[Chapter-delegates] ChAC-SC Advice notice

Thu Feb 27 06:56:01 PST 2020

Dear Richard,

It is the nature of my work that I'm obligated to pay attention to what you
call "procedural niceties." Many people think "procedural" concerns are
relatively unimportant, but in the context of policy recommendations and
decisions it is often the case that adherence to procedural norms minimizes
the risks of misinformation and misperception.

It seems possible, speaking as someone who was not a participant in this
particular set of deliberations, although I have experienced similar
deliberations in other contents, that there may have been an
conscious effort to communicate that there was more "unanimous" or "full"
participation in an important deliberation than, in practice, there was.
It's also possible that there wasn't. But adhering to good procedural
practice reduces uncertainty about these questions.

If you are trying to say, Richard, that there was no active effort to
eliminate any appearance of dissent or desire for further discussion, ,
through the adroit use of "procedural niceties" or the particular choices
of words like "unanimous" or "full,"  then I think it's good for you and
other participants to say so expressly here.

Mike Godwin

On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 9:36 AM Richard Hill <rhill at hill-a.ch> wrote:

> Dear Mike,
>
>
>
> There was indeed a request to postpone the deadline for the consensus
> call, but the request was opposed. Since there was no consensus to postpone
> the deadline, the Chair of the ChAC (in my view correctly) ruled that the
> deadline would not be postponed.
>
>
>
> Please recall that this is about non-binding advice to the Board, so it
> seems unproductive to me to be quibbling about procedural niceties.
>
>
>
> Best,
>
> Richard
>
>
>
> *From:* Mike Godwin [mailto:mnemonic at gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 27, 2020 14:29
> *To:* Franca Palazzo
> *Cc:* Narelle Clark; Richard Hill; ISOC Chapter Delegates
> *Subject:* Re: [Chapter-delegates] ChAC-SC Advice notice
>
>
>
> Franca, you are not the only person from whom I have heard that there was
> a call for further discussion and that this call was actively discouraged
> or suppressed.
>
>
>
> In general, in larger United Nations or civil-society contexts, calls for
> further discussion are normally an indicator that driving a collective
> resolution towards consensus approval is premature.
>
>
>
> Mike Godwin
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 3:37 AM Franca Palazzo via Chapter-delegates <
> chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>
> I do not agree that silence is consent.
>
> The Canadian Chapter does not necessarily agree with this submission in
> its entirety.
>
> I asked for further discussion and was immediately pounced on.
>
> Our chapter should not be associated as agreeing with these
> recommendations.
>
> We dont have the time nor the resources to properly engage on this.
>
> I had not realized we could call for a vote.  It would seem to me that
> this should have been done.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Get Outlook for Android <https://aka.ms/ghei36>
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* Chapter-delegates <chapter-delegates-bounces at elists.isoc.org> on
> behalf of Narelle Clark via Chapter-delegates <
> chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 26, 2020 7:00:45 PM
> *To:* Richard Hill <rhill at hill-a.ch>
> *Cc:* ISOC Chapter Delegates <chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [Chapter-delegates] ChAC-SC Advice notice
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Richard
>
> Would you mind giving an overview of the process used, or pointing me at a
> description of it?
>
>
>
> Much appreciated
>
>
>
>
>
> Narelle
>
>
>
> On Thu, 27 Feb. 2020, 2:02 am Richard Hill via Chapter-delegates, <
> chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>
> Dear John,
>
>
>
> I disagree with your inference below. The consensus call clearly indicated
> that lack of opposition (silence) would indicate approval. That’s not an
> unusual way to seek approval, it it is used in many circumstances.  And it
> is the method foreseen in the ChAC’s operating rules.
>
>
>
> So, if we believe  in rules and procedures, then we must accept that the
> advice represents the consensus of the Chapters.
>
>
>
> Best,
>
> Richard
>
>
>
> *From:* Chapter-delegates [
> mailto:chapter-delegates-bounces at elists.isoc.org
