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    And, above all, any of this has little or nothing to do with the
    balloons (pun not intended ;) ). <br>
    <br>
    The research into low-cost alternatives for delivering broadband
    services to sparsely populated and remote areas is, IMO, quite
    relevant and something we should applaud.<br>
    <br>
    regards<br>
    <br>
    Carlos<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 6/17/13 2:09 PM, Evan Leibovitch
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAMguqh18sTgzQcQvBjgAyxGDc69DDVT15BVuGpNm5wWAx7=wdQ@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">Gary, the extent to which Google's efforts to
        digitize every book is in the interest of readers, publishers,
        authors and.or maybe none of them (and just Google's), is an
        absolutely worthwhile debate. I would argue that most of its
        ebook-related efforts to date, being generally DRM-free and
        open, have been far more preferable to the directions in the
        same realm taken by Apple, Amazon, and most publishers. Google
        is most definitely NOT the company with monopoly power in this
        field. Indeed, most of the areas in which Google is finding
        conflict are those which Amazon and Apple may not consider
        profitable enough but have at least the potential to create
        public good. While doing so certainly serves its interests,
        Google's ebook efforts have been pushing for a public commons
        well beyond what Apple, Amazon and publishers would like.
        <div>
          <br>
        </div>
        <div style="">BTW, the legal fights with Google have come not
          from libraries -- who generally applaud its actions -- but
          from independent authors' collectives who believe they should
          be paid more for the digitizing of their works (even in cases
          where the author can't be found). It's a legitimate grievance,
          but its debate cannot help but bring into focus some of the
          stupidity of current US copyright policy.</div>
        <div style=""><br>
        </div>
        <div style="">In any case, if this is the debate to have, that's
          fine. Let's just not conflate it with side-issues about
          airborne access points etc.</div>
        <div style=""><br>
        </div>
        <div style="">- Evan</div>
        <div style=""><br>
        </div>
      </div>
      <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
        <br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">On 17 June 2013 16:55, Gary W Kenward <span
            dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="mailto:garykenward@eastlink.ca" target="_blank">garykenward@eastlink.ca</a>></span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
            .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
            <div style="word-wrap:break-word">
              <div>Some references:</div>
              <div><br>
              </div>
              Harvard librarian Robert Darnton apparently initiated the
              backlash in 2009 with his New York Review of Books article
              "<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.nybooks.com/articles/archives/2009/feb/12/google-the-future-of-books/"
                target="_blank">Google & the Future of Books</a>". 
              <div>
                <br>
              </div>
              <div>Pamela Samuelson (Professor of Law at the University
                of California, Berkeley) also published an article in
                2009 on Huffington Post, "<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.huffingtonpost.com/pamela-samuelson/google-books-is-not-a-lib_b_317518.html"
                  target="_blank">Google Books is Not a Library</a>"
                (there are a series of articles on Huffington Post
                concerning the Google Books saga from Prof. Samuelson on
                the Huffington Post site).<br>
                <div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                  <div>Darnton wrote a summary of the struggle around
                    Google Books in his 2011 article <a
                      moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.nybooks.com/articles/archives/2011/apr/28/googles-loss-publics-gain/"
                      target="_blank">Google’s Loss: The Public’s Gain</a>.
                    The turn point for many was the issue of "fair use"
                    being determined by a sole commercial entity, namely
                    Google. </div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                  <div>Darnton went on to foster the creation of the <a
                      moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://dp.la/"
                      target="_blank">Digital Public Library of America</a>,
                    launched April 18th of this year. So, for the
                    moment, the American public is ahead.</div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                  <div>I also found one book on the Google Books saga. I
                    haven't read it, but the on-line reviews appear
                    good.</div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                  <div>"The Battle for the Books: Inside Google’s Gambit
                    to Create the World’s Biggest Library", by Jeff John
                    Roberts. It's vailable on Amazon, Barnes & Noble
                    and Apple. The Amazon price is currently $2.90.</div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                  <div>Cheers,</div>
                  <div>Gary</div>
                  <div>
                    <div>
                      <div
style="text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;text-align:-webkit-auto;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;text-transform:none;font-size:medium;white-space:normal;font-family:Arial;word-spacing:0px"><span
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                    <div>
                      <div class="h5">
                        <br>
                        <div>
                          <div>On 2013.06.16, at 8:13 PM, Joly MacFie
                            <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                              href="mailto:joly@punkcast.com"
                              target="_blank">joly@punkcast.com</a>>
                            wrote:</div>
                          <br>
                          <blockquote type="cite">
                            <div dir="ltr">
                              <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                                <div class="gmail_quote">
                                  On Sun, Jun 16, 2013 at 6:56 PM, Gary
                                  W Kenward <span dir="ltr"><<a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="mailto:garykenward@eastlink.ca"
                                      target="_blank">garykenward@eastlink.ca</a>></span>
                                  wrote:<br>
                                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                                    style="margin:0 0 0
                                    .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
                                    solid;padding-left:1ex">The only
                                    groups of people who have expressed
                                    a concern over Google's growing
                                    acquisition of information, as far
                                    as I know, are the various library
                                    associations around the world</blockquote>
                                </div>
                                <br>
                                <br>
                                Source? I had thought libraries quite
                                keen on the book scanning project. Any
                                resistance has been from publishers and
                                authors.</div>
                              <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                              </div>
                              <div class="gmail_extra">j</div>
                              <div class="gmail_extra">
                                <br>
                              </div>
                              <div class="gmail_extra">j<br>
                                <br clear="all">
                                <div><br>
                                </div>
                                -- <br>
---------------------------------------------------------------<br>
                                <span>Joly MacFie  <span title="Call
                                    with Google Voice">218 565 9365</span>
                                  <a moz-do-not-send="true">Skype:punkcast</a></span><br>
                                WWWhatsup NYC - <a
                                  moz-do-not-send="true"
                                  href="http://wwwhatsup.com/"
                                  target="_blank">http://wwwhatsup.com</a><br>
                                 <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                  href="http://pinstand.com/"
                                  target="_blank">http://pinstand.com</a>
                                - <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                  href="http://punkcast.com/"
                                  target="_blank">http://punkcast.com</a><br>
                                 VP (Admin) - ISOC-NY - <a
                                  moz-do-not-send="true"
                                  href="http://isoc-ny.org/"
                                  target="_blank">http://isoc-ny.org</a><br>
--------------------------------------------------------------<br>
                                -
                              </div>
                            </div>
                          </blockquote>
                        </div>
                        <br>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                  </div>
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            <br>
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          </blockquote>
        </div>
        <br>
        <br clear="all">
        <div><br>
        </div>
        -- <br>
        <div style="text-align:center">
          <div style="text-align:left">
            Evan Leibovitch</div>
          <div style="text-align:left">Toronto Canada</div>
        </div>
        <blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 40px;border:none;padding:0px">
          <div style="text-align:center">
            <div style="text-align:left">Em: evan at telly dot org</div>
          </div>
          <div style="text-align:center">
            <div style="text-align:left">Sk: evanleibovitch</div>
          </div>
          <div style="text-align:center">
            <div style="text-align:left">Tw: el56</div>
          </div>
        </blockquote>
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      <br>
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      <br>
      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
As an Internet Society Chapter Officer you are automatically subscribed
to this list, which is regularly synchronized with the Internet Society
Chapter Portal (AMS): <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://portal.isoc.org">https://portal.isoc.org</a></pre>
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