted to Eric if you have ever used
> email. This conversation will discuss the origins of sendmail, the
> attitudes of the time, and how the Internet grew and changed over the years.
> >
> > Join us on Monday, October 4th as 1st Vice President Arlene Baxter
> engages Eric Allman in conversation about those early, heady days as
> electronic communication began to be an essential part of all of our lives.
> >
> > A bit of background: On January 1, 1983, the Internet was born from the
> ashes of the ARPAnet, and sendmail was already there. Written by Eric
> Allman as a stopgap measure in the early 1980s, it grew with the Internet,
> at one point delivering around 90% of all the email on the network.
> > The early developers of the Internet believed that "universal
> communication" would promote democracy and bring people closer together.
> Things didn't work out that way. Many folks, including Eric, gave away
> their work for free. That changed too.
> > Come learn more about the evolution of these tools we now take for
> granted on Monday, October 4th at 7:30 pm as part of our Hillside Club
> Fireside Series on Zoom, free and open to the public.
> >
> >
> > Register here: bit.ly/HSC-Firesides2021 <http://bit.ly/HSC-Firesides2021
> >
> >
> > --
> > Internet-history mailing list
> > Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> > https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
> --
> Internet-history mailing list
> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
>


-- 
--------------------------------------
Joly MacFie  +12185659365
--------------------------------------
-


From woody at pch.net  Sun Oct  3 22:56:58 2021
From: woody at pch.net (Bill Woodcock)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 07:56:58 +0200
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <e42468e0-d4ae-47c5-b69c-a9ee4e5247f1@Spark>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <e42468e0-d4ae-47c5-b69c-a9ee4e5247f1@Spark>
Message-ID: <136FB1E3-E888-47F0-BCD3-788AD7E63AD3@pch.net>



> On Oct 4, 2021, at 7:34 AM, Dr Eberhard W Lisse via Internet-history <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
> 
> Biil,
> 
> as keen as I am to listen to this (having managed to configure sendmail in 9 lines of M4 in my younger days: https://linuxgazette.net/issue34/lisse.html) the time is 04:30 am my time.
> 
> Will this be recorded and put up somewhere?


It looks like it will probably be available in the ?Past Events? section of this page:

    https://bhcweb.wixsite.com/hillsideclub/firesidemeeting

Previous talks have a ?click here to watch the presentation? link that takes you to the youtube page for each talk.

                                -Bill

-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: signature.asc
Type: application/pgp-signature
Size: 833 bytes
Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP
URL: <http://elists.isoc.org/pipermail/internet-history/attachments/20211004/b56b84ce/attachment.asc>

From woody at pch.net  Sun Oct  3 23:00:15 2021
From: woody at pch.net (Bill Woodcock)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 08:00:15 +0200
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <CAM9VJk14F6iCKv3pYgo35CfuyLDGLB6g6MWhDhc4rDbM=gRdHA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <e42468e0-d4ae-47c5-b69c-a9ee4e5247f1@Spark>
 <CAM9VJk14F6iCKv3pYgo35CfuyLDGLB6g6MWhDhc4rDbM=gRdHA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3D6DEAC1-6AE1-454D-8F89-8BB54705F6C3@pch.net>



> On Oct 4, 2021, at 7:55 AM, Joly MacFie via Internet-history <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
> I could simulcast this over ISOC channels if there's no objection.

That?s not how copyright works.

But that fundamental misunderstanding appears to be endemic at ISOC, not to put too fine a point on it.

                                -Bill

-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: signature.asc
Type: application/pgp-signature
Size: 833 bytes
Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP
URL: <http://elists.isoc.org/pipermail/internet-history/attachments/20211004/6e37e81c/attachment.asc>

From el at lisse.NA  Sun Oct  3 23:55:23 2021
From: el at lisse.NA (Dr Eberhard W Lisse)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 08:55:23 +0200
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <136FB1E3-E888-47F0-BCD3-788AD7E63AD3@pch.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <e42468e0-d4ae-47c5-b69c-a9ee4e5247f1@Spark>
 <136FB1E3-E888-47F0-BCD3-788AD7E63AD3@pch.net>
Message-ID: <19ebd360-ec2d-c9a8-e56b-5fa82f23c41e@lisse.NA>

Thank you, I shall look for it :-)-O

el

On 04/10/2021 07:56, Bill Woodcock wrote:
> 
> 
>> On Oct 4, 2021, at 7:34 AM, Dr Eberhard W Lisse via Internet-history
>> <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>>
>> Bill,
>>
>> as keen as I am to listen to this (having managed to configure
>> sendmail in 9 lines of M4 in my younger days:
>> https://linuxgazette.net/issue34/lisse.html) the time is 04:30 am my
>> time.
>>
>> Will this be recorded and put up somewhere?
> 
> 
> It looks like it will probably be available in the ?Past Events?
> section of this page:
> 
>      https://bhcweb.wixsite.com/hillsideclub/firesidemeeting
> 
> Previous talks have a ?click here to watch the presentation? link that
> takes you to the youtube page for each talk.
> 
>                                  -Bill
> 
-- 
Dr. Eberhard W. Lisse   \         /       Obstetrician & Gynaecologist
el at lisse.NA             / *      |  Telephone: +264 81 124 6733 (cell)
PO Box 8421 Bachbrecht  \      /  If this email is signed with GPG/PGP
10007, Namibia           ;____/ Sect 20 of Act No. 4 of 2019 may apply
	  Book your Covid-10 Vaccination at https://c19.idtoday.com.na


From el at lisse.NA  Sun Oct  3 23:56:30 2021
From: el at lisse.NA (Dr Eberhard W Lisse)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 08:56:30 +0200
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <3D6DEAC1-6AE1-454D-8F89-8BB54705F6C3@pch.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <e42468e0-d4ae-47c5-b69c-a9ee4e5247f1@Spark>
 <CAM9VJk14F6iCKv3pYgo35CfuyLDGLB6g6MWhDhc4rDbM=gRdHA@mail.gmail.com>
 <3D6DEAC1-6AE1-454D-8F89-8BB54705F6C3@pch.net>
Message-ID: <cece42bd-1128-fa64-03a6-5e5abbc4700b@lisse.NA>

Simulcast implies live streaming, ie same time, which, as I wrote does
not do it for me :-)-O

On 04/10/2021 08:00, Bill Woodcock wrote:
> 
> 
>> On Oct 4, 2021, at 7:55 AM, Joly MacFie via Internet-history <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>> I could simulcast this over ISOC channels if there's no objection.
> 
> That?s not how copyright works.
> 
> But that fundamental misunderstanding appears to be endemic at ISOC,
> not to put too fine a point on it.
> 
>                                  -Bill
> 
-- 
Dr. Eberhard W. Lisse   \         /       Obstetrician & Gynaecologist
el at lisse.NA             / *      |  Telephone: +264 81 124 6733 (cell)
PO Box 8421 Bachbrecht  \      /  If this email is signed with GPG/PGP
10007, Namibia           ;____/ Sect 20 of Act No. 4 of 2019 may apply
	  Book your Covid-10 Vaccination at https://c19.idtoday.com.na


From joly at punkcast.com  Mon Oct  4 00:20:48 2021
From: joly at punkcast.com (Joly MacFie)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 03:20:48 -0400
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <cece42bd-1128-fa64-03a6-5e5abbc4700b@lisse.NA>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <e42468e0-d4ae-47c5-b69c-a9ee4e5247f1@Spark>
 <CAM9VJk14F6iCKv3pYgo35CfuyLDGLB6g6MWhDhc4rDbM=gRdHA@mail.gmail.com>
 <3D6DEAC1-6AE1-454D-8F89-8BB54705F6C3@pch.net>
 <cece42bd-1128-fa64-03a6-5e5abbc4700b@lisse.NA>
Message-ID: <CAM9VJk1OEseeg-jnKjFPJYPuQgQWJq64KLeEkxTNEJ92L0fFmg@mail.gmail.com>

Ah yes, but all ISOC streams are archived and also, many are transcribed.

joly.



On Mon, Oct 4, 2021 at 2:56 AM Dr Eberhard W Lisse <el at lisse.na> wrote:

> Simulcast implies live streaming, ie same time, which, as I wrote does
> not do it for me :-)-O
>
> On 04/10/2021 08:00, Bill Woodcock wrote:
> >
> >
> >> On Oct 4, 2021, at 7:55 AM, Joly MacFie via Internet-history <
> internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
> >> I could simulcast this over ISOC channels if there's no objection.
> >
> > That?s not how copyright works.
> >
> > But that fundamental misunderstanding appears to be endemic at ISOC,
> > not to put too fine a point on it.
> >
> >                                  -Bill
> >
> --
> Dr. Eberhard W. Lisse   \         /       Obstetrician & Gynaecologist
> el at lisse.NA             / *      |  Telephone: +264 81 124 6733 (cell)
> PO Box 8421 Bachbrecht  \      /  If this email is signed with GPG/PGP
> 10007, Namibia           ;____/ Sect 20 of Act No. 4 of 2019 may apply
>           Book your Covid-10 Vaccination at https://c19.idtoday.com.na
>


-- 
--------------------------------------
Joly MacFie  +12185659365
--------------------------------------
-


From el at lisse.NA  Mon Oct  4 01:21:05 2021
From: el at lisse.NA (Dr Eberhard W Lisse)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 10:21:05 +0200
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <CAM9VJk1OEseeg-jnKjFPJYPuQgQWJq64KLeEkxTNEJ92L0fFmg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <e42468e0-d4ae-47c5-b69c-a9ee4e5247f1@Spark>
 <CAM9VJk14F6iCKv3pYgo35CfuyLDGLB6g6MWhDhc4rDbM=gRdHA@mail.gmail.com>
 <3D6DEAC1-6AE1-454D-8F89-8BB54705F6C3@pch.net>
 <cece42bd-1128-fa64-03a6-5e5abbc4700b@lisse.NA>
 <CAM9VJk1OEseeg-jnKjFPJYPuQgQWJq64KLeEkxTNEJ92L0fFmg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9d87dbcf-7aa9-f212-61eb-8ed555d498bb@lisse.NA>

Thank you.

Good to know :-)-O

el

On 04/10/2021 09:20, Joly MacFie wrote:
> Ah yes, but all ISOC streams are archived and also, many are
> transcribed.
> 
> joly.
[...]
-- 
Dr. Eberhard W. Lisse   \         /       Obstetrician & Gynaecologist
el at lisse.NA             / *      |  Telephone: +264 81 124 6733 (cell)
PO Box 8421 Bachbrecht  \      /  If this email is signed with GPG/PGP
10007, Namibia           ;____/ Sect 20 of Act No. 4 of 2019 may apply
	  Book your Covid-10 Vaccination at https://c19.idtoday.com.na


From don at donhopkins.com  Mon Oct  4 06:50:41 2021
From: don at donhopkins.com (Don Hopkins)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 15:50:41 +0200
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
Message-ID: <A4F345F0-9148-4ABE-AB1E-C1724241F21D@donhopkins.com>

I wish I could make it! 

