<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:#000000">perhaps we should separate the live component from the curation one?</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:#000000">In any case, Joly probably can only do this work if it generates sufficient income.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:#000000">Project-basis can make sense if the supplier has enough business that a per-project average charge could be computed. One could key the average charge to the number of hours of video involved, for example. If per-project process leaves the supplier unsure of income, I can imagine the supplier might look elsewhere for work. Of course, averaging means that some projects will take more work than others, independent of the hours of video processed. These kinds of averages only work if the law of large numbers works on your behalf. </div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:#000000">v</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:#000000"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:#000000"><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, Sep 16, 2024 at 6:56 PM Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com">ocl@gih.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><u></u>
<div>
Dear Vint,<br>
<br>
You have accurately identified the true cost of the ISOC.LIVE
service: the extensive hours dedicated to preparation, promotion,
post-production, transcription, and archiving of events. In fact,
the "live" component is a cost-saving measure, as it eliminates the
need for multiple camera feeds and allows for real-time switching. I
would challenge anyone who claims that an event recorded with a
single, wide-angle camera shot is an engaging representation of the
event.<br>
<br>
Regarding the proposal to switch to project-based support, Joly has
consistently explained why this approach is impractical. The
preparation required for events and the limited funds available from
the Internet Society Foundation to support such activities are
significant constraints. If the objective were to make it
exceedingly difficult for the Chapter community to record, produce,
and archive its own content, then switching to project-based support
would indeed be an effective deterrent.<br>
<br>
Kindest regards,<br>
<br>
Olivier<br>
<br>
<div>On 16/09/2024 17:34, vinton cerf wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)">Just
thinking out loud for a moment. The support for live streaming
had several consequences, I think. The first was access to the
live event. My guess is that most chapter events have
relatively modest attendance that is probably within the
capacity of the conferencing tool (zoom, teams, meet, etc) to
record, so "live reach" is likely not the most important
aspect of streaming. The second utility is post-hoc editing
and curation. That could be done with any recording including
one supported by the conferencing application - but the work
of editing, sound improvement, captioning (??), archiving is
in addition to the live stream. Would the new "project based"
funding model provide for these services? Would chapters have
to apply for project-based support? Would they have to pay for
them themselves (that's always an option, of course)? Could
they apply for project support from ISOC?</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)">vint</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;color:rgb(0,0,0)"><br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, Sep 16, 2024 at
12:15 PM b1harlem nyc via Chapter-delegates <<a href="mailto:chapter-delegates@elists.isoc.org" target="_blank">chapter-delegates@elists.isoc.org</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="auto">Suggest there is merit in advocacy for
programs needed by the group...no amount of intellectual
explaining will overcome the reality that the Chapters and
its Members understand the communities and the needs better
then most..To decide on some self impose metric by a Staff
member no matter how well meaning ..is the way towards the
kinds of disagreement that
<div dir="auto">are luguburious at best.<br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">The idea/notion that the Chapters have to
compete against themselves and others for resources and
then have non volunteers decided who gets those
resources and determine what chapter members service are
not worthy is not a ideal way to work with a world wide
<a href="http://team.it" target="_blank">team.it</a> says here....</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">Item last..</div>
<div dir="auto">It's not about the number of live stream
viewers concurrent on a stream ...it's not even about
the archival of the streams..it's more about
documentation of the efforts and opportunities
presented through the live streaming that is the most
effectual way to move information around the internet
sans the traditional gate keepers and here, somehow
that's being missed....the internet is for everyone no
matter how, no matter what ,no matter who..I join the
society because I believe that</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">Doug Frazier </div>
<div dir="auto"> Proud Nyc Chapter Board Member </div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, Sep 16, 2024,
11:40 Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond via Chapter-delegates <<a href="mailto:chapter-delegates@elists.isoc.org" target="_blank">chapter-delegates@elists.isoc.org</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div> Dear Ted,<br>
<br>
Thank you for your response. Given your valid point
regarding the openness of the Chapter Delegate mailing
list, I will focus exclusively on the ISOC.Live
Streaming and Archiving service, which primarily serves
Chapters.<br>
<br>
Aligning with the previous CEO's statements, you
mentioned that the decision to close ISOC.LIVE was made
by staff. However, this misses a crucial point: the
request to resume funding was formally submitted by
Chapters to the ISOC Board of Trustees through the
Chapter Advisory Council. A formal decision from the
ISOC Board of Trustees was necessary, requiring
adherence to governance principles, including
transparency and accountability, which your response
lacks.<br>
<br>
I refer you to my previous points made to Luis
concerning the Board of Trustees' responsibilities,
beyond their fiduciary duties:<br>
<br>
According to the US Council of Nonprofits (<a href="https://www.councilofnonprofits.org/running-nonprofit/governance-leadership/board-roles-and-responsibilities" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.councilofnonprofits.org/running-nonprofit/governance-leadership/board-roles-and-responsibilities</a>):<br>
