<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=windows-1252"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">Thank you Veni. Can you please direct me to the link for the Accountability Framework the Dutch ccTLD signed?<div><br></div><div>best regards</div><div>Carlos Raul</div><div><br></div><div>ISOC Costa Rica</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br><div><div>El 31/03/2014, a las 16:42, Veni Markovski <<a href="mailto:veni@veni.com">veni@veni.com</a>> escribió:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite">
  
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    Good thing is - the agreements are public, and everyone can see
    them, however they differ - e.g. the Russian ccTLD has exchanged
    letters with ICANN, while the Netherlands has signed an
    Accountability Framework. <br>
    It is up to the ccTLD to decide what's acceptable for them. <br>
    <br>
    Best,<br>
    Veni <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 03/31/14 18:08, Burkov Dmitry wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote cite="mid:38F5D1B5-2F37-4798-80DE-41169C95C04B@gmail.com" type="cite">
      <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;
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      imho - I don't think that it is acceptable to sign standardized
      ageements for ccTLDs
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>What is ICANN - and what is real community?</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>Dmitry<br>
        <div>
          <div>On 31 Mar 2014, at 18:51, Veni Markovski <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:veni@veni.com">veni@veni.com</a>>
            wrote:</div>
          <br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
          <blockquote type="cite">
            <meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252" http-equiv="Content-Type">
            <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> <font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">Vint, <br>
                Indeed, some of the ccTLDs do that - they seek for some
                agreement with ICANN. This is all public information,
                and the agreements can be found here: <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.icann.org/en/about/agreements/cctlds">http://www.icann.org/en/about/agreements/cctlds</a><br>
                <br>
                One may notice that the form of the agreements have
                changed through the years. <br>
                <br>
                <br>
                <br>
              </font>
              <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 03/31/14 05:42, Vint Cerf
                wrote:<br>
              </div>
              <blockquote cite="mid:CAHxHgge8wR4d3qkKPPdiHBjR9=fG==AvzYxX1YNo2kG82m248g@mail.gmail.com" type="cite">
                <div dir="ltr">ICANN mistakenly tried to insist on
                  agreements with ccTLD operators and that provoked a
                  lot of tension, so Steve's position is consistent with
                  experience. Personally, I think the ccTLD operators
                  would be wise to seek such an instrument to reinforce
                  their roles in the operation of the Internet (and it
                  would also help with cryptographic control of changes
                  to the root zone). 
                  <div> <br>
                  </div>
                  <div>vint</div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                </div>
                <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                  <br>
                  <div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Mar 31, 2014 at 4:22
                    AM, Steve Crocker <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:steve@shinkuro.com" target="_blank">steve@shinkuro.com</a>></span>
                    wrote:<br>
                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
                      .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                      <div style="word-wrap:break-word">
                        <div>Patrik, Seun, et al,</div>
                        <div><br>
                        </div>
                        <div>Here’s a small detail worth thinking about.
                           Although some ccTLDs have agreements with
                          ICANN, many do not.  Further, many ccTLDs are
                          not members of the ccNSO, the Supporting
                          Organization that represents the ccTLDs within
                          ICANN.  None of this matters when it comes to
                          providing each ccTLD with updates to its
                          portion of the root zone.  ICANN serves
                          *every* ccTLD, even those that operate in
                          locations the U.S. Government imposes trade
                          restrictions.</div>
                        <div><br>
                        </div>
                        <div>This is the way it’s been since the
                          inception of ICANN.  I don’t see any reason
                          this needs to change.  I would not envision
                          ICANN *requiring* any sort of agreement with
                          each of the ccTLDs.  (We have sometimes sought
                          such an agreement and may do so in the future,
                          but it will not be a requirement.)</div>
                        <div><br>
                        </div>
                        <div>Re the arrangements with Verisign, I would
                          expect the adjustments to be only the minimum
                          that’s required.  I would expect their
                          operational role and ICANN’s operational re
                          updates and publishing of the root zone and
                          the creation and use of DNSSEC keys to remain
                          the same.  It’s the *stewardship* not the
                          actual operation that’s the subject of
                          discussion.</div>
                        <span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">
                            <div><br>
                            </div>
                            <div>Steve</div>
                            <div><br>
                            </div>
                            <div><br>
                            </div>
                            <div><br>
                            </div>
                          </font></span>
                        <div><br>
                          <div>
                            <div>
                              <div class="h5">
                                <div>On Mar 31, 2014, at 4:10 AM, Patrik
                                  Fältström <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:patrik@frobbit.se" target="_blank">patrik@frobbit.se</a>>