An insightful quote from Eric?s home page:

"I was happily semi-retired for a while, but then (to my surprise) decided I wanted more social contact. After spending a career wishing that people would just go away and leave you alone so you could get some work done, it's quite a shock when they actually do it, and not nearly as pleasant as you might think.? -Eric Allman

http://www.neophilic.com/~eric/

And of course his classic quote outing sendmail:

"There is some sort of perverse pleasure in knowing that it's basically impossible to send a piece of hate mail through the Internet without its being touched by a gay program. That's kind of funny.? -Eric Allman, The Advocate, 3 March 1998, p. 41.

-Don

> On Oct 4, 2021, at 02:43, Bill Woodcock via Internet-history <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
> 
> Perhaps of interest?  Eric and Kirk have been very active members of the Berkeley Hillside Club, our neighborhood social club, for the past two decades.  Eric will shortly (this evening) be giving a public talk on the history of email.
> 
>                                -Bill
> 
> 
> October Fireside Meeting ? Monday, October 4th, 2021
> 7:30 pm on Zoom
> 
> 
> October Fireside Meeting
> Monday, October 4th, 2021
> 
> <https://hillsideclub.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=42d3e713c28ba5d4d8c2226fd&id=d02885f080&e=78bfa10bd7>
> In Conversation with Eric Allman:  The Evolution of Sendmail and the Internet
> 
> Most Hillside Club members are aware than our new Club President is a wine aficionado, having seen him and his husband Kirk McKusick lead wine tastings, and coordinate the wine pouring at our Club dinners. But you may not realize that he is also an esteemed member of the Internet Hall of Fame, nor know how much you are indebted to Eric if you have ever used email. This conversation will discuss the origins of sendmail, the attitudes of the time, and how the Internet grew and changed over the years.
> 
> Join us on Monday, October 4th as 1st Vice President Arlene Baxter engages Eric Allman in conversation about those early, heady days as electronic communication began to be an essential part of all of our lives.
> 
> A bit of background:  On January 1, 1983, the Internet was born from the ashes of the ARPAnet, and sendmail was already there. Written by Eric Allman as a stopgap measure in the early 1980s, it grew with the Internet, at one point delivering around 90% of all the email on the network.
> The early developers of the Internet believed that "universal communication" would promote democracy and bring people closer together. Things didn't work out that way. Many folks, including Eric, gave away their work for free. That changed too.
> Come learn more about the evolution of these tools we now take for granted on Monday, October 4th at 7:30 pm as part of our Hillside Club Fireside Series on Zoom, free and open to the public.
> 
> 
> Register here: bit.ly/HSC-Firesides2021 <http://bit.ly/HSC-Firesides2021>
> -- 
> Internet-history mailing list
> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history



From mfidelman at meetinghouse.net  Mon Oct  4 06:56:50 2021
From: mfidelman at meetinghouse.net (Miles Fidelman)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 09:56:50 -0400
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
Message-ID: <9f941cfb-f38c-c9b0-4cf9-a5dfa4c2d6c1@meetinghouse.net>

Bill Woodcock via Internet-history wrote:
> A bit of background:  On January 1, 1983, the Internet was born from the ashes of the ARPAnet,
Ashes?

More like built on the foundation of the ARPANET.? Or grew around the 
scaffolding of the ARPANET?

In 1983, the ARPANET was very much, the backbone of the Internet. Jan 1, 
1983 - the TCP/IP "Flag Day," marks the day that TCP/IP became the 
required standard for ... wait for it ... the ARPANET.

The supercomputer networks, and NSFnet were yet to come.

And then, the ARPANET didn't so much burn, as fade away - to be turned 
off in 1990.? The guy in the office next to mine, at BBN, was actually 
the project engineer for the final decommissioning.

(Doesn't anybody know any, ... "Internet History" here?)

Miles Fidelman




-- 
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

Theory is when you know everything but nothing works.
Practice is when everything works but no one knows why.
In our lab, theory and practice are combined:
nothing works and no one knows why.  ... unknown



From jeanjour at comcast.net  Mon Oct  4 07:10:27 2021
From: jeanjour at comcast.net (John Day)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 10:10:27 -0400
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <9f941cfb-f38c-c9b0-4cf9-a5dfa4c2d6c1@meetinghouse.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <9f941cfb-f38c-c9b0-4cf9-a5dfa4c2d6c1@meetinghouse.net>
Message-ID: <43ED6474-683B-4A7D-817E-CB5DEB87628B@comcast.net>

I was wondering when someone was going to speak up.  This history of email seems to start pretty late in the game.

> On Oct 4, 2021, at 09:56, Miles Fidelman via Internet-history <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
> 
> Bill Woodcock via Internet-history wrote:
>> A bit of background:  On January 1, 1983, the Internet was born from the ashes of the ARPAnet,
> Ashes?
> 
> More like built on the foundation of the ARPANET.  Or grew around the scaffolding of the ARPANET?
> 
> In 1983, the ARPANET was very much, the backbone of the Internet. Jan 1, 1983 - the TCP/IP "Flag Day," marks the day that TCP/IP became the required standard for ... wait for it ... the ARPANET.
> 
> The supercomputer networks, and NSFnet were yet to come.
> 
> And then, the ARPANET didn't so much burn, as fade away - to be turned off in 1990.  The guy in the office next to mine, at BBN, was actually the project engineer for the final decommissioning.
> 
> (Doesn't anybody know any, ... "Internet History" here?)
> 
> Miles Fidelman
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
> In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra
> 
> Theory is when you know everything but nothing works.
> Practice is when everything works but no one knows why.
> In our lab, theory and practice are combined:
> nothing works and no one knows why.  ... unknown
> 
> -- 
> Internet-history mailing list
> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history



From dhc at dcrocker.net  Mon Oct  4 08:52:15 2021
From: dhc at dcrocker.net (Dave Crocker)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 08:52:15 -0700
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <43ED6474-683B-4A7D-817E-CB5DEB87628B@comcast.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <9f941cfb-f38c-c9b0-4cf9-a5dfa4c2d6c1@meetinghouse.net>
 <43ED6474-683B-4A7D-817E-CB5DEB87628B@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <ae2dc81d-57c3-7377-9039-0e23bbe0a7fc@dcrocker.net>

On 10/4/2021 7:10 AM, John Day via Internet-history wrote:
> I was wondering when someone was going to speak up.  This history of email seems to start pretty late in the game.

Oh?

http://emailhistory.org/Email-Timeline.html

      Single-machine email, roughly 1965.

      Multi-machine email, end of 1971

      Single-command reply functionality, 1975.

That doesn't count as pretty /early/?

d/

-- 
Dave Crocker
Brandenburg InternetWorking
bbiw.net


From dhc at dcrocker.net  Mon Oct  4 10:26:20 2021
From: dhc at dcrocker.net (Dave Crocker)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 10:26:20 -0700
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <ae2dc81d-57c3-7377-9039-0e23bbe0a7fc@dcrocker.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <9f941cfb-f38c-c9b0-4cf9-a5dfa4c2d6c1@meetinghouse.net>
 <43ED6474-683B-4A7D-817E-CB5DEB87628B@comcast.net>
 <ae2dc81d-57c3-7377-9039-0e23bbe0a7fc@dcrocker.net>
Message-ID: <e6362f29-00b9-e1ca-4b06-7fd39a16a850@dcrocker.net>

On 10/4/2021 8:52 AM, Dave Crocker via Internet-history wrote:
> On 10/4/2021 7:10 AM, John Day via Internet-history wrote:
>> I was wondering when someone was going to speak up.? This history of 
>> email seems to start pretty late in the game. 

sigh. after further consideration, I gather the 'this' meant Eric's 
publicized statement, which seems to start with 1983, although it notes 
'sendmail was already there'.  So, yeah, by 1983 email was by some 
measures already pretty mature.

On a separate vein, fwiw, characterizing sendmail as "a stopgap measure" 
seems odd.  It's predecessor, delivermail, well might qualify, but it 
always seemed to me that sendmail was an attempt to do a serious and 
designed tool.

d/

-- 
Dave Crocker
Brandenburg InternetWorking
bbiw.net


From jeanjour at comcast.net  Mon Oct  4 10:32:44 2021
From: jeanjour at comcast.net (John Day)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 13:32:44 -0400
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <ae2dc81d-57c3-7377-9039-0e23bbe0a7fc@dcrocker.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <9f941cfb-f38c-c9b0-4cf9-a5dfa4c2d6c1@meetinghouse.net>
 <43ED6474-683B-4A7D-817E-CB5DEB87628B@comcast.net>
 <ae2dc81d-57c3-7377-9039-0e23bbe0a7fc@dcrocker.net>
Message-ID: <230FE3FC-C4DF-4A5D-98D5-2274618BE848@comcast.net>

Yea, that was what I was referring to.  After 1980 is pretty late.

> On Oct 4, 2021, at 11:52, Dave Crocker <dhc at dcrocker.net> wrote:
> 
> On 10/4/2021 7:10 AM, John Day via Internet-history wrote:
>> I was wondering when someone was going to speak up.  This history of email seems to start pretty late in the game.
> 
> Oh?
> 
> http://emailhistory.org/Email-Timeline.html
> 
>     Single-machine email, roughly 1965.
> 
>     Multi-machine email, end of 1971
> 
>     Single-command reply functionality, 1975.
> 
> That doesn't count as pretty /early/?
> 
> d/
> 
> -- 
> Dave Crocker
> Brandenburg InternetWorking
> bbiw.net



From mfidelman at meetinghouse.net  Mon Oct  4 13:12:17 2021
From: mfidelman at meetinghouse.net (Miles Fidelman)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 16:12:17 -0400
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <e6362f29-00b9-e1ca-4b06-7fd39a16a850@dcrocker.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <9f941cfb-f38c-c9b0-4cf9-a5dfa4c2d6c1@meetinghouse.net>
 <43ED6474-683B-4A7D-817E-CB5DEB87628B@comcast.net>
 <ae2dc81d-57c3-7377-9039-0e23bbe0a7fc@dcrocker.net>
 <e6362f29-00b9-e1ca-4b06-7fd39a16a850@dcrocker.net>
Message-ID: <a44d75e4-f14b-e56c-8d82-2fab597e3ea4@meetinghouse.net>

