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    <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt
      0cm 0cm 0cm"><span style="color:windowtext">Hello chapter admins,</span>
      <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext">as input to
          the discussion find below my previous take on the subject from
          June last year (goals, design criteria etc.):</span></p>
      <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext"><b>tltr</b>:<br>
        </span></p>
      <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext">minimum
          required functionality;<br>
        </span></p>
      <ol>
        <li>the chapter sends a list of all ISOC-IDs of its members to
          AMS about four times a year. <br>
        </li>
        <li>AMS reads the list and tags every ID on the list as "is
          member of chapter ...". <br>
        </li>
        <li>Every ID that has a "is member of chapter ..." tag but is
          not on the list will have the tag removed.</li>
        <li>All chapters applicants older than 30 days and not in the
          list of members sent by the chapter are removed automatically<br>
        </li>
        <li>AMS and local systems are in sync.</li>
      </ol>
      <p>more sensible (but - only a bit - more complex to implement):</p>
      <ol>
        <li>there is an chapter admin api that provides an equivalent
          for every authorized type or point and click operation on the
          AMS database<br>
        </li>
        <li>there is a function to extract chapter related infos (e.g.
          list of members, applicants ...) as csv tables from the AMS
          database. (To check: list of ISOC members in chapter's region
          for recruiting purposes??? Any privacy issues???)<br>
        </li>
        <li>each human readable communication (e.g. "Please Review Your
          New Chapter Membership Application") comes with a machine
          readable equivalent (e.g. csv) that allows for automatic
          processing. (would allow me to dump my mail scraper that
          processes "New Chapter Membership Application"s.)</li>
      </ol>
      <p>Rational: many chapters maintain their own database. Be it to
        meet legal requirements (privacy, other legislation) or to
        implement functionality not provided by AMS. The functionality
        outlined above would allow for keeping these databases in sync
        with AMS with reasonable effort.<br>
      </p>
      <p>Best regards</p>
      <p>Klaus<br>
      </p>
      <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext"></span></p>
      <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext"> </span></p>
      <blockquote type="cite"><b><span style="color:windowtext">[Re:
            [Chapter-delegates] Problems with new membership system -
            lets remove the dust 14.06.19, 20:17 +0200]</span></b><b><span
            style="color:windowtext"></span></b><br>
        <span style="color:windowtext"></span>
        <p>now that the dust has settled an covers the floor half a
          meter high a few thoughts on the AMS ...</p>
        <p>I wonder what the design goals for the new system were wrt
          support of groups within ISOC like e.g. chapters. Especially
          for groups that have a lot of volunteers doing the work the
          system should work for them and not require that they work for
          the system. In general there might be two main approaches one
          could take:</p>
        <blockquote>
          <p><b>Approach 1:</b><br>
          </p>
          <p>AMS is able to support most of the admin work of a chapter.
            If the support is at least nearly as good as an eventually
            existing local chapter admin system, it can substitute it.</p>
          <p><b>Approach 2:</b></p>
          <p>AMS is mainly tailored for ISOC.ORG requirements and AMS
            offers chapters and groups an interface to feed required
            membership data into AMS (while respecting their local
            privacy legislation).</p>
        </blockquote>
        <p>To be fair: <b>approach 1</b> is hard to implement. Too many
          different needs around. E.g. a few of features I'm using
          today: four membership classes, automatic members fee
          invoicing, payment tracking, automatic fee reminder system,
          online fee account information for every member,
          semi-automatic processing of direct debits, automatic
          processing of New Chapter Membership Applications (sending an
          information mail about chapter work, chapter charter and fee
          requirements to the applicant, provide her with a form where
          she can apply - if she still thinks she should), WEB based
          archive for meeting notes, selective members mailings, ..., 
          Other chapters may have other requirements and other features
          in their admin systems. So a one size fits all would rather
          not be feasible. <br>
        </p>
        <p>I would agree that some chapters, who don't have an admin
          system in place, might welcome AMS as kind of a "better than
          nothing" solution. But even for those AMS should respect at
          least a few usability principles.</p>
        <p>So what about <b>approach 2</b>? Here my very easy and
          simple solution (KISS design) - which should work at least for
          those many chapters who have a working local admin system in
          place. Assertion: every chapter keeps record of their members'
          ISOC-IDs: <br>
        </p>
        <ol>
          <li>the chapter sends a list of all ISOC-IDs of its members to
            AMS twice to four times a year. <br>
          </li>
          <li>AMS reads the list and tags every ID on the list as "is
            member of chapter ...". <br>
          </li>
          <li>Every ID that has a "is member of chapter ..." tag but is
            not on the list will have the tag removed.</li>
          <li>AMS and local systems are in sync.<br>
          </li>
        </ol>
        Advantages:
        <ul>
          <li>it is dumb simple to implement (takes 15min max for an
            average DB system) - well, may be 2hrs with a web upload
            interface.<br>
          </li>
          <li>can be automated on both sides (ISOC and chapter) -
            preventing errors</li>
          <li>a list of possible errors (e.g. invalid ISOC ID) can
            easily be generated and can be treated manually <br>
          </li>
          <li>only chapters can tell who is their member and this is an
            easy way to let ISOC know</li>
          <li>will probably comply with all local privacy regulations -
            since no private data is exchanged<br>
          </li>
        </ul>
        <p>There might be cases were chapters don't have the ISOC-ID of
          a member. In this case they are trapped - even today. Since
          AMS wouldn't allow them to figure out if Alice is a ISOC
          member and what's her ISOC-ID. If this isn't changed it would
          require some manual work on side of ISOC anyhow. (Not being an