                                  wrote:</div>
                                <br>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                            <blockquote type="cite">
                              <div>
                                <div class="h5">
                                  <div style="word-wrap:break-word">On
                                    31 mar 2014, at 03:57, Seun Ojedeji
                                    <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:seun.ojedeji@gmail.com" target="_blank">seun.ojedeji@gmail.com</a>>

                                    wrote:<br>
                                    <div><br>
                                      <blockquote type="cite">
                                        <div dir="ltr">
                                          <div>On Sun, Mar 30, 2014 at
                                            10:22 PM, Patrik Fältström <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:patrik@frobbit.se" target="_blank">patrik@frobbit.se</a>></span>
                                            wrote:</div>
                                          <div>
                                            <div class="gmail_extra">
                                              <div class="gmail_quote">
                                                <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px
                                                  0px
0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
                                                  <div style="word-wrap:break-word">
                                                    <div><br>
                                                      <div>
                                                        <div>On 30 mar
                                                          2014, at
                                                          13:49, Patrick
                                                          Ryan <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:patrickryan@google.com" target="_blank">patrickryan@google.com</a>>

                                                          wrote:</div>
                                                        <br>
                                                      </div>
                                                    </div>
                                                    <div>I think
                                                      personally one
                                                      could think of a
                                                      model where we
                                                      have the various
                                                      responsibilities
                                                      layered:</div>
                                                    <div><br>
                                                    </div>
                                                    <div>A. Primary
                                                      layer:</div>
                                                    <div><br>
                                                    </div>
                                                    <div>A.1. ICANN (as
                                                      the party running
                                                      the IANA function)
                                                      signs an AOC with
                                                      each body that
                                                      asks for IANA
                                                      services.</div>
                                                    <div>A.2. ICANN to
                                                      be able to provide
                                                      the service
                                                      required signs
                                                      whatever
                                                      AOC/MOU/Contract
                                                      needed with
                                                      Verisign and
                                                      whoever else that
                                                      have to be
                                                      involved, so that
                                                      ICANN can deliver
                                                      whatever it
                                                      promises under
                                                      A.1.</div>
                                                  </div>
                                                </blockquote>
                                                <div><br>
                                                </div>
                                                <div>Unless i am
                                                  forgetting/missing
                                                  something, I think
                                                  this part is already
                                                  inplace, and there may
                                                  be no need to have to
                                                  repeat the signing
                                                  process(re-call the
                                                  scope of those who
                                                  require the IANA
                                                  service is quite
                                                  broad). The only
                                                  aspect which perhaps
                                                  needs to be updated is
                                                  the relationship
                                                  between ICANN and
                                                  Verisign (since
                                                  verisign contract is
                                                  with the USG). So
                                                  ICANN needs to sign a
                                                  contract with Verisign
                                                  (just as he already
                                                  have signed contract
                                                  with other registries)<br>
                                                </div>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
                                      </blockquote>
                                      <div><br>
                                      </div>
                                      There is today a cooperative
                                      agreement between NTIA and
                                      Verisign that contain things I do
                                      believe are related to the root
                                      zone management. Those details in
                                      that agreement should, I think, be
                                      replaced by a contract between
                                      ICANN and Verisign. This is not
                                      these operational actions that
                                      Verisign do are to be moved
                                      elsewhere (to IANA). But if the
                                      basis for the discussion is to not
                                      change operations of the root zone
                                      management, then I would like to
                                      see ICANN take over the pieces of
                                      the Cooperative Agreement related
                                      to the root zone management.</div>
                                    <div><br>
                                      <blockquote type="cite">
                                        <div dir="ltr">
                                          <div class="gmail_extra">
                                            <div class="gmail_quote">
                                              <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px
                                                0px
0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
                                                <div style="word-wrap:break-word">
                                                  <div><br>
                                                  </div>
                                                  <div>B. Secondary
                                                    layer:</div>
                                                  <div><br>
                                                  </div>
                                                  <div>B.1. ICANN signs
                                                    whatever paperwork
                                                    with the parties
                                                    that for example
                                                    uses the parameters
                                                    that are allocated
                                                    according to the
                                                    policies set up
                                                    under category A.</div>
                                                  <div><br>
                                                  </div>
                                                </div>
                                              </blockquote>
                                              <div>I am wondering how
                                                this differ from Item
                                                A2.1 that you mentioned