Dave Crocker via Internet-history wrote:
> On 10/4/2021 8:52 AM, Dave Crocker via Internet-history wrote:
>> On 10/4/2021 7:10 AM, John Day via Internet-history wrote:
>>> I was wondering when someone was going to speak up.? This history of 
>>> email seems to start pretty late in the game. 
>
> sigh. after further consideration, I gather the 'this' meant Eric's 
> publicized statement, which seems to start with 1983, although it 
> notes 'sendmail was already there'.? So, yeah, by 1983 email was by 
> some measures already pretty mature.
>
> On a separate vein, fwiw, characterizing sendmail as "a stopgap 
> measure" seems odd.? It's predecessor, delivermail, well might 
> qualify, but it always seemed to me that sendmail was an attempt to do 
> a serious and designed tool.
>
One wonders if Eric will mention MMDF. :-)

Miles

-- 
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

Theory is when you know everything but nothing works.
Practice is when everything works but no one knows why.
In our lab, theory and practice are combined:
nothing works and no one knows why.  ... unknown



From geoff at iconia.com  Mon Oct  4 13:36:25 2021
From: geoff at iconia.com (the keyboard of geoff goodfellow)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 10:36:25 -1000
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <ae2dc81d-57c3-7377-9039-0e23bbe0a7fc@dcrocker.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <9f941cfb-f38c-c9b0-4cf9-a5dfa4c2d6c1@meetinghouse.net>
 <43ED6474-683B-4A7D-817E-CB5DEB87628B@comcast.net>
 <ae2dc81d-57c3-7377-9039-0e23bbe0a7fc@dcrocker.net>
Message-ID: <CAEf-zrgNhWk1JvO9VNrVMnYrJwsbdLqPhpbDEBad0quJuSVURA@mail.gmail.com>

an "ancient" sendmail related quote from yours truly's archives:

"Sendmail is a nifty mailer whose flexibility ... is nothing short of
amazing.  How did Eric Allman embed this flexibility?  He used a
variation on Post Productions as address rewriting rules.  If he
hadn't taken a theory course, none of us would have sendmail today."

-- Mark Horton, in net.college, supporting the teaching of
        theory courses.

On Mon, Oct 4, 2021 at 6:11 AM Dave Crocker via Internet-history <
internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:

> On 10/4/2021 7:10 AM, John Day via Internet-history wrote:
> > I was wondering when someone was going to speak up.  This history of
> email seems to start pretty late in the game.
>
> Oh?
>
> http://emailhistory.org/Email-Timeline.html
>
>       Single-machine email, roughly 1965.
>
>       Multi-machine email, end of 1971
>
>       Single-command reply functionality, 1975.
>
> That doesn't count as pretty /early/?
>
> d/
>
> --
> Dave Crocker
> Brandenburg InternetWorking
> bbiw.net
> --
> Internet-history mailing list
> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
>
>

-- 
Geoff.Goodfellow at iconia.com
living as The Truth is True


From dhc at dcrocker.net  Mon Oct  4 13:53:58 2021
From: dhc at dcrocker.net (Dave Crocker)
Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2021 13:53:58 -0700
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <a44d75e4-f14b-e56c-8d82-2fab597e3ea4@meetinghouse.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <9f941cfb-f38c-c9b0-4cf9-a5dfa4c2d6c1@meetinghouse.net>
 <43ED6474-683B-4A7D-817E-CB5DEB87628B@comcast.net>
 <ae2dc81d-57c3-7377-9039-0e23bbe0a7fc@dcrocker.net>
 <e6362f29-00b9-e1ca-4b06-7fd39a16a850@dcrocker.net>
 <a44d75e4-f14b-e56c-8d82-2fab597e3ea4@meetinghouse.net>
Message-ID: <153e5021-c884-ba50-82ad-2a7aca0f9bf1@dcrocker.net>

On 10/4/2021 1:12 PM, Miles Fidelman via Internet-history wrote:
>>
> One wonders if Eric will mention MMDF. :-)

Given that the description is fulling about sendmail history, I doubt 
it. (I know you meant humor, but still...)

Whatever year he created the external configuration capability for 
sendmail (1980?) I was similarly motivated to consider this for MMDF. 
One concerns was whether reading an external file would happen quickly 
enough and another was what the config file should look like.

Eric showed me his newly-minted capability and it clearly loaded quickly 
enough.  And then there was the config language he had defined.  I had 
two strong reactions.  One was that it was really quite impressive.  The 
other was that it was really quite complex.

It decided things for my own system:  I'd leave the complexity to 
programmers, inside the MMDF code, and keep the config file in a more 
mundane and simple keyword/attribute value style.

d/

-- 
Dave Crocker
Brandenburg InternetWorking
bbiw.net


From karl at cavebear.com  Tue Oct  5 01:16:17 2021
From: karl at cavebear.com (Karl Auerbach)
Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2021 01:16:17 -0700
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
Message-ID: <ca949285-1881-fca5-c5ec-27ccc0f7cf7b@cavebear.com>

A long time ago, 1980/1981, before sendmail, I was at Interactive 
Systems in Santa Monica.

Brian X (forgot his last name) and I came up with a system we called 
"queued ftp" - it was a store-and-forward system for file images, with 
delivery to a program.?? It kinda resembled what would be a system of 
sendmail relays.

(I can't remember whether we were influenced by IBM's SNADS or whether 
that came later.)

We used our QFTP system as the engine underneath the email system we 
built, as well as for things like remote printing.

I gave a paper on this stuff at either USENIX or Unix Users Group at the 
old Jack Tarr hotel in San Francisco around 1980/81.? Eric A. chaired 
the session.

I'm not saying that the work that Brian X and I did at Interactive had 
any influence on sendmail, but I like to think we did.

By-the-way, we built this on PDP/11 Unix systems using Z80 based Unibus 
cards ("UMC cards) from ACC in Santa Barbara.

 ??? --karl--





From brian.e.carpenter at gmail.com  Tue Oct  5 02:07:19 2021
From: brian.e.carpenter at gmail.com (Brian Carpenter)
Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2021 22:07:19 +1300
Subject: [ih] Eric Allman giving a public talk on the history of email
In-Reply-To: <ca949285-1881-fca5-c5ec-27ccc0f7cf7b@cavebear.com>
References: <0635B515-9AC0-49BF-BBCD-319C755EF040@pch.net>
 <ca949285-1881-fca5-c5ec-27ccc0f7cf7b@cavebear.com>
Message-ID: <CANMZLAZHbePa+1-jy2RqiAfzVBGEesBe7qqh+VYiAdDat4wz9w@mail.gmail.com>

More likely influenced by IBM RSCS at that date, perhaps? iirc, RSCS was
the basis of BITNET email.

Regards,
    Brian Carpenter
    (via tiny screen & keyboard)

On Tue, 5 Oct 2021, 21:16 Karl Auerbach via Internet-history, <
internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:

> A long time ago, 1980/1981, before sendmail, I was at Interactive
> Systems in Santa Monica.
>
> Brian X (forgot his last name) and I came up with a system we called
> "queued ftp" - it was a store-and-forward system for file images, with
> delivery to a program.   It kinda resembled what would be a system of
> sendmail relays.
>
> (I can't remember whether we were influenced by IBM's SNADS or whether
> that came later.)
>
> We used our QFTP system as the engine underneath the email system we
> built, as well as for things like remote printing.
>
> I gave a paper on this stuff at either USENIX or Unix Users Group at the
> old Jack Tarr hotel in San Francisco around 1980/81.  Eric A. chaired
> the session.
>
> I'm not saying that the work that Brian X and I did at Interactive had
> any influence on sendmail, but I like to think we did.
>
> By-the-way, we built this on PDP/11 Unix systems using Z80 based Unibus
> cards ("UMC cards) from ACC in Santa Barbara.
>
>      --karl--
>
>
>
> --
> Internet-history mailing list
> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
>


From jack at 3kitty.org  Sat Oct 23 15:27:23 2021
From: jack at 3kitty.org (Jack Haverty)
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 2021 15:27:23 -0700
Subject: [ih] ARPANET history
Message-ID: <66310838-ef0f-2fb9-15e0-db502643847b@3kitty.org>

FYI, I stumbled across a government report written in 1990 but that I 
hadn't seen before now.?? It contains a summary of the creation and 
evolution of the ARPANET and the beginnings of the Internet. Where it 
talks about things that I personally experienced, it agrees with my 
recollections.?? So I tend to trust the other things it says that are 
new to me even today.? I thought that internet-historians might be 
interested too.

The report is non-technical, but highlights some of the reasons for the 
success of the project, leading to the Internet we have today, such as 
the way in which people moved around between organizations, political 
and managerial decisions within parts of the government, activities for 
moving the technology from research to operations, and other such 
non-technical drivers of the success of the Internet.

See https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA239925.pdf??? -- Chapter XX (page 243)

/Jack Haverty




From olejacobsen at me.com  Sat Oct 23 17:06:30 2021
From: olejacobsen at me.com (Ole Jacobsen)
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 2021 17:06:30 -0700
Subject: [ih] ARPANET history
In-Reply-To: <66310838-ef0f-2fb9-15e0-db502643847b@3kitty.org>
References: <66310838-ef0f-2fb9-15e0-db502643847b@3kitty.org>
Message-ID: <7CD0B16A-10A8-4C04-B107-EB23509DFA15@me.com>


Hi Jack,

We found another report an posted it on the "Downloads" section for IPJ:

https://ipj.dreamhosters.com/internet-protocol-journal/downloads/ <https://ipj.dreamhosters.com/internet-protocol-journal/downloads/>

"A History of the ARPANET"


Cheers,

Ole

> On Oct 23, 2021, at 15:27, Jack Haverty via Internet-history <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
> 
> FYI, I stumbled across a government report written in 1990 but that I hadn't seen before now.   It contains a summary of the creation and evolution of the ARPANET and the beginnings of the Internet. Where it talks about things that I personally experienced, it agrees with my recollections.   So I tend to trust the other things it says that are new to me even today.  I thought that internet-historians might be interested too.
> 
> The report is non-technical, but highlights some of the reasons for the success of the project, leading to the Internet we have today, such as the way in which people moved around between organizations, political and managerial decisions within parts of the government, activities for moving the technology from research to operations, and other such non-technical drivers of the success of the Internet.
> 
> See https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA239925.pdf    -- Chapter XX (page 243)
> 
> /Jack Haverty
> 
> 
> -- 
> Internet-history mailing list
> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history

Ole J. Jacobsen
Editor and Publisher
The Internet Protocol Journal
Office: +1 415-550-9433
Cell:   +1 415-370-4628
Web: protocoljournal.org
E-mail: olejacobsen at me.com
E-mail: ole at protocoljournal.org
Skype: organdemo





From dan at lynch.com  Sun Oct 24 11:59:22 2021
From: dan at lynch.com (Dan Lynch)
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 2021 11:59:22 -0700
Subject: [ih] ARPANET history
In-Reply-To: <7CD0B16A-10A8-4C04-B107-EB23509DFA15@me.com>
References: <7CD0B16A-10A8-4C04-B107-EB23509DFA15@me.com>
Message-ID: <AC9B13D9-F332-4048-B846-0A3AA66493A1@lynch.com>

Wow!  How come it took 40 years to uncover these two brilliant histories of the past?  And they are well done and reviewed by the folks who did the work. Excellent history. 