<br>
"A board of directors does not exist solely to fulfill
legal duties and serve as a fiduciary of the
organization’s assets. Board members also play
significant roles in providing guidance to nonprofits by
contributing to the organization’s culture, strategic
focus, effectiveness, and financial sustainability, as
well as serving as ambassadors and advocates. Beyond
fulfilling legal duties, board members can be important
resources for the organization in multiple ways."<br>
<br>
Merely rubber-stamping staff decisions can lead to
significant failures, as evidenced by numerous corporate
governance disasters. A pertinent example is the failed
attempt to sell PIR, which severely damaged the Internet
Society's reputation. It is advisable for all Board
members to undertake a basic course on their rights and
responsibilities to ensure effective governance and
fulfil their critical roles as outlined above. <br>
<br>
If ISOC.Live is considered a critical service for one of
the Internet Society’s three core communities, the ISOC
Board of Trustees is obligated to take action and fulfil
their responsibilities, rather than avoiding them.<br>
<br>
Kind regards,<br>
<br>
Olivier Crépin-Leblond<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<div>On 16/09/2024 09:04, Ted Hardie wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small">Hi
Olivier,</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small">Thanks
for expressing your thoughts on this matter.
You ask below whether the Board will be
"formally notifying the Chair of the Chapter
Advisory Council, along with her Council Board
members, of the rejection of the Chapter
Advisory Council’s Advice?" <br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small">On
the question of the openness of the chapter
delegate list, the board has pointed out that
there is no need for board action here, since
the history shows that the original action to
close it was taken by the ChAC. This is not a
rejection of the advice; it is a continuation of
the dialogue with the ChAC on how to accomplish
their goal and a note that the staff contacts
will be able to help worth through the options
with them.</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small">On
the question of live streaming, the board has
reminded the ChAC that the decision to move to a
project basis for live streaming was a staff
decision, based on an analysis of the
consumption patterns of the relevant media. The
board's role here was to set the goals for the
communication plan; it does not direct the staff
on how to structure contracts nor would it be
appropriate for the board to require specific
contractors. It has also noted that data from
the chapters on the consumption patterns they
see when using live streaming would be valuable
input to ongoing analysis of how to best meet
the goals of the communication plan.<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small">I
do not believe I would characterize either
response as a rejection of the advice of the
ChAC. The board has responded and clarified its
roles here, and in neither case would it be the
right body to take the action requested. We are
happy to have the staff support the ChAC in
meeting its goals directly in the first instance
and in the second instance to work together with
the chapters to continue the analysis of
consumption patterns and communication
strategies.<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small">The
ChAC has been kind enough to invite me to the
call tomorrow, September 17th, and I look
forward to the opportunity for us to chat
together.</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small">best
regards,</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:small">Ted
Hardie<br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sun, Sep 15,
2024 at 1:36 PM Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond <<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">ocl@gih.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div> Dear Ted,<br>
<br>
Thank you for explaining the process by which
the Internet Society Board of Trustees reached
its decision. I question the appropriateness
of this process, given the formal nature of
the request made by the Chapter Advisory
Council, which included a vote and extensive
documentation.<br>
<br>
Could you please clarify the rationale behind
the decision not requiring a formal
resolution? Is it not customary for the Board
to formally endorse or reject formal Advice
upon receipt? What measures of accountability
does the Board have in its decisions if they
are based on informal processes that lack
transparency and traceability? Considering the
fiduciary responsibilities of all Board
members, how many other decisions of the Board
are subjected to this “informal” process, of
which non-Board members were previously
unaware?<br>
<br>
Finally, will you be formally notifying the
Chair of the Chapter Advisory Council, along
with her Council Board members, of the
rejection of the Chapter Advisory Council’s
Advice?<br>
<br>
Kind regards,<br>
<br>
Olivier Crépin-Leblond<br>
<br>
<br>
<div>On 13/09/2024 12:36, Ted Hardie wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div style="font-size:small">Hi Olivier,</div>
<div style="font-size:small"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-size:small">The board has
an active mailing list and informal
meetings once a month (though August's
meeting did not occur this year because
of low availability). The discussion
took place mostly on the mailing list,
along with trustees' edits of a proposal
using online tools. Because this
response did not require a resolution,
confirmation of agreement was assessed
on the list and confirmed at the
September informal meeting, earlier this
week. None of those methods generate
minutes in the formal sense, but I can
confirm that there was consensus for the
response.<br>
</div>
<div style="font-size:small"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-size:small">regards,</div>
<div style="font-size:small"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-size:small">Ted Hardie<br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri,
Sep 13, 2024 at 12:16 PM Olivier MJ
Crépin-Leblond <<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">ocl@gih.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div aria-label="Sent by Copilot: Certainly! Here is a more formal and legally phrased version:
---
**Dear Ted,**
I acknowledge receipt of your response, which I have reviewed with interest.
