[Chapter-delegates] LoA for good or bad?
John More
morej1 at mac.com
Wed Mar 28 08:40:05 PDT 2012
Eric
It is not true that advocacy groups with chapters that have staffing (including staffing trained and seconded by the central organization) require centralized control. Physicians for Social Responsibility seems to have local operations not directly controlled in everything they do. In the US, Sierra Club Chapters and the IAF do not control their local chapters -- except as to consistency with the positions of the national.
So I think strengthening Chapters with staffing and other resources (while requiring that the Chapters must themselves raise money -- see workshops at Geneva on the subject) is consistent with a certain level of autonomy.
Finally, in réponse to CW, whether or not there is tons of cash from PIR, there must be some responsibility for raising funds locally for operations. Let the PIR funds be used for projects that the local Chapter is able to originate and maintain when they are stronger.
John
On Mar 28, 2012, at 11:20 AM, Christopher Wilkinson wrote:
> Well, Eric, I really don't know where to begin to reply to you. Are you on a different planet?
>
> 1. Please do not assimilate the Internet Society to the Trustees and staff. Many of us would not agree. The Internet Society is much broader than that.
>
> 2. The Internet Society's income from PIR (indirectly from all *.org registrants) does not "belong" to the ISOC staff. The relevant Internet community is much wider than that.
>
> 3. There is no question of funding of Chapters or Regional Bureaus becoming an instrument of centralisation. On the contrary:
> The Executive Committees of the Chapters should manage their (small) staff.
> The Regional Bureaus should be accountable to the ISOC members in their regions.
>
> 4. Although I would, personally, support increased local funding from the members of Chapters, wherever possible, there are two problems:
>
> - individual members already pay their subscriptions to ISOC (e.g. as in a sustaining member ... ) but their home Chapter sees nothing of that.
>
> - the aggregate ISOC budget is now so large (and spent in such an indefensible way) that it is politically impossible to make the case for greater local funding, until that anomaly has been resolved.
>
> Having decided in principle not to comment further until the BoT issues the proposals for new Bylaws and a redistribution of the Trustees, I will leave it at that, for now.
>
> Regards,
>
> CW
>
>
> On 28 Mar 2012, at 16:24, Eric Burger wrote:
>
>> This is an important point. There is something that I do not understand.
>>
>> What is the distinction between a chapter funded by ISOC and a branch office of ISOC? John and Eduard explicitly mentions ISOC as a worldwide NGO, and a handful of people on the list +1'ed the concept. When I think of a worldwide NGO, I think of paid staff, every office is under the direct control of headquarters, and there may be a volunteer or two helping the NGO out. An example here would be Médecins Sans Frontières, where the doctors are essentially staff, sent into the field. The field offices are literally field offices of MSF. They may or may not have local employees, as needed.
>>
>> I am under the belief that ISOC is more of a grass-roots organization. Like-minded people get together, usually regionally or around some other common interest. Is it your desire to move to a centrally-administered model? For me, I would not want ISOC-DC under the direct management of ISOC HQ. There are things ISOC-DC does that we do that ISOC HQ, or a branch office of ISOC, to do. As a recent example, imagine if some of the folks from ISOC NY were receiving ISOC HQ funds. When the story of Paul broke, instead of us showing our strength in the ability of the ISOC NY leadership to speak their mind, they would be seen as bad, soon to be ex-, employees of ISOC. I know I do not want something like that to happen to my chapter. Is that really what you want?
>>
>> I have another question. Are there countries where the regulatory or legal environment prevents individuals or entities from raising funds for the operation of a non-profit, yet will allow a branch office to open? If that is the case, I can see a place for ISOC providing funding, using a grant model, to get the organization started.
>>
>> In my travels around the world to chapters in North America, Europe, Asia, Africa, and Latin America (sorry, I haven't made it yet to South America), I have seen chapters that manage to find funds from sponsorship (North America, Europe), charging for membership and getting big corporate sponsorships (North America and Europe), government and corporate sponsorships (Europe and Africa), program grants and local grants (Africa), and chapter program revenue. For example, one of the African chapters raises its entire budget from selling coffee at local meetings. If a chapter needs funding for a project or program, we have the Community Grant Programme, However, if a chapter needs continuous funding for operations, then either that chapter is really an ISOC office or the chapter does not have the local support to be sustainable.
>>
>> On Mar 28, 2012, at 3:13 PM, John More wrote:
>>
>>> Norbert and Veni 1+
>>>
>>> Having paid staff and an office are essential tools for any successful chapter in any worldwide NGO, such as ISOC. Volunteers are essential for leadership and contacts, etc., but without staff to plan for and carry out events on an ongoing basis and to supplement the efforts of volunteers who often must manage their businesses and jobs, the chapter cannot really be that effective. One successful model is for the central organization to train interns and then second them.
>>>
>>> I have previously put forward the importance of paid staff. Naturally the availability of funding (and training) is important for Chapters located in regions with fewer resources. At the same time, it should be a requirement that the Chapter raise some money (even a nominal amount). Charity is not a good model. No financial contribution, no ownership -- a primary principal of organizing.
>>>
>>> John More
>>>
>>> ISOC-DC
>>>
>>> On Mar 28, 2012, at 3:15 AM, Veni Markovski wrote:
>>>
>>>> Correct. We got also additional support through the Global Internet Policy Initiative - a program ISOC should have been funding today, as they stopped functioning because of lack of money. It was through GIPI that we got the legal expertise we needed about 10 years ago, and support for going to meetings, etc.
>>>> Worth considering from Isoc.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Btw, it seems we are sharing here ideas how not only to make Isoc better, but to make it a great organization. It would be good to see some follow up on those ideas. They are based on experience from many chapters, different cultures, etc., and could be perhaps the missing part at Isoc.
