<div dir="ltr">Hello Oliver,<br><br>Thank you for taking the time to list what needs to be preserved. In the first paragraph you have echoed the views of Telcos and these are views to be respected. In a discussion thread such as this we will wait for different points of view and when contrary opinions and views are thrown in, lets received them with equal respect. One question: If Telcos are not interested in the grid, wouldn't there be other infrastructure players interested in the grid? If non-traditional players set their eyes on the Grid with one of the new business models (for e.g Google's business model or a social networking portal's business model) it would be all the more to the disadvantage to the Telcos.<br>
<br>On the characteristics that you have listed, on point <br><br><div>><font face="Arial" size="2">- Better be late than wrong</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"><br>>policy change seems to take so long. Ultimately, there is enough collective <br>>for the right decision to be taken. Make sure it stays that way. <br><br>Why? Shouldn't the Internet policy be rather adaptable? Shouldn't the the technical architecture be engineered to accommodate constant improvements? Or is there something that I have missed in this point?<br>
<br>And what about user-centricity? And user participation in shaping the Internet? Internet as a global infrastructure owned by none? Or by owned by the User? There are several other aspects that needs to be listed, I hope some more points would emerge if this thread continues.<br>
<br>Sivasubramanian Muthusamy<br><a href="http://isocmadras.blogspot.com">http://isocmadras.blogspot.com</a><br><br></font></div><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 9:38 PM, Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com">ocl@gih.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
<div bgcolor="#ffffff">
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">Hello Siva,</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">thanks for forwarding this interesting
presentation. The Grid certainly demonstrates the feeling of hope and
anticipation that Web 2.0 would be the next "killer ap", the next big bubble.
IMHO, alas, the Grid and the ideas presented in this presentation did not take
into account the Telecommunication Provider (Telco) point of view, which is:
everybody else has cashed in on services, why shouldn't we?</font></div></div></blockquote><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
<div bgcolor="#ffffff"><div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">In other words, the Grid would only be possible if
Telcos wanted it. It appears that they don't. Or at least, they do, but only
with their direct involvement and their terms. Along with most Intellectual
Property owners, they consider P2P as a threat, not an asset.</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">My thoughts on what needs to be fundamentally
preserved:</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">- "the internet is for everyone": </font></div></div></blockquote><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
<div bgcolor="#ffffff"><div><font face="Arial" size="2">promote Internet
access worldwide. There are still many many communities that do not have
Internet access. With the developed world's economy & processes relying more
on more on the Internet, we might soon see an "underclass" of people without
Internet access, that will be treated as 2d class citizens. As for the
developing world, it is still today *very* expensive to have sustainable
internet access in many places. The fact that a country has full internet
connectivity does not mean affordable access everywhere.</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">- Network Neutrality</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">I am a firm believer that NN needs to be preserved.
Without NN on the Internet, Google, Yahoo, Skype, Facebook & any other
startups would not be in existence today. Why? Because without NN, before
proposing a new service on the Internet, you'd need to ask for authorisation to
pump that type of traffic into the Net; and Telcos would have probably said no.
I've been there & done that.</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">- Freedom of Speech</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">Yes, the Internet is the warrant for your freedom.
The day there will be no freedom of speech on the Internet, be afraid; be very
afraid. Examples already abound, so I won't go any further.</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">- Open Standards</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">Do not, I repeat, do not let one vendor, one
company, one organisation provide you with one single product. Monopoly = bad. I
am not prejudiced and am happy using products from the big boys out there, as
much as I also make use of OpenSource. But standards need to be open for
creativity to prevail.</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">- Enough Addressing for everyone</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">Yes, I call this "preserving" enough addresses. And
if there are not enough for future expansion, then find a way to create some. In
other words, move on to IPv6. This really goes onto: "the internet is for
everyone". With limited IPv4 real estate available, trust me, once it gets
costly, the Internet won't be for everyone.</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> <br></div><div><font face="Arial" size="2">- Keep politics out of it</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">The Internet brings people together. It should not
be a political instrument. Of course many disagree with me. Hidden agenda,
anyone? :-)</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">I hope this provides you with a good
starter.</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">Warmest regards,</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">O.</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div><font color="#888888">
<div><font face="Arial" size="2">-- <br>Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond,
Ph.D.<br>E-mail:<<a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com" target="_blank">ocl@gih.com</a>> | <a href="http://www.gih.com/ocl.html" target="_blank">http://www.gih.com/ocl.html</a></font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="2"></font> </div>
</font><blockquote style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(0, 0, 0); padding-right: 0px; padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px;"><div><div></div><div class="Wj3C7c">