Dan

Cell 650-776-7313

> On Oct 23, 2021, at 5:06 PM, Ole Jacobsen via Internet-history <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
> 
> ?
> Hi Jack,
> 
> We found another report an posted it on the "Downloads" section for IPJ:
> 
> https://ipj.dreamhosters.com/internet-protocol-journal/downloads/ <https://ipj.dreamhosters.com/internet-protocol-journal/downloads/>
> 
> "A History of the ARPANET"
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Ole
> 
>> On Oct 23, 2021, at 15:27, Jack Haverty via Internet-history <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>> 
>> FYI, I stumbled across a government report written in 1990 but that I hadn't seen before now.   It contains a summary of the creation and evolution of the ARPANET and the beginnings of the Internet. Where it talks about things that I personally experienced, it agrees with my recollections.   So I tend to trust the other things it says that are new to me even today.  I thought that internet-historians might be interested too.
>> 
>> The report is non-technical, but highlights some of the reasons for the success of the project, leading to the Internet we have today, such as the way in which people moved around between organizations, political and managerial decisions within parts of the government, activities for moving the technology from research to operations, and other such non-technical drivers of the success of the Internet.
>> 
>> See https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA239925.pdf    -- Chapter XX (page 243)
>> 
>> /Jack Haverty
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Internet-history mailing list
>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
> 
> Ole J. Jacobsen
> Editor and Publisher
> The Internet Protocol Journal
> Office: +1 415-550-9433
> Cell:   +1 415-370-4628
> Web: protocoljournal.org
> E-mail: olejacobsen at me.com
> E-mail: ole at protocoljournal.org
> Skype: organdemo
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Internet-history mailing list
> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history



From mfidelman at meetinghouse.net  Sun Oct 24 14:41:29 2021
From: mfidelman at meetinghouse.net (Miles Fidelman)
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 2021 17:41:29 -0400
Subject: [ih] ARPANET history - any memories of CSnet & NEARnet
In-Reply-To: <66310838-ef0f-2fb9-15e0-db502643847b@3kitty.org>
References: <66310838-ef0f-2fb9-15e0-db502643847b@3kitty.org>
Message-ID: <7c11fcfb-3301-817a-9566-ed78af2d1bcb@meetinghouse.net>

Thanks Jack!

These are GREAT resources.? And particularly relevant to my current 
efforts to launch "civic.net" - essentially an "internet of community 
networks."? Kind of a followup to my earlier work at the Center for 
Civic Networking, trying to apply Internet style governance models to 
reinvigorating local town meetings (with some modest success).

This time around, I'm trying to apply some lessons learned by us, and 
others, in the design & application of FreeNets and other kinds of 
"community networks" - to provide focal points and tools for the growing 
number of projects that are trying to organize community-scale responses 
to climate change.

Right now, I'm in early program development mode, and I've been looking 
at the Internet, email, the web, FOSS, and the post Earth Day 
environmental movement as startup models - and the history of how the 
ARPANET grew from a germ of an idea, in a few people's heads, into 
global infrastructure has stuck with me.? These documents filled in a 
few holes in my knowledge of the formative days.

It's occurred to me that both CSnet & NEARnet are even clearer models of 
a pressing need, and a few people getting together to make things 
happen.? (I still think the 3-page NEARnet memorandum-of-agreement is a 
masterpiece.)

Given that some of the key players are on this list, I wonder if anybody 
might be willing to share - on-list or privately - their recollections 
of the earliest days - how the ideas of CSnet & NEARnet first arose, and 
how they evolved from the germ of an idea to running systems (who 
said/did what, to whom, when, where, how, why, etc.).? And if anybody 
here can suggest who might provide similar input re. USENET and BITNET - 
that would be an embarrassment of riches.

Thanks very much,

Miles Fidelman


Jack Haverty via Internet-history wrote:
> FYI, I stumbled across a government report written in 1990 but that I 
> hadn't seen before now.?? It contains a summary of the creation and 
> evolution of the ARPANET and the beginnings of the Internet. Where it 
> talks about things that I personally experienced, it agrees with my 
> recollections.?? So I tend to trust the other things it says that are 
> new to me even today.? I thought that internet-historians might be 
> interested too.
>
> The report is non-technical, but highlights some of the reasons for 
> the success of the project, leading to the Internet we have today, 
> such as the way in which people moved around between organizations, 
> political and managerial decisions within parts of the government, 
> activities for moving the technology from research to operations, and 
> other such non-technical drivers of the success of the Internet.
>
> See https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA239925.pdf??? -- Chapter XX 
> (page 243)
>
> /Jack Haverty
>
>


-- 
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

Theory is when you know everything but nothing works.
Practice is when everything works but no one knows why.
In our lab, theory and practice are combined:
nothing works and no one knows why.  ... unknown



From bpurvy at gmail.com  Sun Oct 24 16:07:24 2021
From: bpurvy at gmail.com (Bob Purvy)
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 2021 16:07:24 -0700
Subject: [ih] ARPANET history - any memories of CSnet & NEARnet
In-Reply-To: <7c11fcfb-3301-817a-9566-ed78af2d1bcb@meetinghouse.net>
References: <66310838-ef0f-2fb9-15e0-db502643847b@3kitty.org>
 <7c11fcfb-3301-817a-9566-ed78af2d1bcb@meetinghouse.net>
Message-ID: <CAFq6nVGsnYPOSxRwUaden+h6eqwHBLM3VMZDBE0p-W6XzoHysw@mail.gmail.com>

I put some stuff about CSNET in my next book. Probably nothing you can't
find on the web.

(Since this is a historical novel, I'm not obligated to be complete; just
accurate.)

On Sun, Oct 24, 2021 at 2:41 PM Miles Fidelman via Internet-history <
internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:

> Thanks Jack!
>
> These are GREAT resources.  And particularly relevant to my current
> efforts to launch "civic.net" - essentially an "internet of community
> networks."  Kind of a followup to my earlier work at the Center for
> Civic Networking, trying to apply Internet style governance models to
> reinvigorating local town meetings (with some modest success).
>
> This time around, I'm trying to apply some lessons learned by us, and
> others, in the design & application of FreeNets and other kinds of
> "community networks" - to provide focal points and tools for the growing
> number of projects that are trying to organize community-scale responses
> to climate change.
>
> Right now, I'm in early program development mode, and I've been looking
> at the Internet, email, the web, FOSS, and the post Earth Day
> environmental movement as startup models - and the history of how the
> ARPANET grew from a germ of an idea, in a few people's heads, into
> global infrastructure has stuck with me.  These documents filled in a
> few holes in my knowledge of the formative days.
>
> It's occurred to me that both CSnet & NEARnet are even clearer models of
> a pressing need, and a few people getting together to make things
> happen.  (I still think the 3-page NEARnet memorandum-of-agreement is a
> masterpiece.)
>
> Given that some of the key players are on this list, I wonder if anybody
> might be willing to share - on-list or privately - their recollections
> of the earliest days - how the ideas of CSnet & NEARnet first arose, and
> how they evolved from the germ of an idea to running systems (who
> said/did what, to whom, when, where, how, why, etc.).  And if anybody
> here can suggest who might provide similar input re. USENET and BITNET -
> that would be an embarrassment of riches.
>
> Thanks very much,
>
> Miles Fidelman
>
>
> Jack Haverty via Internet-history wrote:
> > FYI, I stumbled across a government report written in 1990 but that I
> > hadn't seen before now.   It contains a summary of the creation and
> > evolution of the ARPANET and the beginnings of the Internet. Where it
> > talks about things that I personally experienced, it agrees with my
> > recollections.   So I tend to trust the other things it says that are
> > new to me even today.  I thought that internet-historians might be
> > interested too.
> >
> > The report is non-technical, but highlights some of the reasons for
> > the success of the project, leading to the Internet we have today,
> > such as the way in which people moved around between organizations,
> > political and managerial decisions within parts of the government,
> > activities for moving the technology from research to operations, and
> > other such non-technical drivers of the success of the Internet.
> >
> > See https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA239925.pdf    -- Chapter XX
> > (page 243)
> >
> > /Jack Haverty
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
> In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra
>
> Theory is when you know everything but nothing works.
> Practice is when everything works but no one knows why.
> In our lab, theory and practice are combined:
> nothing works and no one knows why.  ... unknown
>
> --
> Internet-history mailing list
> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
>


From joly at punkcast.com  Mon Oct 25 11:38:13 2021
From: joly at punkcast.com (Joly MacFie)
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 2021 14:38:13 -0400
Subject: [ih] ARPANET history - any memories of CSnet & NEARnet
In-Reply-To: <7c11fcfb-3301-817a-9566-ed78af2d1bcb@meetinghouse.net>
References: <66310838-ef0f-2fb9-15e0-db502643847b@3kitty.org>
 <7c11fcfb-3301-817a-9566-ed78af2d1bcb@meetinghouse.net>
Message-ID: <CAM9VJk1t=Vz5aRFY=btoQwe8kZmXTsmGxV9wupO_BmdBQdv8aQ@mail.gmail.com>

IHOF might have some crumbs

https://www.internethalloffame.org/inductees/tags/csnet



On Sun, Oct 24, 2021 at 5:41 PM Miles Fidelman via Internet-history <
internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:

> Thanks Jack!
>
> These are GREAT resources.  And particularly relevant to my current
> efforts to launch "civic.net" - essentially an "internet of community
> networks."  Kind of a followup to my earlier work at the Center for
> Civic Networking, trying to apply Internet style governance models to
> reinvigorating local town meetings (with some modest success).
>
> This time around, I'm trying to apply some lessons learned by us, and
> others, in the design & application of FreeNets and other kinds of
> "community networks" - to provide focal points and tools for the growing
> number of projects that are trying to organize community-scale responses
> to climate change.
>
> Right now, I'm in early program development mode, and I've been looking
> at the Internet, email, the web, FOSS, and the post Earth Day
> environmental movement as startup models - and the history of how the
> ARPANET grew from a germ of an idea, in a few people's heads, into
> global infrastructure has stuck with me.  These documents filled in a
> few holes in my knowledge of the formative days.
>
> It's occurred to me that both CSnet & NEARnet are even clearer models of
> a pressing need, and a few people getting together to make things
> happen.  (I still think the 3-page NEARnet memorandum-of-agreement is a
> masterpiece.)
>
> Given that some of the key players are on this list, I wonder if anybody
> might be willing to share - on-list or privately - their recollections
> of the earliest days - how the ideas of CSnet & NEARnet first arose, and
> how they evolved from the germ of an idea to running systems (who
> said/did what, to whom, when, where, how, why, etc.).  And if anybody
> here can suggest who might provide similar input re. USENET and BITNET -
> that would be an embarrassment of riches.
>
> Thanks very much,
>
> Miles Fidelman
>
>
> Jack Haverty via Internet-history wrote:
> > FYI, I stumbled across a government report written in 1990 but that I
> > hadn't seen before now.   It contains a summary of the creation and
> > evolution of the ARPANET and the beginnings of the Internet. Where it
> > talks about things that I personally experienced, it agrees with my
> > recollections.   So I tend to trust the other things it says that are
> > new to me even today.  I thought that internet-historians might be
> > interested too.
> >
> > The report is non-technical, but highlights some of the reasons for
> > the success of the project, leading to the Internet we have today,
> > such as the way in which people moved around between organizations,
> > political and managerial decisions within parts of the government,
> > activities for moving the technology from research to operations, and
> > other such non-technical drivers of the success of the Internet.
> >
> > See https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA239925.pdf    -- Chapter XX
> > (page 243)
> >
> > /Jack Haverty
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
> In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra
>
> Theory is when you know everything but nothing works.
> Practice is when everything works but no one knows why.
> In our lab, theory and practice are combined:
> nothing works and no one knows why.  ... unknown
>
> --
> Internet-history mailing list
> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
>


