[Chapter-delegates] Announcement about the dissolution of ISOC-KH
Veni Markovski
veni at veni.com
Tue Nov 5 10:17:34 PST 2013
I would agree with you, Bryan.
I don't think the staff is to be blamed.
And I am really sad about the dissolution of ISOC-KH.
I believe that ISOC should try to repair the damage. Hope they can do it.
v.
On 11/05/13 09:37, Bryan Tan wrote:
> While I agree this turn of events is tragic, I would not be quick to
> point fingers.
> In Singapore, we encounter the same set of ISOC staff and have found
> them to be helpful and supportive. Sure, there are times when we do
> not get things our way but the aim is for the betterment of the
> community, not our individual wants.
>
> I have also just come back from Bali and interacted with over 35 ISOC
> fellows and chapter representatives and none had anything bad to say
> about ISOC staff.
>
> As someone pointed out, in this week where Cambodia dissolves, two new
> chapters have applied for admission - it can't be all that bad.
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:12 AM, David Solomonoff
> <president at isoc-ny.org <mailto:president at isoc-ny.org>> wrote:
>
> This is tragic - both for Cambodia's netizens (past, present and
> future) and for ISOC.
>
> It will have long-term negative consequences for the global
> organization in ways that are hard to anticipate. But first and
> foremost will be the temptation for other Chapters to dissolve or
> dissociate whenever there is disagreement.
>
> If other Chapters follow a similar path, the credibility - and
> even the viability - of ISOC will be severely damaged.
>
> The ISOC staff who allowed this to happen have made a grievous error.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> David
>
> On 11/03/2013 09:26 PM, Chantra Be wrote:
>> *Dear All,*
>>
>> *On 26 October 2013, a meeting was held according to Article XII of the
>> Bylaws of the Cambodian Chapter of the Internet Society:*
>>
>> *Article XII. - Dissolution of the Chapter*
>>
>> 1. Dissolution of this Chapter by consent of the members shall consist of
>> unanimous agreement of all its officers together with a majority vote at a
>> meeting which has been publicized in advance to all members of the Chapter
>> for the purpose of taking this vote.
>>
>> *2. Should this Chapter be dissolved, its assets shall be transferred to
>> ISOC International Headquarters.*
>>
>>
>> The meeting had been called on 23 September 2013, stating:
>>
>>
>> "It is to propose -- unless real and practical alternatives are identified
>> within the following month -- to call a meeting of all members of our
>> Chapter for the purpose of taking a vote to dissolve the ISOC Cambodia
>> Chapter."
>>
>>
>> *The meeting decided to dissolve the ISOC Cambodia Chapter; this decision
>> becomes effective after the present Announcement will have been sent out:*
>>
>> - - to all members of the ISOC Cambodia Chapter
>> - - to the Chapter Delegates list of ISOC
>> - - to the Chairperson of the Board of ISOC
>> - - to the ISOC Senior Director, Membership & Services (You had written:
>> "If the Cambodian Chapter wishes to rescind its ISOC chapter status, a
>> letter so stating to the APAC Chapter Development manager is sufficient" -
>> would you please forward it there -- or also to other persons in ISOC beyond
>> the APAC office who might want to know.)
>>
>>
>> This decision was taken drawing together the conclusions of the
>> correspondence with ISOC staff and ISOC Chapter leaders: we appreciate very
>> much the many encouraging comments from other Chapters, and we regret that
>> the expected correspondence from ISOC staff -- regional and central -- was
>> late, or not forthcoming at all, and not proposing real and practical steps
>> ahead.
>>
>>
>> *The following is to be more specific:*
>>
>> In response to the "Interim Information: Serious considerations to dissolve
>> the Cambodia ISOC Chapter" which we had sent to you and to ISOC Chapter
>> leaders and ISOC staff on 16 Oct 2013, we received the following response
>> from Ted Mooney - ISOC Senior Director, Membership & Services -- on 18
>> October 2013, under the Subject line "Communication and moving forward with
>> the ISOC Cambodia Chapter."