> <chapter-delegates-bounces at elists.isoc.org>] *On Behalf Of *John More via
> Chapter-delegates
> *Sent:* mercredi, 26. février 2020 15:30
> *To:* Gonzalo Camarillo
> *Cc:* Chapters AC Elist; Chapter Delegates
> *Subject:* Re: [Chapter-delegates] ChAC-SC Advice notice
>
>
>
> Gonzalo
>
>
>
> The failure of the large majority of Chapter delegates to communicate in
> the call for consensus does indicate that the recommendations do not
> reflect a broad consensus in the ISOC community.  They reflect the concerns
> of the more activist Chapters.
>
>
>
> Yours,
>
>
>
> John More
>
> Delegate, ISOC-DC
>
>
>
> On Feb 26, 2020, at 6:14 AM, Gonzalo Camarillo via Chapter-delegates <
> chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org> wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi Eduardo,
>
>
>
> thanks for putting together the three documents with advice to the Board.
> The Board will discuss them and get back to you in order to continue the
> dialog.
>
>
>
> In addition, as you know, we have been working for several years with you
> and the previous ChAC chairs to find ways for us to engage the community
> more effectively. Unfortunately, that still seems to be a challenge. Per
> the thread below, where you seem to have discussed this advice, around 80
> to 85% of our 124 chapters did not participate in the discussions or
> express any opinion on the advice at all:
>
>
> https://connect.internetsociety.org/communities/community-home?CommunityKey=2ee50649-4a00-4918-83a5-4c8a9a7c7a4c
>
>
>
> We hope to continue working with you on finding ways to engage a much
> larger fraction of our community in the future, especially when dealing
> with important issues.
>
>
>
> With the above in mind, it is unfortunately inappropriate to say that this
> advice was approved by *unanimous* consensus since most of the community
> did not even participate in the discussions (after receiving your advice,
> several people from different chapters indeed told me they had actually not
> noticed the discussions on the advice at all). Therefore, I am cc'ing the
> 'Chapter Delegates' mailing list on this email so that as many people as
> possible from our community are aware of these advice and our upcoming
> response.
>
>
>
> I have also noticed that you decided not to include any information that
> was made available after February 10th, including the recently announced
> PIC. Well, we can discuss that on the webinar on Friday. I am looking
> forward to that.
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
>
>
> Gonzalo
>
> Chair - ISOC Board of Trustees
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Eduardo Diaz <eduardodiazrivera at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Monday, February 24, 2020 04:22
> *To:* Gonzalo Camarillo <gonzalo.camarillo at ericsson.com>; Kevin Craemer <
> Craemer at isoc.org>
> *Cc:* Chapters AC Elist <ChaptersAC-SC at elists.isoc.org>
> *Subject:* ChAC-SC Advice notice
>
>
>
> Distinguished Members of the Board:
>
>
>
> The Chapter Advisory Council Steering Committee (ChAC-SC) is submitting
> the following advice for your consideration:
>
>
>
>    1. Advice 2020.02.13-01 :: *The sale of PIR to Ethos Capital should
>    not proceed unless a number of conditions are met.
>    <https://isoc.box.com/s/amwx365bl2w38gh3laxneo2pv1q4w1jy>*
>    2. Advice 2020.02.13-02 :: ISOC constituencies must be consulted
>    <https://isoc.box.com/s/3gey7i3gbqomurwfhhuvxqq49ms0hwm3>
>    3. Advice 2020.02.13-03 :: Changes to ISOC’s Bylaws to strengthen
>    Advisory Councils and Chapters
>    <https://isoc.box.com/s/fhl9ako4i1a4m2ivxuaez42y4vapeoyb>
>
>
>
> The Full Chapter Advisory Council (Full ChAC) approved all Advice by
> unanimous consensus. No objections were received by the set deadline.
>
>
>
> Please note that Advice #1 is based on information available as of 10
> February 2020.
>
>
>
> Thank you for the opportunity to work with you to make ISOC a better
> organization.
>
>
>
>
>
> Eduardo Díaz
>
> Chair
>
> ChAC-SC
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
> _______________________________________________
> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed
> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
> Chapter Portal (AMS):
> https://admin.internetsociety.org/622619/User/Login
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> https://www.internetsociety.org/become-a-member/code-of-conduct/
>
>
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