-- 
--------------------------------------
Joly MacFie  +12185659365
--------------------------------------
-


From joly at punkcast.com  Mon Oct 25 11:41:24 2021
From: joly at punkcast.com (Joly MacFie)
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 2021 14:41:24 -0400
Subject: [ih] ARPANET history - any memories of CSnet & NEARnet
In-Reply-To: <CAM9VJk1t=Vz5aRFY=btoQwe8kZmXTsmGxV9wupO_BmdBQdv8aQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <66310838-ef0f-2fb9-15e0-db502643847b@3kitty.org>
 <7c11fcfb-3301-817a-9566-ed78af2d1bcb@meetinghouse.net>
 <CAM9VJk1t=Vz5aRFY=btoQwe8kZmXTsmGxV9wupO_BmdBQdv8aQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAM9VJk0iwpkch6u9JFXHciVRf3Az4mYqRYWxqXUyzx7oE5twnQ@mail.gmail.com>

Also, I seem to recall Dave Farber talked about CSNET at ISOC-NY in 2017.

https://isoc-ny.org/p2/9734

On Mon, Oct 25, 2021 at 2:38 PM Joly MacFie <joly at punkcast.com> wrote:

> IHOF might have some crumbs
>
> https://www.internethalloffame.org/inductees/tags/csnet
>
>
>
> On Sun, Oct 24, 2021 at 5:41 PM Miles Fidelman via Internet-history <
> internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>
>> Thanks Jack!
>>
>> These are GREAT resources.  And particularly relevant to my current
>> efforts to launch "civic.net" - essentially an "internet of community
>> networks."  Kind of a followup to my earlier work at the Center for
>> Civic Networking, trying to apply Internet style governance models to
>> reinvigorating local town meetings (with some modest success).
>>
>> This time around, I'm trying to apply some lessons learned by us, and
>> others, in the design & application of FreeNets and other kinds of
>> "community networks" - to provide focal points and tools for the growing
>> number of projects that are trying to organize community-scale responses
>> to climate change.
>>
>> Right now, I'm in early program development mode, and I've been looking
>> at the Internet, email, the web, FOSS, and the post Earth Day
>> environmental movement as startup models - and the history of how the
>> ARPANET grew from a germ of an idea, in a few people's heads, into
>> global infrastructure has stuck with me.  These documents filled in a
>> few holes in my knowledge of the formative days.
>>
>> It's occurred to me that both CSnet & NEARnet are even clearer models of
>> a pressing need, and a few people getting together to make things
>> happen.  (I still think the 3-page NEARnet memorandum-of-agreement is a
>> masterpiece.)
>>
>> Given that some of the key players are on this list, I wonder if anybody
>> might be willing to share - on-list or privately - their recollections
>> of the earliest days - how the ideas of CSnet & NEARnet first arose, and
>> how they evolved from the germ of an idea to running systems (who
>> said/did what, to whom, when, where, how, why, etc.).  And if anybody
>> here can suggest who might provide similar input re. USENET and BITNET -
>> that would be an embarrassment of riches.
>>
>> Thanks very much,
>>
>> Miles Fidelman
>>
>>
>> Jack Haverty via Internet-history wrote:
>> > FYI, I stumbled across a government report written in 1990 but that I
>> > hadn't seen before now.   It contains a summary of the creation and
>> > evolution of the ARPANET and the beginnings of the Internet. Where it
>> > talks about things that I personally experienced, it agrees with my
>> > recollections.   So I tend to trust the other things it says that are
>> > new to me even today.  I thought that internet-historians might be
>> > interested too.
>> >
>> > The report is non-technical, but highlights some of the reasons for
>> > the success of the project, leading to the Internet we have today,
>> > such as the way in which people moved around between organizations,
>> > political and managerial decisions within parts of the government,
>> > activities for moving the technology from research to operations, and
>> > other such non-technical drivers of the success of the Internet.
>> >
>> > See https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA239925.pdf    -- Chapter XX
>> > (page 243)
>> >
>> > /Jack Haverty
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>> In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
>> In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra
>>
>> Theory is when you know everything but nothing works.
>> Practice is when everything works but no one knows why.
>> In our lab, theory and practice are combined:
>> nothing works and no one knows why.  ... unknown
>>
>> --
>> Internet-history mailing list
>> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
>> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
>>
>
>
> --
> --------------------------------------
> Joly MacFie  +12185659365
> --------------------------------------
> -
>


-- 
--------------------------------------
Joly MacFie  +12185659365
--------------------------------------
-


From mfidelman at meetinghouse.net  Mon Oct 25 12:12:53 2021
From: mfidelman at meetinghouse.net (Miles Fidelman)
Date: Mon, 25 Oct 2021 15:12:53 -0400
Subject: [ih] ARPANET history - any memories of CSnet & NEARnet
In-Reply-To: <CAM9VJk1t=Vz5aRFY=btoQwe8kZmXTsmGxV9wupO_BmdBQdv8aQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <66310838-ef0f-2fb9-15e0-db502643847b@3kitty.org>
 <7c11fcfb-3301-817a-9566-ed78af2d1bcb@meetinghouse.net>
 <CAM9VJk1t=Vz5aRFY=btoQwe8kZmXTsmGxV9wupO_BmdBQdv8aQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2f428511-6afa-681f-5bb4-e12243cd9047@meetinghouse.net>

Thanks Joly, and others.? I have the info I need.

FYI - I had meant to send this to a different list (where a parallel 
discussion is happening).? I know most of the folks personally, and was 
looking for specific people who were in the room.? Found them.

Thanks.

Miles Fidelman




Joly MacFie wrote:
> IHOF might have some crumbs
>
> https://www.internethalloffame.org/inductees/tags/csnet
>
>
>
> On Sun, Oct 24, 2021 at 5:41 PM Miles Fidelman via Internet-history 
> <internet-history at elists.isoc.org 
> <mailto:internet-history at elists.isoc.org>> wrote:
>
>     Thanks Jack!
>
>     These are GREAT resources.? And particularly relevant to my current
>     efforts to launch "civic.net <http://civic.net>" - essentially an
>     "internet of community
>     networks."? Kind of a followup to my earlier work at the Center for
>     Civic Networking, trying to apply Internet style governance models to
>     reinvigorating local town meetings (with some modest success).
>
>     This time around, I'm trying to apply some lessons learned by us, and
>     others, in the design & application of FreeNets and other kinds of
>     "community networks" - to provide focal points and tools for the
>     growing
>     number of projects that are trying to organize community-scale
>     responses
>     to climate change.
>
>     Right now, I'm in early program development mode, and I've been
>     looking
>     at the Internet, email, the web, FOSS, and the post Earth Day
>     environmental movement as startup models - and the history of how the
>     ARPANET grew from a germ of an idea, in a few people's heads, into
>     global infrastructure has stuck with me.? These documents filled in a
>     few holes in my knowledge of the formative days.
>
>     It's occurred to me that both CSnet & NEARnet are even clearer
>     models of
>     a pressing need, and a few people getting together to make things
>     happen.? (I still think the 3-page NEARnet memorandum-of-agreement
>     is a
>     masterpiece.)
>
>     Given that some of the key players are on this list, I wonder if
>     anybody
>     might be willing to share - on-list or privately - their
>     recollections
>     of the earliest days - how the ideas of CSnet & NEARnet first
>     arose, and
>     how they evolved from the germ of an idea to running systems (who
>     said/did what, to whom, when, where, how, why, etc.).? And if anybody
>     here can suggest who might provide similar input re. USENET and
>     BITNET -
>     that would be an embarrassment of riches.
>
>     Thanks very much,
>
>     Miles Fidelman
>
>
>     Jack Haverty via Internet-history wrote:
>     > FYI, I stumbled across a government report written in 1990 but
>     that I
>     > hadn't seen before now.?? It contains a summary of the creation and
>     > evolution of the ARPANET and the beginnings of the Internet.
>     Where it
>     > talks about things that I personally experienced, it agrees with my
>     > recollections.?? So I tend to trust the other things it says
>     that are
>     > new to me even today.? I thought that internet-historians might be
>     > interested too.
>     >
>     > The report is non-technical, but highlights some of the reasons for
>     > the success of the project, leading to the Internet we have today,
>     > such as the way in which people moved around between organizations,
>     > political and managerial decisions within parts of the government,
>     > activities for moving the technology from research to
>     operations, and
>     > other such non-technical drivers of the success of the Internet.
>     >
>     > See https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA239925.pdf -- Chapter XX
>     > (page 243)
>     >
>     > /Jack Haverty
>     >
>     >
>
>
>     -- 
>     In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
>     In practice, there is.? .... Yogi Berra
>
>     Theory is when you know everything but nothing works.
>     Practice is when everything works but no one knows why.
>     In our lab, theory and practice are combined:
>     nothing works and no one knows why.? ... unknown
>
>     -- 
>     Internet-history mailing list
>     Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
>     <mailto:Internet-history at elists.isoc.org>
>     https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
>
>
>
> -- 
> --------------------------------------
> Joly MacFie? +12185659365
> --------------------------------------
> -


-- 
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

Theory is when you know everything but nothing works.
Practice is when everything works but no one knows why.
In our lab, theory and practice are combined:
nothing works and no one knows why.  ... unknown



From Dennis.Jennings at Knous.ie  Fri Oct 29 07:42:25 2021
From: Dennis.Jennings at Knous.ie (Dennis Jennings)
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2021 15:42:25 +0100
Subject: [ih] Request for Assistance
In-Reply-To: <45e551c7-6fb4-9248-d46a-46adab4d417d@Knous.ie>
References: <45e551c7-6fb4-9248-d46a-46adab4d417d@Knous.ie>
Message-ID: <a273d6da-7806-9b7f-0b80-2e6c25668145@Knous.ie>

Hi,

For many of us around the world the "Landweber" meetings held between 
1982 and 1989 were an important source of information and personal 
contacts about academic networks and an important encouragement to get 
together in our own countries and to try to develop our own national or 
regional networks, and to connect to the Internet.