>>
>> I quote *the mail from Ted Mooney here in Italics*, to distinguish it from
>> comments from other Chapter leaders and from our own side.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *Dear Chantra Be,I've followed with great interest the responses from
>> Norbert Klein on the Chapter Delegates e-list. I want you to know that I
>> and many of us at ISOC have thoroughly read your original email more than
>> once and the subsequent messages from Mr. Klein. I have researched the
>> claims made regarding the correspondences between ISOC Staff and the
>> Cambodian Chapter and the outreach attempts made on both sides. It is
>> evident that Staff has a different interpretation of the data than has the
>> Chapter. It is, in my opinion therefore, not constructive to dwell on the
>> past but to address the issues raised in your message, once again. *
>> Ted Mooney refers again to outreach attempts supposedly made by ISOC staff.
>>
>> This is not the first time such claims are made, and therefore we had
>> responded:
>> - We do not know "what has been communicated to" the ISOC Senior Director,
>> Membership & Services in this respect -- but the situation continues:
>> neither the Singapore based ISOC ASIA PACIFIC staff, nor the ISOC Chapter
>> Development Manager, Asia-Pacific, nor the ISOC Senior Director,
>> Membership & Services have responded to the detailed content in the mail
>> from our Secretary...
>> *- But if such mail was sent and we did not receive it for whatever reason
>> -- it would be appropriate to share it here on the Chapters list.*
>>
>>
>> -
>> - *Instead of using this opportunity to provide copies of such mail, we
>> received again just the same baseless claims.*
>>
>>
>> More serious is that he says *"It is, in my opinion therefore, not
>> constructive to dwell on the past."* - He had criticized our sharing of
>> concerns about the non-responsiveness of ISOC staff with other Chapters and
>> the Chairperson of the ISOC Board to be unprofessional. He is continuing to
>> refuse to deal with serious problems. I repeat again our mail which related
>> to one of the two staff at the Asia Pacific Regional Office:
>>
>> = = =
>>
>>
>> *" Dear Thip,**After having received your mail, rejecting our request to
>> serious discuss the crisis for our Chapter, created as a result of the
>> general situation and legal requirements in Cambodia in the meeting, and
>> the refusal to ISOC staff to positively pay attention to our situation, we
>> do not think it would be appropriate to cooperate, as a Chapter, with
>> organizing a meeting for your 1 - 2.5 hours event, for which you would like
>> to invite the Members of the Cambodia Chapter and other non-Chapter
>> members. To discuss fundamental problems within ISOC, affecting the whole
>> membership, only among officers, as you suggest (which has been tried in
>> vain by email so far) would not be in line with our history to promote and
>> practice open communication -- high values regularly lifted up among the
>> goals of the Internet Society world wide and in its slogan: the Internet is
>> for everyone.*
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *The situation and this response has been shared and discussed with the
>> Members of the Advisory Board of our Chapter and is unanimously
>> supported.Norbert KleinPresident, ISOC-KH* The five members of our
>> Advisory Board at that time were (reflecting the stipulation of our Bylaws
>> "The Advisory Board of five members, from important sections of the ISOC
>> Cambodia Chapter membership"):
>>
>> - the Head of the IT in Education Section in the Ministry of
>> Education
>> - the Editor in Chief of a leading Cambodian daily newspaper, who
>> is at the same time President of the Club of Cambodian Journalists
>> - the President and CEO of a major broadband providing ISP
>> - a senior staff member in the office of the Council of Ministers
>> of the Government of Cambodia, and
>> - one student.
>>
>> = = =
>>
>> We do not have much confidence in regional and central staff of ISOC that
>> has damaged the formerly good name of ISOC in Cambodian society, and no
>> word is seen from them to apologize publicly or to rectify this -- but
>> instead it is considered that we are unprofessional to raise such unsolved
>> problems. We do not think it is acceptable that ISOC staff visits a
>> country, refuses to discuss the problems identified as important by a
>> Chapter, holds her own meeting to which she invited some people who said
>> they did not know an hour ago that ISOC exists -- and she encourages them to
>> become members and run for leadership in the elections one month later. And
>> senior staff of ISOC just keeps silent.