<div style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;">----- Original Message ----- </div>
<div style="background: rgb(228, 228, 228) none repeat scroll 0% 50%; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;">
<b>From:</b>
<a title="isolatedn@gmail.com" href="mailto:isolatedn@gmail.com" target="_blank">Sivasubramanian
Muthusamy</a> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>To:</b> <a title="singh@isoc.org" href="mailto:singh@isoc.org" target="_blank">Rajnesh D. Singh</a> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Cc:</b> <a title="chapter-delegates@elists.isoc.org" href="mailto:chapter-delegates@elists.isoc.org" target="_blank">Chapter Delegates</a> </div>
<div style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, September 07, 2008 3:27
PM</div>
<div style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Chapter-delegates] What are
the characteristics of theInternet tobe preserved ?</div>
<div><br></div>
<div dir="ltr">Hello Rajnesh Singh,<br><br>Thank you very much for pointing me
to the right document. <br><br>Also, please take a look at the document
(attached) by Michael Nelson, former Vice President Policy of ISOC presented
at Oxford over two years ago - If this Document entirely goes along with
ISOC's principles, I would like to use it. (Looks like it is, but there is one
section in the document on "Grid" , a discussion that I have not found
anywhere in ISOC.)<br><br>Please guide me.<br><br>Siavasubramanian M.<br><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 6:04 PM, Rajnesh D. Singh <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:singh@isoc.org" target="_blank">singh@isoc.org</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
<div vlink="blue" link="blue" lang="EN-AU">
<div>
<p><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;">Hi
Shiva,</span></font></p>
<p><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;"></span></font> </p>
<p><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;">You may find the
ISOC white paper on UCI of some relevance. Please see:</span></font></p>
<p><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;"><a href="http://www.isoc.org/pubpolpillar/usercentricity/" target="_blank">http://www.isoc.org/pubpolpillar/usercentricity/</a></span></font></p>
<p><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;"></span></font> </p>
<p><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;"></span></font> </p>
<p><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;">Regards,</span></font></p>
<p><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;">R.</span></font></p>
<p><font color="navy" face="Arial" size="2"><span style="font-size: 10pt; color: navy; font-family: Arial;"></span></font> </p>
<div>
<div style="text-align: center;" align="center"><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size: 12pt;" lang="EN-US">
<hr align="center" size="2" width="100%">
</span></font></div>
<p><b><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><span style="font-weight: bold; font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;" lang="EN-US">From:</span></font></b><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma;" lang="EN-US"> <a href="mailto:chapter-delegates-bounces@elists.isoc.org" target="_blank">chapter-delegates-bounces@elists.isoc.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:chapter-delegates-bounces@elists.isoc.org" target="_blank">chapter-delegates-bounces@elists.isoc.org</a>] <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">On Behalf Of </span></b>Sivasubramanian
Muthusamy<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Sunday, 7
September 2008 6:14 AM<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b>
Chapter Delegates<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b>
[Chapter-delegates] What are the characteristics of the Internet tobe
preserved ?</span></font><span lang="EN-US"></span></p></div>
<div>
<div></div>
<div>
<p><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size: 12pt;"></span></font> </p>
<div>
<p><font face="Times New Roman" size="3"><span style="font-size: 12pt;">Hello
All,<br><br>If a venerable veteran of Internet is invited to address a group
of sophomore students on their first day at the Internet Policy and
Governance class, what would he list as the essential characteristics of the
Internet ?<br><i><span style="font-style: italic;"><br>Access? Affordable
Access ? Access without barriers ? Access without discrimination of any kind
? ( What is Internet for All ? ) <br><br>User-Centricity ? (
what is that ? )<br><br>Neutral ? What kind of neutrality ? Neutral of
technical standards ? Neutral of political, religious and social ideologies
? <br><br>freedome ? of speech ? freedom from controls ?<br><br>Unity
(or) a single internetwork ?<br><br>Openness - Open Technical Standards ?
Open to commerce free of barriers ? Open to changes ?</span></i><br><br>What
are the characteristics of the Internet that can be listed together as
features of the Internet that needs to be preserved ?<br><br><br clear="all"><br>-- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy<br>ISOC India Chennai<br><a href="http://isocmadras.blogspot.com" target="_blank">http://isocmadras.blogspot.com</a><br>
<a href="http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy" target="_blank">http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy</a></span></font></p></div></div></div></div></div><br>_______________________________________________<br>
Chapter-delegates
mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Chapter-delegates@elists.isoc.org" target="_blank">Chapter-delegates@elists.isoc.org</a><br><a href="http://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/chapter-delegates" target="_blank">http://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/chapter-delegates</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><a href="http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy" target="_blank">http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy</a><br></div>
</div></div><p>
</p><hr><div class="Ih2E3d">
<p></p>_______________________________________________<br>Chapter-delegates
mailing
list<br><a href="mailto:Chapter-delegates@elists.isoc.org" target="_blank">Chapter-delegates@elists.isoc.org</a><br><a href="http://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/chapter-delegates" target="_blank">http://elists.isoc.org/mailman/listinfo/chapter-delegates</a><br>
</div></blockquote></div>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><a href="http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy">http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy</a><br>
</div>