Larry is now looking to write some of the history around these meetings 
- formally the International Academic Networkshops (IANWs) - and is 
looking for your help.

Please see Larry's message below.

Many thanks
Dennis

******

Dear Colleagues


THIS IS A REQUEST FOR YOUR HELP


I am working on an Internet history that will include a discussion of 
the roles of the International Academic NetWorkshops (1982-1989), the 
INET conferences (1991?) and the Developing CountriesWorkshops (1992?) 
in fostering the spread and growth of the global Internet during the 
1980s and 1990s.


This request pertains to the IANWs. I am trying to contact attendees of 
these Workshops to get their inputs.The attached attendee spreadsheet 
has mostly not been updated since the 1980s and most email addresses 
likely timed out decades ago. I also do not have a list of attendees for 
1982 and 1983.


1. If you attended an IANW please send me (larry.landweber at gmail.com) 
your current contact info and the workshops you attended. If you have 
photos from the meetings or other photos of attendees from the 1980s, 
please send.Please also send any anecdotes, thoughts or comments 
regarding the workshops that you would like to share.

2. Please forward this note to colleagues who attended but may not have 
received it.

3. I have a fairly complete collection of submitted documents from 
1985-89 but do not have those from 1982, 1983, 1984.If you still have 
them, please scan and send.

4. Last, please send me information on attendees who have passed away or 
who otherwise are not able to respond.


Thanks for your help.

Larry Landweber, Larry.landweber at gmail.com


PS An example of an anecdote:

Jennings, Fuchs and Landweber attended the 1984 IANW. Fuchs and 
Landweber knew that CSNET was looking for an Executive Director and that 
NSF was looking for a Networking Program Director. Fuchs knew Jennings 
from EARN but Landweber met him for the first time. After, observing him 
and several discussions, they decided to recommend him for both jobs and 
made calls to those leading the searches. Jennings accepted the NSF 
position, and the rest is history!

//

-- 
?

Dr. Dennis Jennings,

	

Internet Pioneer, Internet Hall of Fame, 2014

/?I told you this Internet thing would catch on!?/

	

Company Director / Mentor & Coach / Angel Investor


	

Dennis.Jennings at knous.ie <mailto:Dennis.Jennings at ICANN.org>

	

Mobile: +353 87 220 8225

Knous ? Knowledge & Common Sense

	

//

/Please note that NO permission is granted to share these contact 
details with any social media platform.///

//

//


From brian.e.carpenter at gmail.com  Fri Oct 29 13:43:14 2021
From: brian.e.carpenter at gmail.com (Brian E Carpenter)
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 2021 09:43:14 +1300
Subject: [ih] Request for Assistance
In-Reply-To: <a273d6da-7806-9b7f-0b80-2e6c25668145@Knous.ie>
References: <45e551c7-6fb4-9248-d46a-46adab4d417d@Knous.ie>
 <a273d6da-7806-9b7f-0b80-2e6c25668145@Knous.ie>
Message-ID: <4ef62a37-8954-85da-0f76-41877d296ce5@gmail.com>

The attachment was of course discarded by list policy.

Regards
    Brian Carpenter
    Thinking of the IETF standards process: https://xkcd.com/2530/

On 30-Oct-21 03:42, Dennis Jennings via Internet-history wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> For many of us around the world the "Landweber" meetings held between
> 1982 and 1989 were an important source of information and personal
> contacts about academic networks and an important encouragement to get
> together in our own countries and to try to develop our own national or
> regional networks, and to connect to the Internet.
> 
> Larry is now looking to write some of the history around these meetings
> - formally the International Academic Networkshops (IANWs) - and is
> looking for your help.
> 
> Please see Larry's message below.
> 
> Many thanks
> Dennis
> 
> ******
> 
> Dear Colleagues
> 
> 
> THIS IS A REQUEST FOR YOUR HELP
> 
> 
> I am working on an Internet history that will include a discussion of
> the roles of the International Academic NetWorkshops (1982-1989), the
> INET conferences (1991?) and the Developing CountriesWorkshops (1992?)
> in fostering the spread and growth of the global Internet during the
> 1980s and 1990s.
> 
> 
> This request pertains to the IANWs. I am trying to contact attendees of
> these Workshops to get their inputs.The attached attendee spreadsheet
> has mostly not been updated since the 1980s and most email addresses
> likely timed out decades ago. I also do not have a list of attendees for
> 1982 and 1983.
> 
> 
> 1. If you attended an IANW please send me (larry.landweber at gmail.com)
> your current contact info and the workshops you attended. If you have
> photos from the meetings or other photos of attendees from the 1980s,
> please send.Please also send any anecdotes, thoughts or comments
> regarding the workshops that you would like to share.
> 
> 2. Please forward this note to colleagues who attended but may not have
> received it.
> 
> 3. I have a fairly complete collection of submitted documents from
> 1985-89 but do not have those from 1982, 1983, 1984.If you still have
> them, please scan and send.
> 
> 4. Last, please send me information on attendees who have passed away or
> who otherwise are not able to respond.
> 
> 
> Thanks for your help.
> 
> Larry Landweber, Larry.landweber at gmail.com
> 
> 
> PS An example of an anecdote:
> 
> Jennings, Fuchs and Landweber attended the 1984 IANW. Fuchs and
> Landweber knew that CSNET was looking for an Executive Director and that
> NSF was looking for a Networking Program Director. Fuchs knew Jennings
> from EARN but Landweber met him for the first time. After, observing him
> and several discussions, they decided to recommend him for both jobs and
> made calls to those leading the searches. Jennings accepted the NSF
> position, and the rest is history!
> 
> //
> 



From amckenzie3 at yahoo.com  Sun Oct 31 06:32:45 2021
From: amckenzie3 at yahoo.com (Alex McKenzie)
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2021 13:32:45 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [ih] INWG Notes
References: <1665782501.1709501.1635687165365.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1665782501.1709501.1635687165365@mail.yahoo.com>

The International Network Working Group (INWG) was formed in 1972 at the first International Conference on Computer Communications to develop ways of interconnecting the various packet-switched networks that were being built around the world.? In about a year the group was given a home in the International Federation for Information Processing (IFIP) as Working Group 6.1 - Computer Communication.? In around 1996 I gave my collection of INWG papers (1972-79) to the Charles Babbage Institute for preservation and public access.? Earlier this year Vint Cerf sponsored the digitization of these documents, and announced their availability to this list. However, in my view they were not very well organized, and I have undertaken to organize them in a way which I believe will make finding individual papers much easier.? Those reorganized documents can be found at
INWG Documents at CBI - Google Drive

| 
| 
|  | 
INWG Documents at CBI - Google Drive


 |

 |

 |


Cheers,Alex



Cheers


From amckenzie3 at yahoo.com  Sun Oct 31 06:36:24 2021
From: amckenzie3 at yahoo.com (Alex McKenzie)
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2021 13:36:24 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [ih] INWG Notes
In-Reply-To: <1665782501.1709501.1635687165365@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <1665782501.1709501.1635687165365.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1665782501.1709501.1635687165365@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <290302241.1714823.1635687384031@mail.yahoo.com>

 For some reason the link was converted to an unclickable non-URL.? Here is the URL which I can't seem to make clickable.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1qskr4PNfnwvqIU6mVdCWPBUS8eXln1Kv?usp=sharing

    On Sunday, October 31, 2021, 09:32:55 AM EDT, Alex McKenzie via Internet-history <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:  
 
 The International Network Working Group (INWG) was formed in 1972 at the first International Conference on Computer Communications to develop ways of interconnecting the various packet-switched networks that were being built around the world.? In about a year the group was given a home in the International Federation for Information Processing (IFIP) as Working Group 6.1 - Computer Communication.? In around 1996 I gave my collection of INWG papers (1972-79) to the Charles Babbage Institute for preservation and public access.? Earlier this year Vint Cerf sponsored the digitization of these documents, and announced their availability to this list. However, in my view they were not very well organized, and I have undertaken to organize them in a way which I believe will make finding individual papers much easier.? Those reorganized documents can be found at

Cheers,Alex
-- 
Internet-history mailing list
Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
  

From vgcerf at gmail.com  Sun Oct 31 06:46:49 2021
From: vgcerf at gmail.com (vinton cerf)
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2021 09:46:49 -0400
Subject: [ih] INWG Notes
In-Reply-To: <290302241.1714823.1635687384031@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <1665782501.1709501.1635687165365.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1665782501.1709501.1635687165365@mail.yahoo.com>
 <290302241.1714823.1635687384031@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAAFtm_XNfVZ0EG_XDt2WKCJnPEuRRddMMP-R8MFBSSySaaxu2A@mail.gmail.com>

that works - thanks for all this hard work, Alex!!
it's good to have this in online, referenceable form.

v


On Sun, Oct 31, 2021 at 9:36 AM Alex McKenzie via Internet-history <
internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:

>  For some reason the link was converted to an unclickable non-URL.  Here
> is the URL which I can't seem to make clickable.
>
>
> https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1qskr4PNfnwvqIU6mVdCWPBUS8eXln1Kv?usp=sharing
>
>     On Sunday, October 31, 2021, 09:32:55 AM EDT, Alex McKenzie via
> Internet-history <internet-history at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>
>  The International Network Working Group (INWG) was formed in 1972 at the
> first International Conference on Computer Communications to develop ways
> of interconnecting the various packet-switched networks that were being
> built around the world.  In about a year the group was given a home in the
> International Federation for Information Processing (IFIP) as Working Group
> 6.1 - Computer Communication.  In around 1996 I gave my collection of INWG
> papers (1972-79) to the Charles Babbage Institute for preservation and
> public access.  Earlier this year Vint Cerf sponsored the digitization of
> these documents, and announced their availability to this list. However, in
> my view they were not very well organized, and I have undertaken to
> organize them in a way which I believe will make finding individual papers
> much easier.  Those reorganized documents can be found at
>
> Cheers,Alex
> --
> Internet-history mailing list
> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
>
> --
> Internet-history mailing list
> Internet-history at elists.isoc.org
> https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/internet-history
>


From Dennis.Jennings at Knous.ie  Sun Oct 31 09:51:33 2021
From: Dennis.Jennings at Knous.ie (Dennis Jennings)
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2021 16:51:33 +0000
Subject: [ih] Request for Assistance
In-Reply-To: <4ef62a37-8954-85da-0f76-41877d296ce5@gmail.com>
References: <45e551c7-6fb4-9248-d46a-46adab4d417d@Knous.ie>
 <a273d6da-7806-9b7f-0b80-2e6c25668145@Knous.ie>
 <4ef62a37-8954-85da-0f76-41877d296ce5@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2cb8ab97-0103-b5f9-30b9-5d84252e6e8d@Knous.ie>

Hi Brian, All,

Thanks - I forgot about that !