>>
>> The Documentation Center of Cambodia -www.dccam.org <http://www.dccam.org> -- has in every mail
>> originating from them the sentence:
>>
>> *"...a society cannot know itself if it does not have an accurate memory of
>> its own history."*
>>
>> The Internet Society would do well to consider this also for itself, on its
>> way into a better future.
>>
>>
>> Ted Mooney continues:
>>
>>
>> *1. Chapter by-laws. From various correspondences and information sent to
>> the Cambodia Chapter, including examples of by-laws from other chapters and
>> stated flexibility to address the local needs dating back to 2011, I would
>> like to re-iterate the flexibility of the Chapter By-laws template to
>> assure that agreed Chapter By-laws account for all local laws and special
>> circumstances with respect to jurisdiction, foreign affiliation and
>> governance.*
>> What he calls flexibility seems more to be a situation of confusion in ISOC
>> operations. It is obvious from the correspondence on the Chapters list -
>> that not all Chapters have been made to accept what is now in our Bylaws --
>> but these problematic elements continue to be on the ISOC website as
>> "mandatory" elements. And while he informs us that we are free to flexibly
>> apply the Chapters Bylaws template, at the same time "Renewal Chapter
>> Charter letters" are going out to be signed and returned by 15 December
>> 2013, including "chapter minimum standards" stating that if a Chapter does
>> not meet "one or more" a process of "rejuvenation" will be initiated.
>>
>> One Chapter chair commented: "Somehow I miss all these in the ISOC by-laws,
>> but may be someone can enlighten us?"
>>
>> There is obviously no clarity and broad agreement with Chapters at present
>> about the content and role of Chapter Bylaws, as some of the Chapter
>> Delegates mails show -- with reference to a lot of time spent for nothing in
>> the past (*highlighting added* in our quoting):
>>
>> *-------- Original Message -------- *
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *Subject: Re: [Chapter-delegates] Fwd: Renewal Internet Society Chapter
>> CharterDate: Sat, 19 Oct 2013 15:44:09 +0200From: Klaus Birkenbihl
>> <Klaus.Birkenbihl at Isoc.de> <mailto:Klaus.Birkenbihl at Isoc.de>Organization: Internet Society German Chapter
>> e.V. (ISOC.DE <http://ISOC.DE> <http://ISOC.DE> <http://ISOC.DE>)To:chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org <mailto:chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org>
>> <chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org> <mailto:chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org> <chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org <mailto:chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org>
>> <chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org> <mailto:chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org>>...I also don't foresee much change in
>> practice if we sign the letter. Nevertheless it is the wrong thing at the
>> wrong time. During the last years when chapters became more visible and
>> active we discussed so many beautiful things that could give support and
>> help to be more effective. E.g. Issue Trackers to identify issues and track
>> their resolution, Wikis to support collaboration and many other things the
>> Internet holds that other groups use to do better work. So next thing we
>> expected to see was some progress here.But instead of picking up e.g. the
>> prototype that was provided by Elena, we still lack reporting facilities
>> for projects and problems, collaboration tools, we stick to the old
>> work-intensive AMS to exchange our member data ... But what we get is another
>> version of the Letter of Affiliation.Please keep in mind: it is effort,
>> money and time that is provided by chapters members that is used to do the
>> work.Financial support by ISOC is rather marginal. (Did you e.g ever manage
>> to organize an event for $2000? For our last event even the fee for the
>> room was higher.) Knowing that ISOC lacks the budget to pay them, chapters
>> - though complaining once and a while - continue to work on this base.The
>> Letter of Association says ISOC wants you to perform such and such, wants
>> to define a maximum number of terms for office holders [is this really a
>> mission related concern?], and you need ["we believe in numbers"] to have
>> that many individual members, [can it be summed-up with corporations? - AMS
>> still don't let me report corporate members] and so forth. Read this while
>> keeping in mind that its chapters time, chapters money, chapters effort.