          AMS aficionado, I wonder if my assumption wrt to this case is
          right.)<br>
        </p>
        Did I miss something? If so I'd be happy to learn. But let me be
        clear: as long as things are as they are today I'll stay "hands
        off AMS". I'm not insane enough to invest hours and hours of
        manual work over and over again - threatened by poorly designed
        interfaces and lame response times - to do things that the
        computer could do easily, better and faster without much
        implementation effort. If anybody would direct me to do so I
        would rather quit my job. </blockquote>
      <br>
      <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext"><br>
        </span><o:p></o:p></p>
    </div>
    <div class="moz-forward-container">
      <div class="WordSection1">
        <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
          <p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-line-height-alt:.75pt"><span
style="font-size:1.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#333333"
                lang="EN">Dear all, According to the Doodle poll, there
                are two time slots that are quite popular with those of
                you interested in participating in this... -posted to
                the "Chapter Leaders Community" community</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
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                                    <p class="MsoNormal"
                                      style="text-align:center"
                                      align="center"><span
                                        style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">==
                                        Please, reply above this line ==
                                      </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                    <div class="MsoNormal"
                                      style="text-align:center"
                                      align="center"><span
                                        style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">
                                        <hr width="100%" size="1"
                                          align="center"></span></div>
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                                    <h1
style="mso-margin-top-alt:3.75pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:3.75pt;margin-left:0cm;text-align:center"
                                      align="center"><span
style="font-size:16.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#EFF2EC"><a
href="https://connect.internetsociety.org/communities/community-home/digestviewer?tab=digestviewer&CommunityKey=a87f0d7b-f5f1-40d2-828d-d1261ddaf7fc"
                                          target="_blank"
                                          moz-do-not-send="true">Chapter
                                          Leaders Community </a></span><o:p></o:p></h1>
                                  </td>
                                </tr>
                              </tbody>
                            </table>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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                                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                        style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><a
href="https://connect.internetsociety.org/communities/community-home/digestviewer/viewthread?MessageKey=10661b64-1c6c-4911-bc51-37450ebfe63a&CommunityKey=a87f0d7b-f5f1-40d2-828d-d1261ddaf7fc&tab=digestviewer#bm10661b64-1c6c-4911-bc51-37450ebfe63a"
                                          target="_blank"
                                          moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                            style="color:#0C1C2C">Re:
                                            MemberNova down on 2 January
                                            2020 14:00-15:00 UTC</span></a>
                                      </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                  </td>
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                                            <p class="MsoNormal"
                                              style="text-align:center"
                                              align="center"><span
                                                style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><a
href="https://connect.internetsociety.org/people/christine-saegesser-baethge"
                                                  moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                                    style="border:solid
                                                    windowtext
                                                    1.0pt;padding:0cm;text-decoration:none"><img
style="width:.7777in;height:.7777in" id="_x0000_i1026"
                                                      src="cid:part3.6EE6F073.11096C7C@isoc.de"
                                                      alt="Das Bild
                                                      wurde vom Absender
                                                      entfernt.
                                                      Christine
                                                      Saegesser Baethge"
                                                      class=""
                                                      width="75"
                                                      height="75"
                                                      border="0"></span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
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                                                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Feb 27, 2020 3:07 PM </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                                  </td>
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                                                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><a
href="https://connect.internetsociety.org/people/christine-saegesser-baethge"
moz-do-not-send="true">Christine Saegesser Baethge </a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                                  </td>
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                                              <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Dear all,  </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">According to the Doodle
                                                    poll, there are two
                                                    time slots that are
                                                    quite popular with
                                                    those of you
                                                    interested in
                                                    participating in
                                                    this discussion.
