[Chapter-delegates] ISOC Bylaws Working Group (BLWG)

Tue May 7 20:16:03 PDT 2013

Grigori

I believe you are exalting form over function.  Veni is correct.  There is no way the bylaws (or whatever other documentation is involved in organizing a group) would "copy" ISOC's bylaws. The question is what form the affiliation with ISOC can take under local law. Naturally ISOC has the right to require some minimum for group to call itself an ISOC Chapter. There are provisions that ISOC requires to be included in a Chapter's bylaws or organization documents.  I am not certain as to what extent these are negotiable to comply with local conditions.  In some instances, presumably, the barriers to any such minimum requirements could be so great that it would be impossible to create a Chapter in any form. 

ISOC Bylaws define Chapters (taken from a version of the Bylaws for discussion).

Internet Society Chapters are groups organized by ISOC individual members (Article V) who share an interest and belief in the Society’s principles and mission, acting according to the Society’s standards of performance. 

Nothing in here about the exact legal form such "organized groups" must take.

At least with respect to the DC Chapter, whose Bylaws I drafted, there is no written requirement that members of the DC Chapter be global members of ISOC.  There is a requirement that we accept global members who wish to join unless we have a good reason to reject them.  We were free to define who are members eligible to vote. I see no written restriction requiring our members to be global members.  Perhaps there is something somewhere else in ISOC that has that requirement.

Your Chapter is in existence and recognized, to the best of my knowledge, so I am uncertain the reason for all your concern.  But then I have nit been party to any conversations you have had with the staff.

If the DC Chapter were to take positions or actions contrary to those of ISOC, we agree in our Bylaws that we would have no right to be a ISOC Chapter. We would continue to exist as a legal entity. 

I note as always that I am not legal counsel to ISOC (just to the DC Chapter) and I am not an insider as to the processes and requirements for forming a Chapter otter than what I experienced in chartering the DC Chapter.

Perhaps others have had similar experiences as Grigori.  they should weigh in.

John More

On May 7, 2013, at 9:00 PM, Veni Markovski <veni at veni.com> wrote:

> Grigori,
> I think you are not right -
> every chapter has different by-laws from the ones of ISOC HQ. What you are saying is impossible - there's no way for 100+ chapters to have by-laws copying the ones of a US-based non-profit. It just doesn't work.
> The chapter is a temporary status, while ISOC.am is for long term. If tomorrow ISOC HQ disappears, ISOC.am will continue to exist, and - hopefully! - flourish. And vice versa.
> As for the members - again, your by-laws can figure out what to do with global members, who don't pay membership fee to your chapter. Whether they pay to ISOC.org, it doesn't concern you.
> 
> v.
> 
> On 05/07/2013 19:27, Grigori Saghyan wrote:
>> Veni,
>> it is impossible. Otherwise ISOC.AM will not be an ISOC Chapter -
>> according to ISOC global bylaws. If we shall have our by laws, different
>> form ISOC global bylaws, we shall be an independent  structure, not ISOC
>> Chapter. But we have our bylaws - according to the local law, and we do
>> not ask for our members to register themselves in ISOC Global as a members.
>> I think this contradiction is necessary to resolve.
>> Grigori Sahyhan
>> ISOC.AM
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 08.05.2013 2:46, Veni Markovski wrote:
>>> That's up to you to figure it out in your by-laws.
>>> 
>>> On Tuesday, May 7, 2013, Grigori Saghyan wrote:
>>> 
>>>     Veni,
>>>     if Chapters are independent, legal (or not), why Chapter members at
>>>     first, as a per-condition, have  to register themselves (or with local
>>>     Chapter management assistance) on ISOC Global IMS as a member ?
>>>     Grigori Saghyan
>>>     ISOC.AM <http://ISOC.AM>
>>> 
>>>     On 08.05.2013 2:27, Veni Markovski wrote:
>>>     > Grisha,
>>>     > That's an easy one: they are independent legal (or not) bodies. They
>>>     > can't be anything else.
>>>     >
>>>     > On Tuesday, May 7, 2013, Grigori Saghyan wrote:
>>>     >
>>>     >     This a the main question -who are ISOC Chapters?
>>>     >     Branches? Subsidiaries?  Daughter  companies of ISOC Global?
>>>     Something
>>>     >     flexible? Independent organizations according to the local laws?
>>>     >     Grigori Saghyan
>>>     >     ISOC.AM <http://ISOC.AM> <http://ISOC.AM>
>>>     >
>>>     >     On 08.05.2013 1:52, Maureen Hilyard wrote:
>>>     >     > So how are we defined
>>>     >
>>>     >
>>>     >     --
>>>     >     Grigori Saghyan
>>>     >     PGP Key ID: 0x48E4D5DC
>>>     >
>>>     >
>>>     >
>>>     > --
>>>     > Best,
>>>     > Veni
>>>     > http://veni.com
>>>     > https://facebook.com/venimarkovski
>>>     > https://twitter.com/veni
>>>     >
>>>     > ***
>>>     > The opinions expressed above are those of
>>>     > the author, not of any organizations,
>>>     > associated with or related to him in
>>>     > any given way.
>>>     > ***
>>>     >
>>>     >
>>>     > == Sent from my phone, so any spelling mistakes are caused by the
>>>     > touchscreen keyboard. That's a nice excuse, isn't it;-)
>>>     >
>>> 
>>> 
>>>     --
>>>     Grigori Saghyan
>>>     PGP Key ID: 0x48E4D5DC
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Best,
>>> Veni
>>> http://veni.com
>>> https://facebook.com/venimarkovski
>>> https://twitter.com/veni
>>> 
>>> ***
>>> The opinions expressed above are those of
>>> the author, not of any organizations,
>>> associated with or related to him in
>>> any given way.
>>> ***
>>> 
>>> 
>>> == Sent from my phone, so any spelling mistakes are caused by the
>>> touchscreen keyboard. That's a nice excuse, isn't it;-)
>>> 
>> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> Best,
> Veni Markovski
> http://www.veni.com
> https://www.facebook.com/venimarkovski
> https://twitter.com/veni
> 
> The opinions expressed above are those of the
> author, not of any organizations, associated
> with or related to him in any given way.
> 
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