Please see the text file below

Reminder - Larry Landweber is looking for your help in getting 
up-to-date e-mail addresses for the participants at the IANWs 
("Landweber" Meetings).

If you have information, please e-mail Larry directly at 
larry.landweber at gmail.com

Many thanks
Dennis

IANWs
NAME??? SURNAME??? ORGANIZATION??? Old e-MAIL
Kjell??? Aage Bringsrud??? Universitetet i Oslo 
kjell_]ge_bringsrud%qzcom.mailnet at mit-multics.arpa
Laura??? Abba??? CNUCE earnmnt%icnucevm.bitnet at cunyvm.cuny.edu
Rick??? Adams??? Center for Seismic Studies rick at seismo.css.gov
Athanase??? Adou??? CIRCL Ministere d'ETAT II SGI EARN:adou at ciearn
Ari??? Ahtiainen??? University of Helsinki? Computing Center 
ari_aht%qzcom.mailnet at mit-multics.arpa
Jean-Pierre ??? Ansart??? Agence de l'Informatique
Gideon??? Ariely??? Ministry of Science and Development EARN:gideon at ilncrd
Mr.??? Aulam??? .
Jean-Pierre??? Aulas??? .
Alain??? Auroux??? .
Mohamed??? Awang-Lah??? Malaysian Institute of Microelectronic Systems 
(MIMOS) mimos!mal at uunet.uu.net
Lars??? Backstrom??? University of Helsinki? Computing Center 
lars_backstrom at qzcom.mailnet
Derek??? Barber??? Alvey Directorate Millbank Tower dlab%alvey at ucl-cs.arpa
Joseph??? Barbera??? FUNDESCO Programa IRIS??? EARN fundesco at etsitm.iris 
mcvax!goya!fundesco at uunet.uu.net
Piet??? Beertema??? EUNET / CWI??? mcvax!piet piet%mcvax.uucp at seismo.arpa
Jean-Luc??? Bernard??? .
Ulf??? Bilting??? Chalmers University SUNET (CS) bilting at cs.chalmers.se
Manfred??? Bogen??? .
Bill??? Bostwick??? US DOE (Dept of Energy) Office of Scientific 
Computing bostwick%mfe.mfenet at nmfecc.arpa
Danny??? Braniss??? The Hebrew University CS Dept danny at humus.huji.ac.il
Hans-Werner??? Braun??? University of Michigan hwb at mcr.umich.edu
Mats??? Brunell??? SICS matsb at sics.se
Paul??? Bryant??? Computing Division Rutherford Appleton Laboratories 
bryant%rlgb at ucl-cs.arpa
Herb??? Budd??? IBM - Europe
Stan??? Budkowski??? Agence de l'Informatique
Birgitta??? Carlson??? QZ birgitta_carlson at qzcom.mailnet
Bjorn??? Carlsson??? Stockholm University Computing Centre 
bjorn_carlsson_qz%qzcom.bitnet at cunyvm.cuny.edu
Yang Hee??? Choi??? ETRI yhchoi at etrivax.etri.re.kr
Kilnam??? Chon??? KAIST chon at kaist.csnet seismo!kaist!chon
Kam P??? Chow??? University of Hong Kong hkucs!chow at uunet.uu.net
Joe??? Choy??? National Center for Atmospheric Research choy at ncar.ucar.edu
Avi??? Cohen??? Computer Center a32 at taunivm.bitnet
Robert ??? Cooper??? Rutherford Appleton Laboratory (Joint Network Team) 
r.cooper at rutherford.ac.uk
Alain??? Costes??? LAAS
Jim??? Craigie??? Rutherford Appleton Laboratory (Joint Network Team)??? 
RFC822: J.Craigie at rutherford.ac.uk
John??? Curley??? National Research Council of Canada 
curleyj%nrcvm01.bitnet at cunyvm.cuny.edu
Paulo H??? de Aguiar Rodrigues??? UFRJ e LARC userphar at lnccvm.bitnet
Jon??? Demco??? University British Columbia Dept CS 
demco.ubc at csnet-relay.arpa
Yves??? Devillers??? INRIA yves.devillers at inria.fr
Piers??? Dick-Lauder??? . munnari!cluster.cs.su.oz.au!piers at uunet.uu.net,
Michel??? Elie??? Bull 
Elie.CII-HB%HIS-PHOENIX-MULTICS%CISL-SERVICE-MULTICS at MIT-MULTICS.arpa
Robert??? Elz??? .
Adriano??? Endrizzi??? Join Research Center
Tommy??? Ericson??? Stockholm University Computing Center 
tommy_ericson__qz%qzcom.mailnet at mit-multics.arpa
Hans??? Eriksson??? University of Upsala (CS) hans at kuling.uucp 
hans_eriksson at qzcom.mailnet
Dave??? Farber??? University of Delaware (EE) farber at udel-ee.arpa
Daniel??? Fauvarque??? Agence de l'Informatique 
daniel_fauvarque at qzcom.mailnet fauve at france.csnet
Fran?ois??? Fluckiger??? CERN
Ira??? Fuchs??? Princeton Univ (VP for computing & IT) fuchs at pucc.bitnet
Bernard??? Galler??? University of Michigan galler at um.cc.umich.edu
Jesus??? Garcia Tomas??? UPM 
jesus_garcia_tomas%qzcom.mailnet at mit-multics.arpa
Anil??? Garg??? Bombay, National Centre for Software Technology??? +91 
98208 39000
Michel??? Gien??? INRIA - CNET? Domain de Voluceau gien at mit-multics 
...mcvax!inria!gien
Gerhard??? Glas??? DFVLR-NT Oberpfaffenhofen
Steven??? Goldstein??? NSF Div of Networking & Communication Research & 
Infrastruct sgoldste at note.nsf.gov
Jean-Louis??? Grange??? InRIA - Project Nadir grange at mit-multics.arpa
Frode??? Greisen??? UNI-C neufrode at vm.uni-c.dk
Alexandre??? Grojsgold??? Laboratorio Nacional de Computa?ao
Johann??? Gunnarsson??? SURIS Ministry of Finance Bureau of the Budget 
johg at rhi.hi.is.
Claudio??? Gutierrez??? University of Delaware (EE) gutierre at udel.edu
Teus??? Hagen??? EUNET / EUUG??? seismo!mcvax!ace!teus 
teus%mcvax.uucp at seismo.arpa
Robert??? Hagens??? University of Wisconsin-Madison (CS) 
hagens at wisc-rsch.arpa hagens at wiscvm.bitnet
Trevor??? Hales??? CSIRO (CTO) hales at ditmela.oz.au
Alf??? Hansen??? ELAB-RUNIT??? EARN: 
alf-hansen%vax.runit.unit.uninett at norunix
Juergen??? Harms??? CUI harms at sun.cui.unige.ch
Arthur K.??? Hartwig??? .
Juha??? Heinanen??? Tampere Univ of Technology jh at tut.fi
Gerrit??? Henken??? .
Brent??? Hilpert??? University of British Columbia CDNNET 
hilpert at ean.ubc.cdn hilpert at ubc.ean.uucp hilpert at ubc.csnet
John??? Hine??? Victoria University (CS Dept) vuwcomp!hine at uunet.uu.net 
hine at comp.vuw.ac.nz
Christopher??? Horn??? EEC
John??? Houlker??? University of Waikato j.houlker at waikato.ac.nz
Christian??? Huitema??? INRIA christian.huitema at inria.fr
James??? Hutton??? RARE Secretariat jsh at ib.rl.ac.uk
Hiroshi??? Inose??? National Center for Science Information
Haruhisa ??? Ishida??? Univ. of Tokyo (Computer Center) 
ishida%u-tokyo.ac.jp at relay.cs.net
Dennis??? Jennings??? University College Dublin jennings at irlearn.ucd.ie
Daniel??? Karrenberg??? CWI dfk at cwi.nl
Peter??? Kaufmann??? DFN-Verein??? X.400: C=DE; A=DBP; P=DFN; OU=ZPL; 
S=KAUFMANN kaufmann at zpl.dfn.dbp.de
Simon??? Kenyon??? ICL-Information Technology Centre 
iclitc!simon at uunet.uu.net
Peter??? Kirstein??? Univ College of London (Dept of CS) 
kirstein at nss.cs.ucl.ac.uk
Volkmar??? Kobelt??? GMD??? mcvax!unido!gmdzi!kobelt
Bob??? Kummerfeld??? University of Sydney bob at cs.su.oz.au
Haavard??? Kvernelv??? RUNIT-F, SINTEF 
EARN:kvernelv%vax.runit.unit.uninett at norunix
Lawrence??? Landweber??? Univ. of Wisconsin CS Dept landweber at cs.wisc.edu
Jean Paul??? Le Guigner??? CICB??? EARN:leguigne at FRCICB81
Alexandre??? Leib Grojsgold??? Laboratorio Nacional de Computa?ao 
Cientifica leib at lnccvm.bitnet
Jim??? Leighton??? Lawrence-Livermore National Laboratory 
leighton%mfe at nmfecc.arpa
Shao-Hong??? Li??? Institute of Computer Applications 
rzli%beijing%germany.csnet at relay.cs.net
C. Chiung??? Li??? ICA rzli%beijing at ira.uka.de
Wai Lung??? Loh??? National University of Singapore aawai at NUSVM.bitnet
Dan??? Long??? BBN (CSnet) long at nnsc.nsf.net
David??? Lord??? CERN pfkdn at cernvm.earn
Jim??? Loveluck??? Bull 
Loveluck.CII-HB%HIS-PHOENIX-MULTICS%CISL-SERVICE-MULTICS at mit-multics.arpa
Joe??? Luhukay??? Computer Science Center, Univ. of Indonesia 
luhukay at indovax.uucp
Johan??? Lundberg??? Swedish Telecom johan_lundberg at qzcom.mailnet
Robert??? Mahl??? Agence de l'Informatique mahl at france.csnet 
robert_mahl at qzcom.mailnet
Gianni??? Mainetto??? .
Richard??? Mandelbaum??? University of Rochester (VP for Computing) 
rma at cs.rochester.edu
Ignacio??? Martinez??? FUNDESCO Programa IRIS martinez at iris-dcp.es
Manuel??? Medina??? E. T. S. E. Telecomunicacio 
medina%qzcom.mailnet at mit-multics.arpa
Enrique ??? Melrose??? CONTEL? Instituto Mexicano de Comunicaciones
Enzo??? Molino??? Consejo Nacional de Ciencia y Tecnolog?a
Jun??? Murai??? University of Tokio (Comp Center) 
jun%zappa.cc.u-tokyo.junet%utokyo-relay.csnet at relay.cs.net
Jun ??? Murai??? Univ. of Tokyo (Computer Center) 
jun at xroads.cc.u-tokyo.ac.jp
Kees??? Neggers??? SURFnet??? EARN:neggers at HUTSUR51
Nicholas??? Newman??? European Commission EARN:nicholas_newman at qzcom
Henry??? Nussbacher??? Tel Aviv University??? EARN:hank at taunivm
Robert??? o'Brien??? CERN
Dan??? Oberst??? .
Jacob??? Palme??? Stockholm University Computing Centre 
jacob_palme_qz%qzcom.bitnet at cunyvm.cuny.edu
Yong Jin??? Park??? Hanyang University park at hyuee.hanyang.ac.kr
Craig??? Partridge??? .
Ahmed??? Patel??? .
Shmuel??? Peleg??? The Hebrew University CS Dept EARN:peleg at humus
Bernhard??? Plattner??? Institut fuer Informatik plattner at ifi.ethz.ch
XLouis??? Pouzin??? CNET pouzin at mit-multics.arpa
Ken??? Preiss??? Univ. of the Negev??? EARN:preiss at bengus
Enzo??? Puliatt??? UNDP RBLAC cdp!enzop at arisia.xerox.com
Tian-Bai??? Qian??? Institute of Computer Applications
 ???? Ramani??? National Center for Software Technology
Jean-Claude??? Rault??? Agence de l'Informatique 
j_rault%qzcom.mailnet at mit-multics.arpa
Glen??? Ricart??? University of Maryland (CS Center) ricart at umdc.bitnet
Juan??? Riera??? Univ. Politecnica Madrid DIT (ETSI Telecomunicacion) 
mcvax!goya!riera at uunet.uu.net EARN: riera at etsim.iris
Ari??? Rikkil??? Finnish State Computer Center 
 ?ari_rikkil{_finnish_state_computer_center%qzcom.mailnet at mit-multics.arpa
Ari??? Rikkila??? Finnish State Computer Centre FUNET 
ari-rikkil{@qzcom.mailnet
Dennis??? Rockell??? BBN / CSNET drockwel at csnet-sh.arpa
Roland A.??? Rosner??? Univ of London (Comp Centre) rosner at ncdlab.ulcc.ac.uk
Michael??? Rotert??? University of Karlsruhe (Faculty of Informatics) 
rotert at ira.uka.de
Jacques??? Sakarovitch??? Ministrie de l'Industrie et de la Recherche
Harri??? Salminen??? FUNET (FSCC/CSC) hks at funet.fi
Horst??? Santo??? GMD
Trond??? Skjesol??? .
Knut??? Smaaland??? University of Oslo 
knut_smaaland_U%qzcom.mailnet at mit-multics.arpa
Marco??? Sommani??? CNUCE??? EARN:vnetmnt at icnucevm
Rolf??? Speth??? Rechenzentrum der Universitat Duesseldorf 
rolf_speth_univ_duesseldorf%qzcom.mailnet at mit-multics.arpa
Paal??? Spilling??? Norwegian Telecommunications Authority paal at nta-vax.arpa
Michael A.??? Stanton??? University College of London (CS) 
stanton at nss.cs.ucl.ac.uk
Sven??? Tafvelin??? Chalmers University SUNET (CS) 
sven_tafvelin at qzcom.mailnet? mcvax!enea!chalmers!talvelin
Tadao??? Takahashi??? CNPQ
Gligor??? Tashkovich??? DECTE gligor%lerouf.dec at decwrl.dec.com
Menachem??? Tassa??? National Council for Research & Development 
ncrd.israel at csnet-relay.arpa
Hide ??? Tokuda??? Carnegie Mellon University (CS Dept) 
Hide.Tokuda at k.cs.cmu.edu
Roald??? Torbergsen??? .
Daniel??? Trujillo??? ITESM Centro de Calculo daniel at tecmtyvm.bitnet
Stefano??? Trumpy??? CNUCE Institute of CNR EARN:trumpy at icnucevm
Klaus??? Ullmann??? DFN
Florencio??? Utreras??? University of Chile 
futreras%uchcecvm.bitnet at cunyvm.cuny.edu
Tony??? Villasenor??? NASA Science Internet villasenor at ames.arpa
Hans??? Wallberg??? UMDAC hwg at biovax.umdc.umu.se
Michael??? Walsh??? University College Dublin walsh at irlearn.ucd.ie
Y. Fung??? Wang??? ICA Institute Peking wang%beijing at ira.uka.de
Steve??? Wolff??? NSF Div of Networking steve at note.nsf.gov
Chu-Quan??? Yang??? Academy of Machinery Equipment
XHubert??? Zimmermann??? CNET??? hzim at mit-multics
Edgar??? Zorilla??? Consejo Nacional de Investig Cient?ficas y Tecnol?gicas
Werner??? Zorn??? Universitat Karlsruhe Informatik Rechnerabteilung 
zorn at ira.uka.de