                                                    Let's thus set up
                                                    two calls next week
                                                    to ensure all of you
                                                    can join: </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <ul type="disc">
                                                  <li class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l1
                                                    level1 lfo3"><span
                                                      style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Call
                                                      1: Tuesday, 3
                                                      March, 13:00 UTC:
                                                      Zoom link: <a
                                                        href="https://isoc.zoom.us/j/602414917"
title="https://isoc.zoom.us/j/602414917" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                                          style="color:blue">isoc.zoom.us/j/602414917</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></li>
                                                  <li class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;mso-list:l1
                                                    level1 lfo3"><span
                                                      style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Call
                                                      2: Thursday, 5
                                                       March, 14:00 UTC.
                                                      Zoom link: <a
                                                        href="https://isoc.zoom.us/j/495857410"
title="https://isoc.zoom.us/j/495857410" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                                          style="color:blue">isoc.zoom.us/j/495857410</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></li>
                                                </ul>
                                                <div>
                                                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">I look forward to
                                                      talking to you
                                                      then!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                                </div>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Best, </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Christine</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              <div>
                                                <div>
                                                  <div>
                                                    <div>
                                                      <p
                                                        class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Christine Saegesser
                                                          Baethge</span></b><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">, Director Chapters and
                                                          Individual
                                                          Members<br>
                                                          <a
                                                          href="mailto:saegesser@isoc.org"
title="mailto:saegesser@isoc.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                                          style="color:blue">saegesser@isoc.org</span></a> | Twitter:
                                                          ch_saebae</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                                    </div>
                                                  </div>
                                                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;border:solid windowtext
                                                      1.0pt;padding:0cm"><img
style="width:1.0416in;height:1.0416in" id="_x0000_i1027"
                                                        src="cid:part9.0FCE1F8F.0292B19F@isoc.de"
                                                        alt="Das Bild
                                                        wurde vom
                                                        Absender
                                                        entfernt."
                                                        class=""
                                                        width="100"
                                                        height="100"
                                                        border="0"></span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                                </div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><br>
                                                    <a
                                                      href="http://internetsociety.org"
title="http://internetsociety.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                                        style="color:blue">internetsociety.org</span></a> | @internetsociety</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                            <p class="MsoNormal"
                                              style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><br>
                                                <br>
                                                ------Original
                                                Message------</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                            <div>
                                              <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Dear Enzo, dear all,  </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Thanks for this. I've
                                                    created a Doodle
                                                    poll to find the
                                                    best date/time for
                                                    the call for those
                                                    of you interested in
                                                    being part of this
                                                    discussion. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Please enter your
                                                    availability here: <a
href="https://www.doodle.com/poll/zb5d5x3abfqi758t"
                                                      title="https://www.doodle.com/poll/zb5d5x3abfqi758t"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="color:blue">doodle.com/poll/a5kdpiyfizw87c53</span></a> so
                                                    that we can fix a
                                                    call for next week. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">We'll use this call to
                                                    get a better sense
                                                    of where the main
                                                    common challenges
                                                    with the Chapter
                                                    Portal (MemberNova)
                                                    are globally to then
                                                    explore solutions
                                                    going forward.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">I look forward to
                                                    talking to you then!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Best, </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Christine </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>
                                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">PS: please do not share
                                                    personally
                                                    identifiable data
                                                    via e-mail and on
                                                    the lists to protect
                                                    people's privacy.
