[Chapter-delegates] How can ISOC chapters help in the development of IP-based networks?

Wed Dec 15 22:01:21 PST 2010

Let me say I agree with you here on several points.

1) it's about making the Internet work better and be more accessible for more people. 
2) It's not "us vs them" in any sense. Where I get wary is when people have different objectives than I do (see item 1), objectives that are less altruistic and more self-serving. But if we can work together on a common objective, so be it.
3) Cisco works with anyone it perceives to be working on an objective it can support. Yes, that can be confusing, especially because sometimes we're wrong or do things in a less-than-clueful way. Color us human.

Let me tell a story. In 2002-2005, I worked off and on with Makerere University in Uganda, with Cisco, with UNDP, and with USAID, to develop what came to be called a "Faculty in Information Technology" - a school that is turning out engineers to operate networks and develop technology in Eastern Africa. That started with an award - recognition I was given for my work in the IETF by Cisco - which was used as a poker chip to get cooperation from the public sector. The partnership worked very well, and I got to speak at the graduation of the first 42 CCNPs from the school. In 2002, while we encouraged people to set up educational programs, we privately worried that there would be no jobs for the graduates when they were done. Of those 42, 2/3 had jobs the day they graduated.I was very proud of the students and the faculty, and glad to be a part of that.

Cisco has also worked with various agencies in a number of programs in developing countries where things have not worked out as well, and where it turned out that objectives were misaligned or money was misused. That kind of outcome makes everyone upset.

See bullet (1). ISOC tries, Cisco tries, and each of us individually and in our various groups tries. See bullet (1).

On Dec 15, 2010, at 5:43 PM, Alejandro Pisanty wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> there are no ITU representatives. There are people in governments, as well as companies, who are representatives to the ITU. Some of them do become standard-bearers for the ITU. Some, in turn among these, tend to have their eyes and ears close to the Internet. Telecommunications policy and business are different.
> 
> That said, we can understand the ITU better.
> 
> When the ITU starts a project in a country it has allies in the country. some of these projects are good and some even go beyond extending infrastructure and training for telecommunications and allow Internet access and use. This is not always intentional.
> 
> Some projects are like setting up training in developing countries. Some of these are supported by Cisco. Many academic communities don't agree with them because they put aside some fundamental knowledge and are too much oriented to the company's product. We have discussed this with Fred Baker and others in Cisco over the years. The participation of companies like Cisco in both the Internet and the telecommunications field creates some confusion.
> 
> Our work must be for the growth of the Internet - take it to everyone possible, make it usable, make it used. We have to care about standards, interoperability, openness, access to information and to all (legal) resources available over the Internet. We have to try to avoid or stop misguided policies and programs which try to regulate and limit technology when they are trying to regulate people's conduct.
> 
> If part or all of an ITU-driven project fits into these goals, fine. We are not in a fight with the ITU. What we care about is the Internet.
> 
> Yours,
> 
> Alejandro Pisanty
> 
> 
> .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  . .  .  .  .  .  .
>     Dr. Alejandro Pisanty
> UNAM, Av. Universidad 3000, 04510 Mexico DF Mexico
> 
> Tels. +52-(1)-55-5105-6044, +52-(1)-55-5418-3732
> 
> * Mi blog/My blog: http://pisanty.blogspot.com
> * LinkedIn profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/pisanty
> * Twitter: http://twitter.com/apisanty
> * Unete al grupo UNAM en LinkedIn, http://www.linkedin.com/e/gis/22285/4A106C0C8614
> 
> * Ven a ISOC Mexico, http://www.isoc.org.mx, ISOC http://www.isoc.org
> *Participa en ICANN, http://www.icann.org
> .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .
> 
> 
> On Thu, 16 Dec 2010, Grigori Saghyan wrote:
> 
>> Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2010 01:21:27 +0500
>> From: Grigori Saghyan <gregor at arminco.com>
>> To: chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org
>> Subject: Re: [Chapter-delegates] How can ISOC chapters help in the development
>>     of IP-based networks?
>> Dear All,
>> fully support Veni's suggestion.
>> It is very hard process, in each country ITU representative is a governmental organization.
>> They have serious problem - they do not have qualified staff, even more, they do not have anybody, who is able to understand modern challenges.
>> In this situation any normal suggestion from local ISOC chapter can be very important for government, they need any  feedback from ISOC.
>> Let me ask once more - let us prepare suggestions, recommendations  for local ITU representatives. Without such recommendations ISOC policy is a criticism without suggestions.
>> With respect,
>> Grigori Saghyan
>> ISOC.AM
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 15.12.2010 18:19, Veni Markovski wrote:
>>> Hi.
>>> Changing the subject, I'd like to draw everyone's attention to a vital part of the ITU Plenipot 2010 resolutions, the words "including, but not limited to".
>>> The Internet-related resolutions resolved that the ITU should
>>> 1. explore ways and means for greater collaboration and coordination between ITU and
>>> relevant organizations* involved in the development of IP-based networks and the future Internet,
>>> through cooperation agreements, as appropriate, in order to increase the role of ITU in Internet
>>> governance so as to ensure maximum benefits to the global community
>>> * Including, but not limited to ICANN, the RIRs, the IETF, ISOC and W3C, on the basis of reciprocity
>>> basis.
>>> Now, my suggestion for the chapters is to see which one of you can get involved in the work the ITU does, as the resolution calls for the ITU to engage through cooperation agreements, etc., and since the words only name some of the organizations, it does not exclude the others, quite the contrary - it includes them. If any chapter has the capacity to work in the areas, covered by Resolution 101, 102, 133, then it should approach the ITU - via its regional offices, or via the national representative (usually Ministry of Communications), and see what you could do to promote the development of IP-based networks.
>>> best,
>>> Veni
>>> On 12/15/2010 03:16, Patrick Vande Walle wrote:
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>> 
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