>> Doesn't it annoy you?I don't say we should be against the Letters of
>> Association but given the situation as it is - they should be the result of
>> negotiations and not a headquarters dictatorship.Maybe the newly to be
>> created Chapters Advisory would be the group to develop a template that
>> fulfills 2 criteria: - it is balanced in terms of responsibility and
>> control, benefit and achievements - it allow**s*
>>
>>
>>
>> * to be adjusted to needs of individual chapters (e.g. those with a
>> commercial branch, or with corporate members, or with a special focus like
>> accessibility ...)Such Letter of Association could have a real effect.Klaus*
>>
>> *=*
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *2. The Chapter Administrative Support Working Group is now meeting
>> regularly to discuss various ways to address Chapter issues regarding
>> operational resources. As you have noted from the discussion in this email
>> forum, there is a wide disparity of views and therefore, multiple solutions
>> may be piloted.It is regrettable that this has not come together as quickly
>> as the Cambodia Chapter has needed, so we hope that you will reconsider
>> your voluntary de-chartering until there are more widely available support
>> options for you to evaluate. Please do keep in mind that
>> local self-sufficiency will always be a key component of any operations
>> resource strategy.*
>> While local self-sufficiency is a broadly understandable principle, the way
>> this issue has been treated so far seems to have seen this as a financial
>> affair. We have not seen response to the much more complex situation, where
>> many people in Cambodia have, over the years and again recently, been
>> self-sufficient in providing their energy, their health, their freedom, and
>> in some cases their lives in the struggle for justice and in the struggle
>> to be free to communicate about it. A lot of public support, legal
>> assistance, and care for victims, is however not based on local finances,
>> but is provided by organizations and institutions extending external
>> solidarity funding support.
>>
>> We have shared information that communication technology and information
>> networks are fairly well developed in Cambodia and there are working
>> groups, regular activities, IXPs, organized structures, Barcamps (the most
>> recent one a week ago with more than 2000 participants) -- quite a number of
>> the ISOC Cambodia Chapter members provided leadership in these fields. Our
>> inquiry if ISOC could financially assist in setting up and initially
>> operating an office was clearly related to the specific government
>> regulations (*following the ISOC staff guided Bylaw: "The Chapter shall be
>> established as a non-profit organization under the laws of Cambodia"*).
>>
>> If ISOC staff considers financial *"local self-sufficiency [...] always be
>> a key component of any operations resource strategy"* we are out for the
>> time being.
>>
>> One comment on the Chapter list had said there is no need for us to defend
>> ourselves -- ISOC staff may have to defend themselves instead. We leave this
>> open -- but if anybody is interested in our context, you may find some more
>> information about local contributions at the Annex at the end of our
>> Documentation to be sent out separately. This material -- voices from the
>> Chapters - may be of value for the work following a recent ISOC Board
>> decision that "acknowledged the right of Chapters to form an advisory
>> group."
>>
>>
>> *3. We once again call upon the Cambodia Chapter to a) participate with
>> ISOC staff in a conference call to speak forthrightly about the issues you
>> raise, b) participate in the regularly scheduled Asia Chapter Webex calls
>> in which most other Asia chapters are now participating. Regarding, a)
>> above, we have noted your concern that many Cambodia Chapter officers
>> cannot attend a call at one time for work-related and other obligations.
>> We are very willing to have multiple calls to accommodate various
>> schedules and to be held at times that allow as many officers to attend as
>> possible.*
>> We did not participate lately in such conference calls or webinars as our
>> experience over the years is that such talks did not lead to much results.
>> Especially multiple sessions on the same subject ended up with open
>> questions: What was really discussed or decided? Email exchanges leave much
>> clearer records.