                                                    Thanks!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                                style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><br>
                                                <br>
                                                <br>
                                                <br>
                                              </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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                                  <td style="padding:2.0pt 2.0pt 2.0pt
                                    2.0pt">
                                    <p class="MsoNormal"
                                      style="text-align:center"
                                      align="center"><span
                                        style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> 
                                        <strong><span
                                            style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><a
href="https://connect.internetsociety.org/communities/all-discussions/postreply?MessageKey=10661b64-1c6c-4911-bc51-37450ebfe63a&ListKey=679aae94-6767-4b89-af2f-4f6122e16416"
                                              moz-do-not-send="true">Reply
                                              to Group Online</a></span></strong>
                                          <strong><span
                                            style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><a
href="mailto:INTERNETSOCIETY_chapterleaders_10661b64-1c6c-4911-bc51-37450ebfe63a@ConnectedCommunity.org?subject=Re:%20MemberNova%20down%20on%202%20January%202020%2014:00-15:00%20UTC"
                                              moz-do-not-send="true">Reply
                                              to Group via Email</a></span></strong>
                                          <strong><span
                                            style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><a
href="https://connect.internetsociety.org/communities/all-discussions/postreply?MessageKey=10661b64-1c6c-4911-bc51-37450ebfe63a&ListKey=679aae94-6767-4b89-af2f-4f6122e16416&SenderKey=a8bc51a8-bcce-49a0-9a57-bdaf91c1aa77"
                                              moz-do-not-send="true">Reply
                                              to Sender Online</a></span></strong>
                                          <strong><span
                                            style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><a
href="https://connect.internetsociety.org/communities/community-home/digestviewer/viewthread?MessageKey=10661b64-1c6c-4911-bc51-37450ebfe63a&CommunityKey=a87f0d7b-f5f1-40d2-828d-d1261ddaf7fc&tab=digestviewer#bm10661b64-1c6c-4911-bc51-37450ebfe63a"
                                              moz-do-not-send="true">View
                                              Thread</a></span></strong>
                                          <strong><span
                                            style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><a
href="https://connect.internetsociety.org/communities/community-home/digestviewer/viewthread?MessageKey=10661b64-1c6c-4911-bc51-37450ebfe63a&CommunityKey=a87f0d7b-f5f1-40d2-828d-d1261ddaf7fc&tab=digestviewer&MarkAppropriate=10661b64-1c6c-4911-bc51-37450ebfe63a#bm10661b64-1c6c-4911-bc51-37450ebfe63a"
                                              moz-do-not-send="true">Flag
                                              as Inappropriate</a></span></strong>
                                          </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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                              </tbody>
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                            <p class="MsoNormal"
                              style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
                                style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><br>
                                <br>
                                <br>
                              </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                            <table class="MsoNormalTable"
                              style="width:100.0%" width="100%"
                              cellspacing="3" cellpadding="0" border="0">
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                                    style="background:#EFF2EC;padding:.75pt
                                    .75pt .75pt .75pt">
                                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                        style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                  </td>
                                </tr>
                              </tbody>
                            </table>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                            <table class="MsoNormalTable"
                              style="width:100.0%" width="100%"
                              cellspacing="3" cellpadding="0" border="0">
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                                  <td style="padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt
                                    .75pt">
                                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                        style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">You
                                        are subscribed to "Chapter
                                        Leaders Community" as <a
                                          href="mailto:katrin@ohlmer.de"
                                          moz-do-not-send="true">katrin@ohlmer.de</a>.
                                        To change your subscriptions, go
                                        to <a
href="http://connect.internetsociety.org/preferences?section=Subscriptions"
                                          moz-do-not-send="true">My
                                          Subscriptions</a>. To
                                        unsubscribe from this community
                                        discussion, go to <a
href="http://connect.internetsociety.org/HigherLogic/eGroups/Unsubscribe.aspx?UserKey=b3bd1537-f521-4516-9b69-4a57a7f84898&sKey=48fc614f85e54c0d8c2f&GroupKey=679aae94-6767-4b89-af2f-4f6122e16416"
                                          moz-do-not-send="true">Unsubscribe</a>.
                                      </span><o:p></o:p></p>
                                  </td>
                                </tr>
                              </tbody>
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                          </td>
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                  </div>
                </td>
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            </tbody>
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          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;border:solid
              windowtext 1.0pt;padding:0cm" lang="EN"><img
                style="width:.0208in;height:.0069in" id="_x0000_i1028"
                src="cid:part20.5B597625.F80AB05A@isoc.de" alt="Das Bild
                wurde vom Absender entfernt." class="" width="2"
                height="1" border="0"></span><o:p></o:p></p>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:windowtext"><br>
              <br>
              <o:p></o:p></span></p>
          <pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre>
          <pre>Vorstand mailing list<o:p></o:p></pre>
          <pre><a href="mailto:Vorstand@isoc.de" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Vorstand@isoc.de</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
          <pre><a href="http://mail2.isoc.de/mailman/listinfo/vorstand" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">http://mail2.isoc.de/mailman/listinfo/vorstand</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
        </blockquote>
        <pre>-- <o:p></o:p></pre>
        <pre>Klaus Birkenbihl<o:p></o:p></pre>
        <pre>Internet Society German Chapter (ISOC.DE) e.V.<o:p></o:p></pre>
        <pre>c/o ict-Media GmbH<o:p></o:p></pre>
        <pre><a href="https://www.isoc.de" moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">https://www.isoc.de</span></a><o:p></o:p></pre>
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