>>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, March 28, 2012, Eduard Tric wrote:
>>>> +1 here , too.
>>>> When we were proposed to start a Romanian chapter long time ago, i've asked a friend , chair at that time of another chapter , what do we need to run a chapter, the answer was "energy and a mailing list" .
>>>> We still have the energy , but wee needed more than the mailing list to function , it was an investment so far : office space (people like also to have physical meetings ) , internet , electricity. Having all that + energy was still not enoug , for years Isoc Romania was more a club of Internet enthusiasts running Internet -related projects than a well-known and respected local NGO.
>>>> The boost in terms of awareness was the Inet Bucharest and our bold position and initiative on ACTA issue.
>>>> Now we are well known,it's a fact.
>>>> To become respected, we need (at least ) : synchronization with other chapters and HQ , especially on policies issues, and yes, some funding to run the chapter (especially the legal part of our actions is very costly , we cannot be efficient on policies without a local lawyer support ).
>>>> Regads,
>>>> Ed
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Veni Markovski" <veni at veni.com>
>>>> To: president at isoc-kh.org
>>>> Cc: chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2012 9:37:27 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Chapter-delegates] LoA for good or bad?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Norbert, +1.
>>>> Isoc Bulgaria started being active, when we got some funding. Before that it was mainly thanks to the efforts of the board members, who were spending their own money and time to keep the chapter moving. If I wasn't a CEO of an ISP, and co-founder, AND my business partner wouldn't have agreed to let me allocate the time for that... I wouldn't be even on this list now.
>>>> Paid staff brought the chapter in another dimension. Our committed, humble and totally workohollic people are known to many of you. Julia and Dessi have made wonderful things at Isoc BG and continue doing them.
>>>> But I've argued many years ago that Isoc HQ could afford pay staff at chapters, which would have.made the chapters stronger. HQ chose a different path, and so far they've used only one person from the chapters world - Jacek, who is now working for Isoc. The regional directors are a good idea, but they need more support - from the chapters to do their job. And that's a problem, as you properly point out, chapters don't have staff to work for free. So, a suggestion might be for HQ to create a pool for supporting not just projects, but chapters personnel hiring. My bet is that on average $ 10,000 per chapter will be enough. Average, because some don't need it, and some need only $ 1,000 per year.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> V.
>>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, March 28, 2012, President ISOC-KH wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 03/27/2012 05:33 PM, Victor Ndonnang wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dear Norbert,
>>>>
>>>> Thank you very much for your message. Talking about building up a Chapter, supporting its growth and making it sustainable, many Chapters are in the same situation that you are describing. It is easy to recruit volunteers members for the Chapter but very few of those members are prepared to do mandatory work of the Chapter for nothing (unpaid). From developing world perspective, It is also very difficult to recruit members and ask them to pay (membership fees) for doing unpaid work for the Chapter.
>>>>
>>>> I hope all this will be taken into consideration in the LoA introduction process. Globally from my personal view, the LoA is not a bad thing.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks one again.
>>>>
>>>> Best regards,
>>>> Victor
>>>>
>>>> Dear Victor,
>>>>
>>>> thanks for your response, sharing information about similar problems when developing a new chapter in a difficult economic environment. You understand our situation, as I understand yours.
>>>>
>>>> We all just got a reminder mail about the deadline for submitting applications for Community Grants.
>>>>
>>>> We will not submit a request – we had made preparations last year, but had to move towards applications in 2012, as our Secretary found it too difficult to line up the precise detailed data much ahead of time; we hoped to be able to assemble them on the way towards two mayor events. But our Secretary resigned, and it seems to be extremely difficult to find an – unpaid – replacement.
>>>>
>>>> I am not arguing against a program for well designed grants with elaborate reporting structures etc. But as far as I can see, there are no Chapter Support grants, only for “projects.”
>>>>
>>>> This is true also for the Information Society Innovation Fund (ISIF) aiming at stimulating creative solutions to ICT development needs in the Asia Pacific region.
>>>>
>>>> The ISIF objectives list, among others: “Successful and sustainable models for the provision of Internet services.”
>>>>
>>>> But how could a young Chapter work on such objectives without a basis in the form of a small secretariat with at least one paid staff, working on the maintenance and development of the Chapter?
>>>>
>>>> The present Cambodia model for Internet service providing is to have 10 or 12 (changing frequently) ISPs competing in a tiny market (but the authorities prevent real market-based solutions by administrative interventions, protecting some turfs, not allowing price based competition). - Some of our members are discussing this; but the volatile situation, with frequently changing challenges which would call for quick responses, can hardly be met without a flexibly organized secretariat. - Our March ISOC Monthly Newsletter gives an example how we are till able to act strategically, having established a bit of a reputation, in a way which never could have been part of “project” planning.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Norbert
>>>>
>>>> -----Message d'origine-----
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> De : chapter-delegates-bounces at elists.isoc.org [mailto: cha--
>>>> Best,
>>>> Veni
>>>>
>>>> == Sent from my phone, so any spelling mistakes are caused by the touchscreen keyboard. That's a nice excuse, isn't it;-)
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Eduard Tric ,CEO, Axetel
>>>> I encrypt therefore I am.
>>>> http://www.axetel.com
>>>> eduard at axetel.com
>>>> tel: +40740300740
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> DD;;
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>>>> We know, DD :;;
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>>>> ,;DG including yours.
>>>>
>>>> 6839f52116af1166f4a01e64ad209459f17ecc995c1456a68c7040072a9a58d6
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Best,
>>>> Veni
>>>> == Sent from my phone, so any spelling mistakes are caused by the touchscreen keyboard. That's a nice excuse, isn't it;-)
>>>>
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