>>
>>
>> *On another note, there is currently a Chapter workshop in Bali ahead of
>> the IGF. I hope the Cambodian representative will take the opportunity to
>> speak to Naveed ul Haq, Chapter Development Manager for Asia, Joyce Dogniez
>> Director of Chapter Development and Raj Singh our Regional Bureau Director.
>> Such a conversation presents an additional opportunity to resolve timing
>> conflicts and help us all get to a resolution of the issues.*
>> Ted Mooney added:
>>
>>
>> *"This is unfortunate as there is a travel fellowship available for the
>> each Asia Chapter to attend in which expenses are covered. My assumption
>> was that surely you would take advantage of such funding from ISOC
>> particularly when your representative would have a forum with ISOC
>> executives in which to discuss your specific issue. Why did you chose not
>> to attend?"*
>> The fact that intensive communication on the Chapter list, with several
>> calls from various Chapter leaders calling on ISOC staff -- central and
>> regional -- to respond to the contents of our mail did not result in such
>> responses, was not an indication that to meet in Bali would provide the
>> practical and timely responses we were hoping for. We did not want to ask
>> for such international travel support for one person to talk to ISOC staff
>> traveling to Bali to talk about things for which the 90 ISOC staff and
>> advisors could not organize written responses in the months and weeks
>> before.
>>
>> And finally, Ted Mooney said:
>>
>>
>> *"Also, I think we needn't burden Chapter Delegates with a lengthy and
>> hopefully fruitful conversation between us in email. I will no longer be
>> posting my responses to you to the entire list." *
>> Here the ISOC Senior Director, Membership & Services, is obviously not in
>> line with the many Chapter leaders who were interested and did actively
>> participate in the related discussions on the Chapters list. As Ousmane
>> MOUSSA TESSA from the Niger Chapter wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *Hi all,+1 Veni! [Bulgaria]In my previous mail I tried to share a quiet
>> simple idea of the "ecosystem" of ISOC. Veni summarized what this ecosystem
>> must be. I'm just thinking it just a global decentralized process, as
>> Chapters don't be considered as "subsidiaries" of company with an HQ and
>> Board of Trustees!BTW, I agree 200% with Veni about the fact, and keeping
>> in mind that "the strength of a chain is based on the quality of its
>> weakest link". Hence, let's support each other to move steadily and forward
>> a visible thread, so even the newcomers can jump easy in one the various
>> wagons of ISOC.Keep on talking, talking again, in the only aim to ... to
>> sharpen our current and future actions and overcome inherent difficulties
>> of our Global "institution".All the bestOusmaneNiger Chapter*
>> We continue to share our communication.
>>
>>
>> We are committed to the "basic values" for which many persons around the
>> world became members of the ISOC -- and it is our assumption that many of
>> our present Chapter members may want to continue to be members of ISOC, for
>> which they had to sign up before being able to become members of a chapter.
>>
>> Probably there will also be an informal fellowship of "Friends of the
>> Internet in Cambodia" - and there may be interest in the future to see how
>> the recent decisions of the ISOC Board that affirmed the role of chapters
>> in the governance and mission of the Internet Society will work out,
>> especially when a Chapters Advisory Group will have done its work and
>> hopefully the clarification of the role and relation of staff and chapters
>> may lead to a new start of ISOC.
>>
>>
>> Be Chantra
>>
>> chantra.be at gmail.com <mailto:chantra.be at gmail.com> (still)
>> Secretary of the ISOC Cambodia Chapter until this announcement is
>> sent out.
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed
>> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
>> Chapter Portal (AMS):https://portal.isoc.org
>
>
> --
> David Solomonoff, President
> Internet Society of New York
> president at isoc-ny.org <mailto:president at isoc-ny.org>
> isoc-ny.org <http://isoc-ny.org>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically
> subscribed
> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet
> Society
> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed
> to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
> Chapter Portal (AMS): https://portal.isoc.org
--
Best,
Veni Markovski
http://www.veni.com
https://www.facebook.com/venimarkovski
https://twitter.com/veni
The opinions expressed above are those of the
author, not of any organizations, associated
with or related to him in any given way.
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