[Chapter-delegates] Recent Correspondence from the Cambodian Chapter

Wed Sep 25 17:07:04 PDT 2013

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Dear All,
from the formal point  "chapter" is a part of one large structure.  I
think it is to have clearly defined relations  between "Chapters" (or
local ISOC structures) and whom? I use "ISOC Global" term, but may be
"Management" or "HQ or "Board" is better? For each of proposed terms
there is some uncertainty.

After Cambodian declaration it looks, that there only one real  way to
draw attention to Chapter problems.

Btw, why it is such strong negative reaction   for direct financial
support? And as we see, there is an expression " The issue of the lack
of direct financial transfers is currently not among
the solutions the Internet Society can offer".

 Here we  see the author:  it is the  "Internet Society".
 Not the  Board, not the staff, not the management, not ISOC Global,
but the "Internet Society"
 Logically,  I can understand,  that as a  Chapter,  our Chapter was
involved in some kind of discussion on that point, there was a voting
procedure, and such decision was approved by majority?  But we do not
participated in such procedure.
On the the other hand, if the Chapter is real "chapter" - a part of a
large structure the "Internet Society"  - it is not necessary to ask
Chapter's opinion.

Clear definition of terms is one of the strongest requirements
everywhere, I think it is one of the most important points today for
ISOC community (also  undefined  term).

Grigori Saghyan
ISOC.AM

On 26.09.2013 0:19, Elver Loho wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> I haven't kept up with this email list, but from what I can gather
> the Cambodian Chapter wants to disassociate from ISOC due to lack
> of direct financial support for the basic running and operation of
> the Chapter.
> 
> I do not speak for my Chapter here, but personally I
> wholeheartedly support this gesture. If this happens, then maybe,
> just maybe, ISOC senior staff will start taking the issue of
> providing support for Chapters around the world seriously.
> 
> Right now Chapters seem to exist more as a way for ISOC HQ to show 
> that they have support and members around the world. We're all 
> providing a sort of legitimacy for the people at the HQ. Do we get 
> something back for this? Sort of. I mean, maybe. To some degree. 
> Though here in Estonia very few people have heard of the Internet 
> Society while our own local language brand carries a lot of
> weight. Your situation may be different.
> 
> Meanwhile we're battling with basic organizational issues, because
> we can't even afford to keep up basic maintenance. At times we're
> even unable to reply to government's requests for comments on
> pending legislation, because we all have regular jobs or businesses
> to run. This has to end. If what it takes is for one or more
> Chapters to secede from the union, then so be it. If the Cambodian
> Chapter goes through with this, I'm willing to put the question of
> secession up for debate in our own Chapter.
> 
> I urge other Chapter leaders to consider the same.
> 
> Best, Elver .ee
> 
> elver.loho at gmail.com +372 5661 6933 skype: elver.loho
> 
> 
> On 25 September 2013 22:56, Dave Burstein <daveb at dslprime.com>
> wrote:
>> Cambodian colleagues
>> 
>> I'm a board member in New York and respect your decision but urge
>> you to keep working to resolve this. The board of ISOC is
>> strongly committed to working with chapters and directed staff to
>> improve things. If that's broken down here, as it seems, several
>> board members are surely willing to help. They are dedicated,
>> committed people who make a point fo responding to ISOC chapter
>> members. I or a dozen others on this list can connect you if
>> that makes things easier.
>> 
>> They are all strong and independent thinkers, most with a no
>> b______ attitude.
>> 
>> 
>> Ted
>> 
>> Thanks for addressing this; leaving it without response would
>> have been painful. This is a crisis for the goverance model of
>> ISOC that needs to be resolved at the highest level. As you saw
>> from this list, a dozen other chapters think this crucial to
>> solve.
>> 
>> But "The issue of the lack of direct financial transfers is
>> currently not among the solutions the Internet Society can offer"
>> doesn't seem to the point. Is there anything in the ISOC charter
>> that makes this impossible? If so, please point to it and people
>> can bring it to the board.
>> 
>> "Can" is the word you used. I'm guessing this actually is an 
>> administrative decision made by the senior staff, who can, if
>> they choose, simply reverse the decision. Staff are constantly
>> making financial decisions an order of magnitude greater.  If
>> staff feel they can't do this without board approval, that's easy
>> to obtain if it's important to ISOC. As many of us know, most of
>> the board members are very accessible and dedicated to solving
>> ISOC problems if necessary.
>> 
>> "Should" ISOC provide the seed funding here, necessary to get the
>> chapter started on the path to independence is the real question.
>> I'm sure there's a lot more here than the presumably modest sum
>> to share some office space. Likely, a shared or cheap office
>> space that fits the legal requirements can be obtained for less
>> than the cost of sending one more talking head to IGF Bali.
>> Nothing wrong with IGF, but a slightly smaller ISOC delegation
>> isn't a fatal wound.
>> 
>> I don't know enough to decide whether ISOC should do more here
>> and I'm sure there are major issues that haven't been discussed.
>> 
>> So let's draw in Lynn, Walda or whomever else actually has the
>> power to make things happen and prevent a deep organizational
>> problem.
>> 
>> db
>> 
>> 
>> On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 1:25 PM, Ted Mooney <mooney at isoc.org>
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> To all Chapter Delegates
>>> 
>>> ISOC Staff and, in particular, Membership and Services,  are
>>> saddened by the recent decision and communication from the
>>> Cambodian Chapter regarding their desire to dissociate from the
>>> Internet Society for administrative and other support concerns.
>>> I believe, however, there has been an unfortunate 
>>> miscommunication.  The Chapter Development and APAC staff  have
>>> reached out to the Cambodian Chapter on numerous occasions.  As
>>> many of you know, our Chapter Development team has worked with
>>> other chapters to help address issues nearly identical to what
>>> the Cambodian Chapter is experiencing.  Our offer of
>>> collaboration remains.
>>> 
>>> The issue of the lack of direct financial transfers is
>>> currently not among the solutions the Internet Society can
>>> offer.  There are, nevertheless many other avenues to address
>>> the administrative support of the Chapter, which are both local
>>> and long term.  Indeed Staff are working with Chapter 
>>> volunteers and have convened a new Chapter Administrative
>>> Support Working Group to address this issue broadly.  We hope
>>> the Cambodian Chapter will reassess their position and
>>> re-engage with ISOC staff as soon as possible. Our Chapter
>>> Development staff will reach out once again to the Cambodian 
>>> Chapter officers.
>>> 
>>> Best regards,
>>> 
>>> Ted Ted Mooney Senior Director, Membership & Services The
>>> Internet Society 1775 Wiehle Avenue Reston, VA 20190 USA 
>>> Office: +1 703-439-2774 Cell: +1 301-980-6446 eMail:
>>> mooney at isoc.org
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________ As an Internet
>>> Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed to
>>> this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet
>>> Society Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- Editor, Fast Net News, Net Policy News and A Wireless Cloud 
>> Author with Jennie Bourne  DSL (Wiley, 2002) and Web Video:
>> Making It Great, Getting It Noticed (Peachpit, 2008)
>> 
>> _______________________________________________ As an Internet
>> Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed to this
>> list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society 
>> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
> _______________________________________________ As an Internet
> Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed to this
> list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society 
> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
> 

- -- 
Grigori Saghyan
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