On 29/10/2021 21:43, Brian E Carpenter wrote:
> The attachment was of course discarded by list policy.
>
> Regards
> ?? Brian Carpenter
> ?? Thinking of the IETF standards process: https://xkcd.com/2530/
>
> On 30-Oct-21 03:42, Dennis Jennings via Internet-history wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> For many of us around the world the "Landweber" meetings held between
>> 1982 and 1989 were an important source of information and personal
>> contacts about academic networks and an important encouragement to get
>> together in our own countries and to try to develop our own national or
>> regional networks, and to connect to the Internet.
>>
>> Larry is now looking to write some of the history around these meetings
>> - formally the International Academic Networkshops (IANWs) - and is
>> looking for your help.
>>
>> Please see Larry's message below.
>>
>> Many thanks
>> Dennis
>>
>> ******
>>
>> Dear Colleagues
>>
>>
>> THIS IS A REQUEST FOR YOUR HELP
>>
>>
>> I am working on an Internet history that will include a discussion of
>> the roles of the International Academic NetWorkshops (1982-1989), the
>> INET conferences (1991?) and the Developing CountriesWorkshops (1992?)
>> in fostering the spread and growth of the global Internet during the
>> 1980s and 1990s.
>>
>>
>> This request pertains to the IANWs. I am trying to contact attendees of
>> these Workshops to get their inputs.The attached attendee spreadsheet
>> has mostly not been updated since the 1980s and most email addresses
>> likely timed out decades ago. I also do not have a list of attendees for
>> 1982 and 1983.
>>
>>
>> 1. If you attended an IANW please send me (larry.landweber at gmail.com)
>> your current contact info and the workshops you attended. If you have
>> photos from the meetings or other photos of attendees from the 1980s,
>> please send.Please also send any anecdotes, thoughts or comments
>> regarding the workshops that you would like to share.
>>
>> 2. Please forward this note to colleagues who attended but may not have
>> received it.
>>
>> 3. I have a fairly complete collection of submitted documents from
>> 1985-89 but do not have those from 1982, 1983, 1984.If you still have
>> them, please scan and send.
>>
>> 4. Last, please send me information on attendees who have passed away or
>> who otherwise are not able to respond.
>>
>>
>> Thanks for your help.
>>
>> Larry Landweber, Larry.landweber at gmail.com
>>
>>
>> PS An example of an anecdote:
>>
>> Jennings, Fuchs and Landweber attended the 1984 IANW. Fuchs and
>> Landweber knew that CSNET was looking for an Executive Director and that
>> NSF was looking for a Networking Program Director. Fuchs knew Jennings
>> from EARN but Landweber met him for the first time. After, observing him
>> and several discussions, they decided to recommend him for both jobs and
>> made calls to those leading the searches. Jennings accepted the NSF
>> position, and the rest is history!
>>
>> //
>>
>
-- 
?

Dr. Dennis Jennings,

	

Internet Pioneer, Internet Hall of Fame, 2014

/?I told you this Internet thing would catch on!?/

	

Company Director / Mentor & Coach / Angel Investor


	

Dennis.Jennings at knous.ie <mailto:Dennis.Jennings at ICANN.org>

	

Mobile: +353 87 220 8225

Knous ? Knowledge & Common Sense

	

//

/Please note that NO permission is granted to share these contact 
details with any social media platform.///

//

//


From alejandroacostaalamo at gmail.com  Sun Oct 31 16:46:19 2021
From: alejandroacostaalamo at gmail.com (Alejandro Acosta)
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2021 19:46:19 -0400
Subject: [ih] INWG Notes
In-Reply-To: <1665782501.1709501.1635687165365@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <1665782501.1709501.1635687165365.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1665782501.1709501.1635687165365@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <518f1b60-2ab5-2e30-23e9-ced5b736f6e0@gmail.com>

Hello,

 ? I just took sometime and read a little of few documents (thanks for 
sharing!)..., I just can say that I'm in shock. This is something I've 
felt many times but I have never had the courage to say it. I really 
enjoy reading old documents, sometimes I read old RFCs and the way you 
conceived the problems in that moment and you were able to solve them, 
just amazing.

 ?? This documents almost describes TCP (sorry, I have not read the full 
document, just quick), dated October 28 1974:

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1RY8zAH05wftU_Kj2U_R4wLDdTjHezU7I 
(name: INWG P 1.pdf)


 ?? In this one you mentioned half & full duplex (dated September 1974):

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1RY8zAH05wftU_Kj2U_R4wLDdTjHezU7I 
(?? (name: INWG P 3.pdf)


 ?? For me it is unbelievable to see what most of you though 30-40-50 
years ago and now you have make it real. It's like being in the DeLorean 
in Back to the Future.


Regards,

P.S. I'm 45.


On 31/10/21 9:32 AM, Alex McKenzie via Internet-history wrote:
> The International Network Working Group (INWG) was formed in 1972 at the first International Conference on Computer Communications to develop ways of interconnecting the various packet-switched networks that were being built around the world.? In about a year the group was given a home in the International Federation for Information Processing (IFIP) as Working Group 6.1 - Computer Communication.? In around 1996 I gave my collection of INWG papers (1972-79) to the Charles Babbage Institute for preservation and public access.? Earlier this year Vint Cerf sponsored the digitization of these documents, and announced their availability to this list. However, in my view they were not very well organized, and I have undertaken to organize them in a way which I believe will make finding individual papers much easier.? Those reorganized documents can be found at
> INWG Documents at CBI - Google Drive
>
> |
> |
> |  |
> INWG Documents at CBI - Google Drive
>
>
>   |
>
>   |
>
>   |
>
>
> Cheers,Alex
>
>
>
> Cheers