                                                above?<br>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
                                      </blockquote>
                                      <div><br>
                                      </div>
                                      B1 has to do with for example the
                                      registries for each TLD be able to
                                      get an agreement with ICANN. In
                                      the same way as each organisation
                                      getting any other parameter from
                                      ICANN (i.e. the RIRs, each entity
                                      that have something in the IANA
                                      registry). This for the protocol
                                      parameters have to be discussed
                                      somewhat more whether it is for
                                      example for most of them IAB that
                                      is the other end of the agreement,
                                      ISOC or whether it is really each
                                      individual. For PEN it could be
                                      the organisation. For character
                                      sets...</div>
                                    <div><br>
                                      <blockquote type="cite">
                                        <div dir="ltr">
                                          <div class="gmail_extra">
                                            <div class="gmail_quote">
                                              <div> </div>
                                              <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px
                                                0px
0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
                                                <div style="word-wrap:break-word">
                                                  <div>C. Tertiary
                                                    layer:</div>
                                                  <div><br>
                                                  </div>
                                                  <div>That way, at
                                                    least via A.1 and
                                                    B.1 we get a mesh of
                                                    accountability
                                                    agreements that
                                                    should ensure that
                                                    things works.</div>
                                                </div>
                                              </blockquote>
                                              <div><br>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>Speaking about
                                                accountability, i think
                                                the bylaw should drive
                                                the accountability
                                                process. The role of the
                                                board needs to be
                                                reviewed. Now i know
                                                they always say board
                                                members represent the
                                                interest of the
                                                organisation. Yes i
                                                agree, however i believe
                                                the interest of the
                                                organisation should be
                                                in the bylaw and board
                                                should respect such. Now
                                                the content of the bylaw
                                                should respect the PDP
                                                of ICANN. It is well
                                                know that the PDP of
                                                ICANN has a bottom up
                                                approach hence the
                                                community interest is
                                                represented.<br>
                                                <br>
                                              </div>
                                              <div>So for me, i think
                                                more work needs to be
                                                done in reviewing the
                                                exiting bylaw and
                                                ensuring it holds the
                                                board members
                                                accountable and then the
                                                board members holds the
                                                organisation (in this
                                                case the CEO)
                                                accountable in an open
                                                and transparent manner.<br>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
                                      </blockquote>
                                      <br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div>But to whom are they
                                      accountable? I was more thinking
                                      of to whom the accountability was.
                                      But of course you talk about the
                                      internal implementation of the
                                      accountability and that is also
                                      important discussion.</div>
                                    <div><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <div>   Patrik</div>
                                    <div><br>
                                    </div>
                                    <br>
                                  </div>
                                </div>
                              </div>
                              <div class="">_______________________________________________<br>
                                To manage your ISOC subscriptions or
                                unsubscribe,<br>
                                please log into the ISOC Member Portal:<br>
                                <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://portal.isoc.org/" target="_blank">https://portal.isoc.org/</a><br>
                                Then choose Interests &
                                Subscriptions from the My Account menu.</div>
                            </blockquote>
                          </div>
                          <br>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                      <br>
                      _______________________________________________<br>
                      As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are
                      automatically subscribed<br>
                      to this list, which is regularly synchronized with
                      the Internet Society<br>
                      Chapter Portal (AMS): <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://portal.isoc.org/" target="_blank">https://portal.isoc.org</a><br>
                    </blockquote>
                  </div>
                  <br>
                </div>
                <br>
                <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
                <br>
                <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed
to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
Chapter Portal (AMS): <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://portal.isoc.org/">https://portal.isoc.org</a></pre>
              </blockquote>
              <br>
              <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">-- 

Best, 
Veni Markovski
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.veni.com/">http://www.veni.com</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.facebook.com/venimarkovski">https://www.facebook.com/venimarkovski</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://twitter.com/veni">https://twitter.com/veni</a>

The opinions expressed above are those of the 
author, not of any organizations, associated 
with or related to him in any given way. </pre>
            </div>
            _______________________________________________<br>
            IANAxfer mailing list<br>
            <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:IANAxfer@elists.isoc.org">IANAxfer@elists.isoc.org</a><br>
            <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/ianaxfer">https://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/ianaxfer</a><br>
          </blockquote>
        </div>
        <br>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">-- 

Best, 
Veni Markovski
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.veni.com/">http://www.veni.com</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.facebook.com/venimarkovski">https://www.facebook.com/venimarkovski</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://twitter.com/veni">https://twitter.com/veni</a>

The opinions expressed above are those of the 
author, not of any organizations, associated 
with or related to him in any given way. </pre>
  </div>

_______________________________________________<br>As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed<br>to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society<br>Chapter Portal (AMS): <a href="https://portal.isoc.org">https://portal.isoc.org</a></blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>