The Chapter Advisory Council submitted its request on 17 July 2024. The Board, through its Chair, issued its response on 13 September 2024.
Upon reviewing the list of ISOC Board Meetings available at [Internet Society Board of Trustees Meetings](https://www.internetsociety.org/board-of-trustees/meetings/), I have not identified any meetings of the ISOC Board of Trustees occurring between these dates.
Given that this decision was made by the Board, I kindly request the following:
- The minutes of the meeting during which the Board decided not to reinstate the ISOC.LIVE video production, editing, and archiving services.
Yours sincerely,
Olivier Crépin-Leblond
---
Would you like any further adjustments?">
<div>
<div>Dear Ted,<br>
<br>
I acknowledge receipt of your
response, which I have reviewed
with interest.
<p>The Chapter Advisory Council
submitted its formal request
on 17 July 2024. The Board,
through its Chair, issued its,
I assume, formal response on
13 September 2024.</p>
<p>Upon reviewing the list of
ISOC Board Meetings available
at <a href="https://www.internetsociety.org/board-of-trustees/meetings/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">Internet
Society Board of Trustees
Meetings</a>, I have not
identified any meetings of the
ISOC Board of Trustees
occurring between these dates.</p>
<p>Given that this decision was
made by the Board, I kindly
request the following:</p>
<ul>
<li>The minutes of the meeting
during which the Board
decided not to reinstate the
ISOC.LIVE video production,
editing, and archiving
services.</li>
</ul>
<p>Warmest regards,</p>
<p>Olivier Crépin-Leblond</p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<br>
<div>On 13/09/2024 09:17, Ted Hardie
via Chapter-delegates wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div style="font-size:small">
<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt" id="m_4811098459717303475m_-8974740112911427471m_-8662786334123695439m_4598472292962284382m_-1298471776895760914gmail-docs-internal-guid-7f64471f-7fff-92a0-4be1-1dfeef638eb1"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0);background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">Dear colleagues,</span></p>
<br>
<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0);background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">One of the items in your recent advice to the board was a request that the "ISOC funding for the ISOC.LIVE video production, editing, and archiving services should be reinstated, as well as ISOC.LIVE should be financially supported by ISOC on an ongoing basis." </span></p>
<br>
<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0);background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">The board's role here is to set the direction for the organization by establishing strategic goals; the details of the communication plan are a part of the staff execution of those goals. During the budget analysis of 2023, the communications team analyzed the effectiveness of specific streaming approaches and found that community engagement was driven primarily by on-demand viewing. This matches a broader shift common to mainstream programming. As a result of this analysis, the communications plan shifted away from a retainer-based contract for live streaming to a project-based funding model for future work. </span></p>
<br>
<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0);background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">This was a staff management decision, taken with due care and analysis. The board's role is to assess whether the overall communications plan is effective in meeting the strategic goals; it does not direct the staff to use specific contract types or contractors. If the needs of the communications plan change again to require live streaming on a full-time basis, the board is confident that the staff will issue the appropriate RFP and conduct the appropriate analysis of the submissions. </span></p>
<br>
<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0);background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">The project-based funding model remains available, and chapters may, of course, fund specific live streaming events using chapter funds or Beyond The Net grants. Any analysis of the effectiveness of those live streaming events would be valuable data for any future considerations of the engagement model.</span></p>
<br>
<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0);background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">The board thanks the ChaC for its attention to the communications plan, and we look forward to continued discussion of how to engage the broader community in the mission of the society. </span></p>
<br>
<p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(0,0,0);background-color:transparent;font-weight:400;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:baseline;white-space:pre-wrap">Best regards,</span></p>
</div>
<div style="font-size:small"><br>
</div>
<div style="font-size:small">Ted
Hardie</div>
<div style="font-size:small">for
the Board<br>
</div>
<div style="font-size:small"><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<fieldset></fieldset>
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</pre>
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</div>
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</div>
</blockquote>
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