[Chapter-delegates] OneWebDay 2009 - tomorrow 22 September

[James Butler]

Alejandro,

Thanks for putting the smile in my morning. :)

As a member of a "technical elite" society, I believe that it is
incumbent on such societies to protect those who do not share in our
expertise when their experience with the systems under our care would be
impacted by decisions we make. As it is incumbent on an association of
plumbers to abide by both established safe and fair practices and the
spirit of changes to those practices that may be under consideration, so
it is for us.

The society itself is defined by the actions of its members and the
respect and care for non-member stakeholders that it exhibits.

I believe that OUR Society has always acted in a neutral, positive
manner that has only benefited our non-member stakeholders. Therefore,
in the absence of proof of malicious intent, I think that to imply, as
the disputed passage does, that the entities that cooperate in the
development and management of virtually every public infrastructure is
the work of people with evil intent is (a) inaccurate and (b) an attempt
to paint the cooperative efforts with a practically meaningless brush.

Ergo, it is not basis for an effective argument and should not be a key
part of any statement issued under official ISOC cover. It's an appeal
to base emotional responses, rather than to rational thought. A Society
of the "technical elite" should be able to make its arguments based on fact.

James Butler

Alejandro Pisanty wrote:
> James,
>
> thanks for moving the debate forward on this interesting and important
> issue.
>
> Let's take your argument a step further, since you do provide a way to
> gain insights. Let's say there was indeed the claim that "technical
> elites are making decisions about the plumbing system" and you had to
> decide whether to sign a pledge premised on that assumption.
>
> BUT you were a member of, say, the American Society for Testing
> Materials, ASTM, or of the National Institute of Standards and
> Technology (NIST), or of the many organizations outside the US that
> have to do with standards that affect plumbing.
>
> You would have to be quite convinced that your own society is in a
> cabal with the most evil forces aiming to destroy the future of
> plumbing in order to sign, right?
>
> Alejandro Pisanty
>
>
> .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  . .  .  .  . 
> .  .
>      Dr. Alejandro Pisanty
> UNAM, Av. Universidad 3000, 04510 Mexico DF Mexico
>
> Tels. +52-(1)-55-5105-6044, +52-(1)-55-5418-3732
>
> * Mi blog/My blog: http://pisanty.blogspot.com
> * LinkedIn profile: http://www.linkedin.com/in/pisanty
> * Twitter: http://twitter.com/apisanty
> * Unete al grupo UNAM en LinkedIn,
> http://www.linkedin.com/e/gis/22285/4A106C0C8614
>
> * Ven a ISOC Mexico, http://www.isoc.org.mx, ISOC http://www.isoc.org
> *Participa en ICANN, http://www.icann.org
> .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  . 
> .  .  .
>
>
> On Tue, 22 Sep 2009, James Butler wrote:
>
>> Date: Tue, 22 Sep 2009 18:27:17 -0700
>> From: James Butler <jbutler at isoc-la.org>
>> Cc: Chapter Delegates <chapter-delegates at elists.isoc.org>
>> Subject: Re: [Chapter-delegates] OneWebDay 2009 - tomorrow 22 September
>>
>> Let's see how that passage fares with a different subject, just to
>> make sure it's a valid complaint:
>>
>> "Right now, governments, corporate entities and technical elites
>> decide the fate of the most powerful, inclusive PLUMBING SYSTEM ever
>> created. They're making decisions about who will have access, at what
>> speeds, and at what price. They're deciding how to invest in training
>> and education in 21st century PLUMBING."
>>
>> Why, yes they are. In fact, this passage is pretty standard stuff
>> with regard to any infrastructure, when taken on its own. Roadways,
>> television, water distribution, telephones, real estate and more ...
>> all being managed end-to-end by "governments, corporate entities and
>> technical elites", albeit without the conspiratorial theme.
>>
>> This is not the basis for an effective argument. If that passage
>> represents any kind of key principle, perhaps the "pledge" should be
>> reconsidered in its entirety by its publishers?
>>
>> James Butler
>>
>>
>> Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond wrote:
>>>
>>> "Alejandro Pisanty" <apisan at servidor.unam.mx> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Can someone among the Chapter Delegates kindly explain to me why we
>>>> support OneWebDay while it circulates a "pledge against the digital
>>>> divide" that contains wording which is directly hostile to ISOC,
>>>> the IETF, and other organizations ISOC supports?
>>>>
>>>> I quote: "Right now, governments, corporate entities and technical
>>>> elites decide the fate of the most powerful, inclusive
>>>> communications platform ever created. They're making decisions
>>>> about who will have access, at what speeds, and at what price.
>>>> They're deciding how to invest in training and education in 21st
>>>> century communications."
>>>
>>> It looks like they got a bit carried away with their language,
>>> doesn't it?
>>> Several such groups have recently put out petitions about Network
>>> Neutrality & other contentious and complex issues. In most cases,
>>> the wording of their text left much to be desired due to unfortunate
>>> amalgamation of targets, probably caused by hasty wording and not
>>> enough feedback prior to putting the petition out.
>>>
>>> We know the jist of what they mean. I believe that we generally
>>> support their point of view. But their inaccurate statements does
>>> weaken their stance. Yes, the statement, as displayed on the OWD
>>> site is ill-written.
>>>
>>> I guess everybody can't be as perfect in their statements as ISOC. :-)
>>>
>>> Kind regards,
>>>
>>> Olivier
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